Where to for Super Rugby?

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yet we were quite happy to sign up to a global competition over 5 continents, different Time-zones, languages & individual countries interests.

The biggest issue with a National Club Competition is 1)determining which clubs are involved and 2)convincing the clubs that miss out as to why they aren't involved. All of which will set proceedings off. For it to even be an option you'd have to guarantee the involvement of Perth, Melbourne and Canberra and then you have to convince the Sydney and Brisbane clubs of an equitable split.

A big part of selecting teams would be on competitiveness but another element would have to be branding and potential drawing power. Which may very well not align with one another.

 

[RebelYell]

The biggest issue with a National Club Competition is 1)determining which clubs are involved and 2)convincing the clubs that miss out as to why they aren't involved. All of which will set proceedings off. For it to even be an option you'd have to guarantee the involvement of Perth, Melbourne and Canberra and then you have to convince the Sydney and Brisbane clubs of an equitable split.

A big part of selecting teams would be on competitiveness but another element would have to be branding and potential drawing power. Which may very well not align with one another.

If we feel like we've hit peak politics in Australian Rugby, wait until we introduce a national Club competition which sees big teams in QLD/NSW fail to qualify (results, or administrative selection) and sees professional players switching Clubs willy nilly. Will be unbearable...

 

[Number 7]

The biggest issue with a National Club Competition is 1)determining which clubs are involved and 2)convincing the clubs that miss out as to why they aren't involved. All of which will set proceedings off. For it to even be an option you'd have to guarantee the involvement of Perth, Melbourne and Canberra and then you have to convince the Sydney and Brisbane clubs of an equitable split.

A big part of selecting teams would be on competitiveness but another element would have to be branding and potential drawing power. Which may very well not align with one another.

Yes it couldn't work like that without pretty significant sacrifices being made.

The alternative is you have a round of local club rugby to qualify for a national comp of some sort which allocates more slots to NSW/QLD. The problem will then become how do you fit it in the diary unless the national comp is short and sweet.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yes it couldn't work like that without pretty significant sacrifices being made.

The alternative is you have a round of local club rugby to qualify for a national comp of some sort which allocates more slots to NSW/QLD. The problem will then become how do you fit it in the diary unless the national comp is short and sweet.

That's an option. Would likely require the club seasons at least from a Sydney and Brisbane perspective effectively split in two. The first being a single round robin to qualifiers and a the second being the national competition featuring say 5 from Sydney, 4 from Brisbane, 2 from Canberra and a rep squad from Melbourne and Perth.

For the rest not involved there could be some kind of state Cup structure introduced. So from a NSW perspective you would have the remaining 6 or 7 (dependent on whether they go ahead with 11 or 12 teams.) add in the likes of the Wildfires, Illawarriors etc.

 

[Braveheart81]

Whatever we come up with we need to maximise the number of games where we have our best players playing in the most marketable teams in the highest quality competition.

If the total number of matches playable in a year is around 30 and close to half of that is test matches I don't think you can afford to have test players running around in club rugby. It might make for a bit of a feel good moment but it is a poor use of money because that player is being paid a shitload to run around paying park footy.

 

[Rebels3]

Why dont we have the Super sides play against the top club sides in a FA Cup style knockout?

Top 4 from Sydney and Bris qualify, 1 from WA, VIC and ACT.

You could have a season with SRAU, then a champions league comp with all the 5 teams (+ whatever other nations) then this played during the test season (and at the end of the local comps). Randomly drawn out of a hat, and how exciting for the players and club to host a Super Rugby team. If the draw worked out for someone they could make a final, would be huge for them. Could be the connection they are looking for between the two, its also short and sweet and relatively cheap.

 

[Wilson]

Why dont we have the Super sides play against the top club sides in a FA Cup style knockout?

Top 4 from Sydney and Bris qualify, 1 from WA, VIC and ACT.

You could have a season with SRAU, then a champions league comp with all the 5 teams (+ whatever other nations) then this played during the test season.

