Where to for Twiggy Rugby?

[Killer]

So my thinking it will be a semi pro type comp but yes less than Super Rugby standard and because of where at in the planning a lot of the leading Force players will jump ship to look at other oz Super Rugby teams or overseas. But regardless it does provide another pathway for WA players and something to build on, and something for WA fans to watch to replace Super Rugby, that could be more over time and moreso post 2020 when current Super Rugby broadcast deal expires.

TBC, but with only six teams to start with there may be greater demand going the other way, to T rugby.
Also unless you are in the top 30 players there is not much chance of a Wallabies spot, there is a lot of bitterness to the ARU, pay will be as good but prob a lot better so why not give it a go for a bit to see the trajectory, it may be great.
Also its new and exciting, interesting/different locations, you will get loyalty from T rugby unlike the ARU, showing loyalty will also show big dividends down the track if this takes off. Getting back into a small comp if you are not world class could be difficult.
The players wanting to play will be from all over the world.
What down side is there in the short term.
This is glass half full but for mine there is not much down side compared to a comp that now only has spots in 4 teams.

 

[Killer]

For all the words of Rebel competition - I doubt it will be a Rebel Competition but will have ARU endorsement as per previous discussions with the ARU in Adelaide where they pledged support for the Force to establish alternative international competition. Seriously why would the ARU be against this given all their eggs are in the Super Rugby dicey basket and someone else is paying for the testing of another international competition that could provide growth for rugby in this country and alternative plan post 2020 (should it succeed).

because they have no control, TF was very clever getting that guarantee at the time. He took advantage of them when they were saying no to everything, they probably thought it would never happen. You watch them try and weasel out of their promise. I thought at the time why are they making such a big deal of that part of the announcement.

 

[Killer]

The ARU and NZRU would kill for someone to come in and spend huge money developing the game and wider interest in Asia. Neither of those unions will ever have the money to do it themselves but will reap the benefits if it happens.


Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

You must think TF is stupid, do you think he hasn't thought this through.

 

[Quick Hands]

Key outliers:

x 6 team comp expanding quickly to 7.
x structure to be announced over the next few days
x teams include parties who have approached in order to be involved
x a "surprise" in that list
x centred on the the population and economic centre of the Indo-Pacific
x Out of respect Force players not yet contacted directly

"I assure you this is a bad day for the ARU, and a great day for Australian Rugby".

Wel, he has the Force on board and I'd imagine he'd find fairly fertile ground in Tonga and Somoa with any sort of funding. You'd also have to think that he'd give Fiji a better deal than the NRC. There's 4 out of 6 already.

 

[Quick Hands]

Representing your country is still a big deal for the majority of top players and if the TF comp doesn't offer that possibility, It's hard to see it securing a big percentage of the top players. Those just interested in money will probably head for Europe.

Still plenty of our good players heading to Europe and Japan instead of waiting around for the possibility of Wallaby call-up. Plus there' now around 35 less "official" professional rugby careers in Aust.

 

[Quick Hands]

Can you imagine the reaction, after ARU rejected Twiggy's Force fund, if they also vetoed his attempt at self funding a comp like this?

It'll be "sanctioned".

The ARU have very little credibility and are in a very weak position. I find it hard to believe that they could/would be able to stop anything.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Wel, he has the Force on board and I'd imagine he'd find fairly fertile ground in Tonga and Somoa with any sort of funding. You'd also have to think that he'd give Fiji a better deal than the NRC. There's 4 out of 6 already.

Tonga and Samoa would not be for financially sustainable options - Fiji maybe - and twiggy would want this thing eventually self financing which would never get with Samoa or Tonga.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Killer]

Tonga and Samoa would not be for financially sustainable options - Fiji maybe - and twiggy would want this thing eventually self financing which would never get with Samoa or Tonga.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, did he mention the Pacific Islands?

