Where to for Super Rugby?

[Dan54]

I‘lll summarise the missing 20 pages:

Australian Fans: ”We want a domestic competition where our teams are competitive”
Kiwi Fans: “You don‘t know what you want, this is what you want, LMAO”

-repeat-

May well of summed it up somewhat Adam

 

[Dismal Pillock]

I‘lll summarise the missing 20 pages

 

[Dismal Pillock]

 

[Adam84]

Whilst Marinos labelled suggestions of the format as 'premature', he was hopeful it would be confirmed in the coming days.

“It was a little premature in my view. We’re still working on the detail but it’s fair to say we’re pretty progressed and quite close to finalise that,” he said.

“As it’s been communicated, hopefully we can confirm from our side in the next couple of days.

“I think the challenges around the Rugby Championship and finalising the schedule have taken priority over the last 72 hours.”


“It’s fair to say it’s been a long and protractive process. We’ve both came to the table with very different models and philosophies but we’ve consistently worked through the options,” he admitted.

“We’ve always got to keep in mind the importance of delivering on those high performance imperatives and obviously having a product in a market that will grow value over time.

“I think what we’ve agreed to over the next two years, we’ve got a model that we can consider and will continue to be open-minded and look at alternatives if we believe that those will deliver a different and better outcome going forward.

Marinos, RA hopeful of confirming Super Rugby format

RA CEO Andy Marinos is optimistic the Super Rugby format for 2022 and beyond will be confirmed in the coming days following the announcement of the TRC schedule.

www.rugby.com.au

 

[hifflepiff]

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

The one glimmer of hope is that Marinos has indicated that RA would be open to heading in a new direction in two years if (when) this format doesn't work. Hopefully, there's someone with vision inside the organisation, and this agreement gives them some time to potentially get their ducks in a row for a bigger and better Super AU.

That said, I long ago stopped putting any hope in RA's ability to grow the sport in this country.

 

[Adam84]

Yes I do to, but I definitely feel that they’re starting to see the value in disrupting the norm and innovating new ideas. Stepping away from Foxtel into Nine was huge, as to was bringing the Force back and some of the RC, B&I Lions hosting ideas. Some of these were done out of necessity, but they also delivered fantastic results.

 

[Quick Hands]

 

[Quick Hands]

Disappointing, but not unexpected.

The one glimmer of hope is that Marinos has indicated that RA would be open to heading in a new direction in two years if (when) this format doesn't work. Hopefully, there's someone with vision inside the organisation, and this agreement gives them some time to potentially get their ducks in a row for a bigger and better Super AU.

That said, I long ago stopped putting any hope in RA's ability to grow the sport in this country.

 

[Quick Hands]

Yep bang on Adam, it doesn't take much to see that league have targeted PIs. Guess we need to get more games etc played there to promote the game in that region.

League will fill any vacuum which rugby leaves in the islands, just as league is attracting many PI boys by offering opportunity. 9 professional RL teams based in Sydney for these kids to play for against 1 pro rugby team.

 

[Dan54]

League will fill any vacuum which rugby leaves in the islands, just as league is attracting many PI boys by offering opportunity. 9 professional RL teams based in Sydney for these kids to play for against 1 pro rugby team.

Good point QH, not sure what the answer is, would actually be good if there was a moana Pasifika team set up in Sydney wouldn't it. Not advocating it by any means, just kind of dreaming as there is certainly nor the figures to do it, just in some kind of dream world it would be great to have Moana Pasifika Aus or something playing out of Western Sydney.

Ok ok, 10 days in stage 4 lockdown brain is wandering

 

[wamberal]

League will fill any vacuum which rugby leaves in the islands, just as league is attracting many PI boys by offering opportunity. 9 professional RL teams based in Sydney for these kids to play for against 1 pro rugby team.

League has been offering opportunities for islander kids for many, many, years. Forget about the NRL, have a look at the number of pro and semi-pro clubs at lower levels. Squillions of the buggers. Nothing new in this. BTW, I am talking about islander kids being imported from the islands.

 

[Pfitzy]

League has been offering opportunities for islander kids for many, many, years. Forget about the NRL, have a look at the number of pro and semi-pro clubs at lower levels. Squillions of the buggers. Nothing new in this.

But shrinking as well. A number of those lower level competitions and clubs are left to run wild in a lot of cases, with the ebb and flow of cash injections leaving them roosters one year, feather dusters the next.

The women's game offers a respite e.g. the local junior league club we shared facilities with this year have 50+ girls in U18, U16, and 2 x U14 sides.

Good administration and boundaries are the key. Investing in how the competition is set up and run, rather than just letting the guys with the most cash win, is paramount.

 

[Quick Hands]

Last year, the world-renowned sports consultancy group, Gemba Group, urged Australian Rugby to forget the Kiwis and go it alone. The Gemba Group has worked with Formula One, Cricket Australia, FIFA, Tennis Australia and the NRL on their commercial and broadcast rights.
Gemba’s founder, Rob Mills, made two things crystal clear in his report. First, he said the old-school Super Rugby format had Australian rugby fans turning off in droves. In fact, since 2013, there has been a 43 per cent audience decline and it’s a frightening 73 per cent in the 16 to 39 demographic.

Second, Mills said Super Rugby did not strengthen the Wallabies. Our win rate was 68 per cent when Super Rugby first started and, since then, it’s been a steady downward trend. The Wallabies’ win rate is now 45 per cent.