I don't think you can do an FA cup style knockout that brings full time pros in the super sides up against amateurs in the club sides, there's a huge safety risk that could see it all go horribly wrong.

The only way I can see an FA cup style competition safely working is if it's only the club sides, which isn't a terrible idea. It gives the club sides the national exposure they're after and could help lift the Canberra, Perth and Melbourne club comps up.

 

[Rebels3]

I don't think you can do an FA cup style knockout that brings full time pros in the super sides up against amateurs in the club sides, there's a huge safety risk that could see it all go horribly wrong.

The only way I can see an FA cup style competition safely working is if it's only the club sides, which isn't a terrible idea. It gives the club sides the national exposure they're after and could help lift the Canberra, Perth and Melbourne club comps up.

At the level directly below there is no safety issue. Most of these teams are made up of prospective pros, current pros or people that have been semi-pro/pro at some stage.

Most the Super Rugby squad players drop to these teams when not selected on a week in week out basis. We saw Argentina vs Randwick, the Super Rugby teams wouldnt even be Argentina level.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yes it couldn't work like that without pretty significant sacrifices being made.

The alternative is you have a round of local club rugby to qualify for a national comp of some sort which allocates more slots to NSW/QLD. The problem will then become how do you fit it in the diary unless the national comp is short and sweet.

Not to mention the piles of cash it would require to bring all of these teams up to professional quality.

 

[Wilson]

At the level directly below there is no safety issue. Most of these teams are made up of prospective pros, current pros or people that have been semi-pro/pro at some stage.

Most the Super Rugby squad players drop to these teams when not selected on a week in week out basis.

I'm not so sure about that, when you look at individual match ups it's probably ok but scrum vs scrum the imbalance is amplified. Particularly if you have say a Melbourne side successful off the back of a very good back line with only a middling scrum (for that competition) coming up against a full pro scrum. It is notable this style of competition isn't being run by the other rugby nations more suited to it.

I'm also not so sure there's anything to be gained from a few more games of Reds v Brumbies, Rebels v Waratahs, etc.

 

[barbarian]

An issue I've found with SuperAU: I don't really care who wins and loses. I'm a Tahs fan, and while I cheer for them I'm not that angry when they lose. The comp doesn't have a huge amount of meaning for me, and I enjoy the rugby but it seems a bit like an extended Wallaby trial series. I just want to see good rugby.

When you have the Kiwis in there, I genuinely want to beat them. I cheer for sides to win. At the moment I'm just sitting back enjoying the rugby, but my pulse doesn't really get up in the last 20 if the game is close.

I worry a local comp will have that problem. The games will be nice enough, but will we really care who wins? Will there be that tribal element? It's almost impossible to manufacture.
.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

An issue I've found with SuperAU: I don't really care who wins and loses. I'm a Tahs fan, and while I cheer for them I'm not that angry when they lose. The comp doesn't have a huge amount of meaning for me, and I enjoy the rugby but it seems a bit like an extended Wallaby trial series. I just want to see good rugby.

When you have the Kiwis in there, I genuinely want to beat them. I cheer for sides to win. At the moment I'm just sitting back enjoying the rugby, but my pulse doesn't really get up in the last 20 if the game is close.

I worry a local comp will have that problem. The games will be nice enough, but will we really care who wins? Will there be that tribal element? It's almost impossible to manufacture.
.

Really? Because while I hold a degree of dislike of the NZ franchises and certainly want to beat them when it comes to teams that I actively 'hate' and want to see the Tahs beat are the other Australian sides. The Reds and the Brumbies in particular. The competition has felt far more relevant and worthwhile.

 

[dru]

I'm happy for the tribalism versus NZ to happen with the ABs.

One thing I am genuinely saddened by is I had always intended to follow the Reds across RSA on an African campaign. Won't happen now. Would have loved to watch the Reds on the Hiveldt and in Cape Town. It's just so impractical as a club comp unfortunately.

I do like playing the Kiwi clubs, and certainly recognise the value it brings, but not with the issues I see currently.

I think a champions league would be good though.

 

[sendit]

An issue I've found with SuperAU: I don't really care who wins and loses. I'm a Tahs fan, and while I cheer for them I'm not that angry when they lose. The comp doesn't have a huge amount of meaning for me, and I enjoy the rugby but it seems a bit like an extended Wallaby trial series. I just want to see good rugby.

When you have the Kiwis in there, I genuinely want to beat them. I cheer for sides to win. At the moment I'm just sitting back enjoying the rugby, but my pulse doesn't really get up in the last 20 if the game is close.

I worry a local comp will have that problem. The games will be nice enough, but will we really care who wins? Will there be that tribal element? It's almost impossible to manufacture.
.

100% agree with this, while i have my preferences with Aussie teams i'm very happy to sit back and watch a good aussie derby and not really care who wins - It's essentially trial games for wallaby selections in my eyes

 

[drewprint]

Really? Because while I hold a degree of dislike of the NZ franchises and certainly want to beat them when it comes to teams that I actively 'hate' and want to see the Tahs beat are the other Australian sides. The Reds and the Brumbies in particular. The competition has felt far more relevant and worthwhile.

I used to be like this. Beating the Waratahs was a huge priority. But then our overall standards slipped and each of the Aus rugby franchises started losing every single bloody game to the Kiwis. With this national slide, I began cheering for the Tahs, Brumbies, ANYONE, to beat the Kiwis. As an example, I definitely wanted the Reds to beat the Waratahs the other week, but I didn’t want to spank them. I wanted a tough, exciting game where the Tahs shined (just not quite as much as the Reds). I think I’m an Australian rugby fan first, and a Reds fan second.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I used to be like this. Beating the Waratahs was a huge priority. But then our overall standards slipped and each of the Aus rugby franchises started losing every single bloody game to the Kiwis. With this national slide, I began cheering for the Tahs, Brumbies, ANYONE, to beat the Kiwis. As an example, I definitely wanted the Reds to beat the Waratahs the other week, but I didn’t want to spank them. I wanted a tough, exciting game where the Tahs shined (just not quite as much as the Reds). I think I’m an Australian rugby fan first, and a Reds fan second.

I compartmentalise my support. At the Test level I'm an Australian Rugby fan first and foremost. But at Super level I've always been a Tahs fan and it's always been more about beating our teams first. Followed by any other Aus team beating the Brumbies before NZ teams even come into the equation. The only NZ team that even comes into the 'hate' consideration at that level are the Crusaders.

The perspective of looking at it like a trial series says a lot about how things have been structured here for too long. Super Rugby has always been just that in terms of how the Unions have approached it. That needs to change. Which I think a domestic competition would go a long way to doing.

 

[sendit]

The perspective of looking at it like a trial series says a lot about how things have been structured here for too long. Super Rugby has always been just that in terms of how the Unions have approached it. That needs to change. Which I think a domestic competition would go a long way to doing.

it just comes down to

1) the season not being long enough for me to get truly invested in, there's a reason NRL and AFL seasons are longer than ours
2) SA and Arg involvement - Just don't care when we are playing them and my team fucks off for 3-4 weeks and i don't want to get up in the middle of the night to watch them
3) We never really have more than one super competitive team at a time

None of this changes by having a weird manufactured domestic league

Edit: To be fair it probably does but there's so many negatives that result from it too

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Followed by any other Aus team beating the Brumbies

The only NZ team that even comes into the 'hate' consideration at that level are the Crusaders.

 

[Bobby Sands]

If we feel like we've hit peak politics in Australian Rugby, wait until we introduce a national Club competition which sees big teams in QLD/NSW fail to qualify (results, or administrative selection) and sees professional players switching Clubs willy nilly. Will be unbearable.

Two tiers, with promotion/relegation will have to be the way I think.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Two tiers, with promotion/relegation will have to be the way I think.

How will it be funded? I mean I'm not against the idea but it would require a huge influx of capital. More so than any other model I suspect.