He was strong on the our, WA, timezone. So I would think China x 2, Japan x1, Singapore x 1 and ?, maybe China x 3 if Jack Ma is involved(HK, Shanghai, Beijing)
There were plenty of locals playing rugby in Beijing 10yrs ago.

 

[Braveheart81]

You must think TF is stupid, do you think he hasn't thought this through.

I don't think he is.

You are saying it like they he is stealing a gold mine out from under the ARU and NZRU. I think someone spending substantial money on rugby in Asia would be an ideal outcome for both those unions. So much money needs to be spent there before there is the opportunity for the established countries to profit out of it (i.e. by playing test matches there against those countries or others and selling broadcast rights).

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[joeyjohnz]

I don't understand why members of this forum are so... pessimistic about an Indo Pacific comp.

Sri Lanka has twice as many registered Rugby Players as Australia. Their club finals attract upwards of 40 thousand spectators

Singapore has already bid for a Super Rugby franchise. China has as many millionaires as Australian citizens. Hong Kong has a vacant Stadium and has a very large expat community sympathetic to rugby. They're already familiar with the code due to 7's being there for 3 decades now.

Rugby is the premier contact sport in the world. What's not to like? I couldn't care less if the standard is below NRC quality.

We've ended up in this predicament because no one in the ARU can think beyond 2 or 3 year terms. If this is still going in 20 years it's only positive news for Australian Rugby. *
*Although my inner pessimist tells me there'll just be an extra 5 nations that can beat us

 

[Killer]

I don't think he is.

You are saying it like they he is stealing a gold mine out from under the ARU and NZRU. I think someone spending substantial money on rugby in Asia would be an ideal outcome for both those unions. So much money needs to be spent there before there is the opportunity for the established countries to profit out of it (i.e. by playing test matches there against those countries or others and selling broadcast rights).

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

yeah fair enough, I think TF is not in the habit of giving away a hard won advantage.
IMO he clearly worked the ARU to get their promise to help with his new comp. He knew the odds of winning the appeal were slim so he got working on this comp a week ago. He is ahead of the game already, he will eventually work Clyne over.
The Chinese are very big on loyalty and trust, being first man in he will have massive kudos.
He will work very hard to create and maintain important even Govt connections.
He will somehow make this venture pay its way.
On top of that I can't see anytime soon the ARU having plenty of money to usurp his position, if anything with just four teams and idiot directors they will be broke.
TF has so much good will already and he hasn't even started.

 

[Quick Hands]

Tonga and Samoa would not be for financially sustainable options - Fiji maybe - and twiggy would want this thing eventually self financing which would never get with Samoa or Tonga.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The teams don't have to play in those places - the teams can be based in Sydney or Brisbane.

EDIT: Just like the West Indies played World Series Cricket in Australia

 

[Quick Hands]

Yeah, did he mention the Pacific Islands?

He was strong on the our, WA, timezone. So I would think China x 2, Japan x1, Singapore x 1 and ?, maybe China x 3 if Jack Ma is involved(HK, Shanghai, Beijing)
There were plenty of locals playing rugby in Beijing 10yrs ago.

He mentioned Indo-Pacific - so I'd assume that would include islands in the Pacific? (not necessarily as a location for a team to play - I'm talking players and coaches from those areas, based in Australia)

 

[Killer]

This from TWF, VP RugbyWA, hope he doesn't mind.

All,
So sorry we didn't get this avcross the line today. A long shitty day topped off by watching Clyne lie again and again about our failure to respond. Twiggy was very compelling when he adressed us and the players in private after the press conference. He's thought this through,has other massive financial backers and has promised the team and the staff he will support them.
In a weird way I'm getting my head around the simple fact that we simply don't matter to the ARU and we have stop trying to hold on to something that was probably only temporary anyway. The interest we have received from Asian RFU's to get on Andrews bandwagon has been quite stunning and that is in one afternoon. Tomorrow is another day. I'm going to find my Teddy and go to bed now.