Rob Mills suggested that Rugby Australia look at the English Premiership, which is a 12-team domestic competition. He points out that the English model broadens the depth of professional players and, therefore, creates better Test match performances. Mills suggested Australian rugby should encourage private investors to support a vibrant local domestic system so that Rugby Australia could focus on Wallaby pathways.

The bit in bold is the answer, as I have long argued for.

 

[Quick Hands]

League has been offering opportunities for islander kids for many, many, years. Forget about the NRL, have a look at the number of pro and semi-pro clubs at lower levels. Squillions of the buggers. Nothing new in this. BTW, I am talking about islander kids being imported from the islands.

But there's also plenty of boys of island descent who have been born in Australia playing both codes of rugby. Family ties are strong, and while it's not the only issue the opportunity to play professional sport and be in the same city as extended family is significant. As a sport we can't develop to our full extent with only one professional team in Sydney.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I really am surprised RA is dropping Super Rugby Au. As I get doing TT but I would have thought given past super rugby model for last decade and now TT from last season has not proven a successful model to support oz rugby fan retention let alone growth, I would have thought foot in both camps would be better approach. Ie. I thought at the minimum they could accommodate a six nations style Super rugby AU one round competition with no finals and then do TT. Just seems strange to go all in on TT given not proven model and had some success with super rugby Au. Not sure I understand the thinking here as surely could have at least accommodated a single one round super rugby AU with no finals.

 

[Dan54]

I really am surprised RA is dropping Super Rugby Au. As I get doing TT but I would have thought given past super rugby model for last decade and now TT from last season has not proven a successful model to support oz rugby fan retention let alone growth, I would have thought foot in both camps would be better approach. Ie. I thought at the minimum they could accommodate a six nations style Super rugby AU one round competition with no finals and then do TT. Just seems strange to go all in on TT given not proven model and had some success with super rugby Au. Not sure I understand the thinking here as surely could have at least accommodated a single one round super rugby AU with no finals.

I know you suggested the one round Au model before RN, it made a bit of sense to me then and still does, I know what you mean about a foot in both camps stand and I think would work as well for NZ. If you follow it with a 1 round TT comp all teams would then play a derby match at home during year, either in the Au or AO for whichever country and make then can finish it in TT. I see a lot of sense in it (which may mean that it's a dumb idea of course)

 

[hoggy]

Last year, the world-renowned sports consultancy group, Gemba Group, urged Australian Rugby to forget the Kiwis and go it alone. The Gemba Group has worked with Formula One, Cricket Australia, FIFA, Tennis Australia and the NRL on their commercial and broadcast rights.
Gemba’s founder, Rob Mills, made two things crystal clear in his report. First, he said the old-school Super Rugby format had Australian rugby fans turning off in droves. In fact, since 2013, there has been a 43 per cent audience decline and it’s a frightening 73 per cent in the 16 to 39 demographic.

Second, Mills said Super Rugby did not strengthen the Wallabies. Our win rate was 68 per cent when Super Rugby first started and, since then, it’s been a steady downward trend. The Wallabies’ win rate is now 45 per cent.

Rob Mills suggested that Rugby Australia look at the English Premiership, which is a 12-team domestic competition. He points out that the English model broadens the depth of professional players and, therefore, creates better Test match performances. Mills suggested Australian rugby should encourage private investors to support a vibrant local domestic system so that Rugby Australia could focus on Wallaby pathways.

The bit in bold is the answer, as I have long argued for.

Don't agree with everything he says, but Alan Jones this morning in the Australian mentions that report and says it is crazy Australia is not gong it alone, amongst all this crap over the last few weeks right smack in the middle a full TT is announced, it beggars belief how weak it makes RA look. I can only assume that they are so broke that without agreeing to a TT, that the game here would be bankrupt in 2022

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I know you suggested the one round Au model before RN, it made a bit of sense to me then and still does, I know what you mean about a foot in both camps stand and I think would work as well for NZ. If you follow it with a 1 round TT comp all teams would then play a derby match at home during year, either in the Au or AO for whichever country and make then can finish it in TT. I see a lot of sense in it (which may mean that it's a dumb idea of course)

Yeh I just don't understand why they would give it up entirely when you could accommodate it and keep it as your insurance policy as well - ie in case TT goes pear shaped...whilst also something to build on (Super Rugby Au) for domestic product - and indeed trial other things (e.g. rules, off field entertainment, marketing) which could leverage for other potential domestic products on the horizon/future e.g NRC. Seems crazy to drop it completely as would have multiple different benefits as per above for what could be small window of time needed.

 

[Dan54]

And as I said RN, I think it would suit both countries!

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Don't agree with everything he says, but Alan Jones this morning in the Australian mentions that report and says it is crazy Australia is not gong it alone, amongst all this crap over the last few weeks right smack in the middle a full TT is announced, it beggars belief how weak it makes RA look. I can only assume that they are so broke that without agreeing to a TT, that the game here would be bankrupt in 2022

I certainly can understand why RA would not abandon TT at this point but equally don't see why they would completely abandon Super Rugby AU cutdown version as if they kept as I have advocated a small single round only Super Rugby AU competition alongside TT competition the risk profile would be less. From a risk management and portfolio perspective it just seems crazy that completely abandoning at least cutdown version of super rugby AU since showed some signs of success whist super rugby and TT last season been a failure and in terminal decline, and successful TT model yet to be proven. I think this is a massive error of judgement by RA if this is the case as to my mind surely could do both (accepting yes need to do TT but accommodate cutdown super rugby single round competition).