 

[ForceFan]

Loving this development.
In order to get the Indo-Pacific comp going only the Force will be from Australia AND it WILL be limited to only 6 teams with each playing the others X2.
The really exciting development is the game against the "International Team". Can't wait for that announcement and it's sure to be a surprise.

 

[Omar Comin']

My guess for the 6 would be, in order of confidence:

Force
Asia-Pacific Dragons (Singapore)
Fiji
Hong Kong
Panasonic Wild Knights
Chinese team

Doubt that'll be exactly right. I think that a 2nd Australian based team would be desirable, but whatever the case I just hope they stick to a 3 or 4 hour time zone range.

Given this tournament would only go for 10 weeks plus finals you'd think the Force would also look to play other fixtures during the season. They could invite well matched teams to Perth for stand alone 3 game series for example.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

My guess for the 6 would be, in order of confidence:

Force
Asia-Pacific Dragons (Singapore)
Fiji
Hong Kong
Panasonic Wild Knights
Chinese team

Doubt that'll be exactly right. The fact it's being labelled Indo-Pacific, and not Asia-Pacific makes me think there's a reasonable possibility of a South African team. I think they'd be better to stick to a 3 or 4 hour time zone range and that a 2nd Australian based team would be desirable.

Given this tournament would only go for 10 weeks plus finals you'd think the Force would also look to play other fixtures during the season. They could invite well matched teams to Perth for stand alone 3 game series for example.

Yes will be interesting to see how long planned Comp will run for as if only 10 weeks plus finals we are definitely talking semi pro and with the travel makes it hard for me to see how this could work. Of course I would like to see it work so I guess a case of waiting to see more details.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Omar Comin']

Yes will be interesting to see how long planned Comp will run for as if only 10 weeks plus finals we are definitely talking semi pro and with the travel makes it hard for me to see how this could work. Of course I would like to see it work so I guess a case of waiting to see more details.

It could easily be fully professional if teams have other fixtures or competitions in their seasons. And that may not even really be necessary (consider that Super 12 was professional and there were only 11 regular season matches for each team - though Super Rugby has always been subsidised by test rugby).

But most, if not all of the teams in this Indo-Pacific tournament could play a number of other fixtures or separate tournaments during the year.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

It could easily be fully professional if teams have other fixtures or competitions in their seasons. And that may not even really be necessary (consider that Super 12 was professional and there were only 11 regular season matches for each team - though Super Rugby has always been subsidised by test rugby).

But most, if not all of the teams in this Indo-Pacific tournament could play a number of other fixtures or separate tournaments during the year.

I suspect regardless will see some Force players move on over next few days as they will need to look after their own interests and families. As the new Indo Comp will take time to work
Out including whether players who play for it will be eligible for wallaby selection which far from clear from this point. Daily telegraph saying no way players who play for the rebel league will ARU allow them to be eligible for wallabies. I don't get this rebel bit as I really would have thought the ARU would support someone setting up indo pacific comp and paying for this investment in this region given neither ARU or nzru have funds to make this sort of investment. I would like to see the word rebel removed and see this as an ARU endorsed league the force participate in.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rugbynutter39]

This from TWF, VP RugbyWA, hope he doesn't mind.

All,
So sorry we didn't get this avcross the line today. A long shitty day topped off by watching Clyne lie again and again about our failure to respond. Twiggy was very compelling when he adressed us and the players in private after the press conference. He's thought this through,has other massive financial backers and has promised the team and the staff he will support them.
In a weird way I'm getting my head around the simple fact that we simply don't matter to the ARU and we have stop trying to hold on to something that was probably only temporary anyway. The interest we have received from Asian RFU's to get on Andrews bandwagon has been quite stunning and that is in one afternoon. Tomorrow is another day. I'm going to find my Teddy and go to bed now.

'Massive other financial backers' - now I am excited.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk