Waratahs vs Cheetahs Super Rugby-R5 2013

[I like to watch]

About that 150k was that before or after izzy?

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Most of his contract is ARU top up.

 

[Hawko]

5 weeks ago the tahs had a squad tipped to make a real play at winning the comp under the all powerful cheika. Now 1 win from 4 and you start to say he is stuck with a squad he didnt pick or want? What more do you guys want?? You have a team full of wallabies some even on the bench or not even making the 22 i just dont get it.

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The knowledgable Tah fans NEVER said that. We always knew that this was a year too early, especially given the problems the Lions tour will bring that haven't even started to happen yet. Lots of jeering Reds and Brumbies fans said that but their opinion of the Tahs is coloured by their fanglasses.

I would keep Ulugia, Kepu and perhaps Chapman and McCutcheon as well.

Kepu is problematic because we are desperately short of good scrummaging THP's. Chapman will need to improve a lot to hold on but I would definitely keep Ulugia and McCutcheon. I'd also keep Palu if possible, though I think he'll go overseas to top up his superannuation.

 

[Moono75]

He can't move them on until their contract expires.
Kearns made the point on the Rugby Club that Foley spent all but $150kof the salary cap before he fucked off.
So Cheika could hardly recruit a core of players that would thrive under his coaching.

Kearns speaks a lot of shit to be quite frank and is a Tahs apologist.

Tahs were looking to bone Foley, they were uncomittal on his future, he sensed this and instigated a move for himself and what was best for his future. Yes i'm sure Foley had final say on all the Tahs expenditure. The Tahs board and ingrained culture might have had something to do with it. The Tahs lack of performance has overlapped many coaches...and if the coach is the problem, then perhaps the board needs to go for their lack of due dilegence in coaching appointments.

 

[Slim 293]

Most of his contract is ARU top up.

The ARU are getting their money's worth so far.........

 

[Hawko]

The ARU are getting their money's worth so far...

Absolutely right Slim, though I suspect you posted with a heavy dose of irony. He's been good value publicity-wise since he came over in a PR desert and that's raised the profile. But you began to see tonight that he has got huge potential. Some of the things he did tonight were exceptional while there were still some terrible plays to balance it. Its his fourth game of Super Rugby and it shows, but the week on week improvement you are seeing will make him hard to leave out of the Wallaby squad later in the year, though probably not for the Lions. That is dependant on his continued improvement, week by week. But I saw enough tonight to know he has lots of potential and that he has come a long way in a short time.

 

[Moono75]

How could Foley coach a win against the Tahs?
He proved for 2 or 3 years he was blind to all their weaknesses.

.....maybe the weakness was the Tahs players themselves....not good enough.....not playing up to their potential.....now....past their potential. The team born with a silver spoon in their mouths but trading it in year in year out for a wooden spoon (figurativley speaking).

 

[Slim 293]

Absolutely right Slim, though I suspect you posted with a heavy dose of irony. He's been good value publicity-wise since he came over in a PR desert and that's raised the profile. But you began to see tonight that he has got huge potential. Some of the things he did tonight were exceptional while there were still some terrible plays to balance it. Its his fourth game of Super Rugby and it shows, but the week on week improvement you are seeing will make him hard to leave out of the Wallaby squad later in the year, though probably not for the Lions. That is dependant on his continued improvement, week by week. But I saw enough tonight to know he has lots of potential and that he has come a long way in a short time.

Publicity wise he's just filled in newspaper space that would've already been used to talk about rugby, and his profile has hardly grown the game anywhere........

Outside of NSW people are still saying "Israel who?"

So who are the Wallabies going to drop to make way for this supposed potential?

Lets wait and see if he's still playing rugby by the end of the year........

 

[Forcefield]

He can't move them on until their contract expires.
Kearns made the point on the Rugby Club that Foley spent all but $150kof the salary cap before he fucked off.
So Cheika could hardly recruit a core of players that would thrive under his coaching.

Kearns is smoking crack. The Waratahs have a squad with 15 Wallabies. Guys like Ben Volavola, Peter Betham and Tom Kingston would be snapped up by the Force or Rebels. Cheika inherited a very decent squad. It sucks a bit that there are some frequently injured players like Palu, Horne, Fitzpatrick, Mitchell and Barnes, but few people would argue with those recruiting decisions. You could use some better scrum-halves and better reserve hookers but what else could you do with the squad to improve it. And who exactly could Cheika have recruited to those positions anyway? Michael Cheika is a fucking idiot if he thinks it good management to say he would give six of his players the flick if he could. Even if it was said in private, it has now gone public.

The predicament the Waratahs find themselves in is not Foley's fault. Foley didn't have the final say in recruiting decisions. And lets face it- Foley would have been fired if he hadn't left. So if you are going to fire him, why let him have that much input into recruiting decisions? He makes a great scapegoat for an organisation that loves scapegoats, doesn't he?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Ran into Waratahjesus and he is OK

Thats not good by his standards

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Well done Tahs much better than last week I thought!

Cant see it myself.
Unlike the Cheetahs of last week this was a tired team there to be beaten. They were out on their feet at half time.
The lower standard of the opposition means that any improvement in the look of the Tahs was just that: the appearance of improvement but not the fact of it.
All of the Tahs' tall timber are going into contact far too high: clarke's first call of the match was "Timani too high". This is pretty fundamental under the use it or lose it laws. I think that going in too high leads to the arriving players being too concerned about avoiding a maul turnover, and very often means the maul is static (at best) or going backwards putting pressure on the next phase.
Solution: aim for your opponents knees when running with the ball.
Dennis and McCutcheon are one paced: maybe thats not so important for #8 but Dennis doesnt seem to me to be offering whole lot in any aspect of the game. I like the bloke and dont think dropping him would be good for the team so the solution may involve McCutcheon - but i dont know enough about the available talent. I would be giving A J Gilbert a look in on the basis that he offers some dynamism that these 2 lack. If I read correctly Dennis' suggestion he did not want to play at 8 then that is a huge worry - most backrowers kill for the chance to play 8 because of the greater opportunities it gives in attack. Shying away from it is indicative of a defeatist attitude to attack - from the skipper!
The Tahs need a clause in the playing contracts that anyone who chip or grubber kicks may have their contract terminated at the coach's discretion.
McKibbin is unconvincing - he seems unable to throw an accurate pass in general play let alone under pressure - but is there a presently available reliable alternative? If there is i dont think that goal kicking is the Tahs present issue and i would NOT be sacrificing anything in terms of general playing ability and options in order to have a, so called, reliable goal kicker.
Turner had a real go tonight - in fact his passing for few phases at half was better than McKibbin's.
As ever the fundamentals are the problem.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

qwerty51 are you a medical practitioner?
Most of the blokes you want to keep have their own expense code inside the Medicare department.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

If this is true then the same must apply to the Highlanders who lost to the Cheetahs last week. People should not under-rate the Cheetahs; they will always lose to teams like the Saders, Stormers, Sharks, Brumbies and the Chiefs but I reckon on their day they can beat anyone else.

There was real improvement from some tonight and there were a couple of real developing stars. But we won't make the finals this year, if you listen carefully to Cheika he doesn't think they will either. But by the end of this season we'll be ready to have a red-hot go next year.

waratahjesus? Are you in there?

 

[Torn Hammy]

Looking at the stats of the game you would have to give credit to the Cheetahs scrambling defence. They were flogged in line breaks, metres gained, number of runs, and balls won from rucks. Their defence was very good.

What I noticed however, was the very poor support for the man with the ball when a break or half break was made.

The problem came in two parts. First, the forwards weren't playing as a pack. It was if they didn't know who was going to truck it up, and if the a break was made, they were too wide rather than deep when providing support. This type of support requires longer lateral passes in traffic to promote the ball, which explains the high mistake rate and low try rate per break/half break. Second, where the hell was the transition from forwards to backs. There were some really solid breaks made and rather than a back instinctively appearing in support and getting the ball wide to the fast boys, the guy making the break time and again had to hold up the ball and wait for supporting forwards, thus losing the advantage of a rare line break. This lack of support from the backs is just inexcusable and makes my blood boil.

 

[Ruggo]

Lots of bitching about the Tahs on this thread. Just one question to Tah fans having a bitch? (not by a long shot is it even the majority of them) Who of you actually went to the game last night to support your boys? That crowd was depressing for the Tahs and it was depressing for Australian Rugby. They mind of well played the game in a grave yard.

It looked like the Tahs really had a crack at improvement under their new system and apart from the loss it looked to have many positives. The Tahs are nowhere near as fickle as their so called fan base. As Ghandi said "Be the change you want to see", so get off your arses and go and support the boys.

Compare them to the Force fans who come in droves consistantly despite the lack of on field success to support their team with a shitload of heart. Not a big Force fan personally but their fans certainly have my respect

 

[mjw]

Cheika inherited a very decent squad.
The predicament the Waratahs find themselves in is not Foley's fault.

You seem to forget they lost 8 in a row under Foley. Do you not think he has some major share of the blame?

 

[mjw]

Lots of bitching about the Tahs on this thread. Just one question to Tah fans having a bitch? (not by a long shot is it even the majority of them) Who of you actually went to the game last night to support your boys? That crowd was depressing for the Tahs and it was depressing for Australian Rugby. They mind of well played the game in a grave yard.

Yeah, I was at the game and it was no graveyard. Crowd was right with them until the end. Disappointed of course but right there with them.

 

[daz]

Exaplanation:

There weren't that many people in attendance at the game...poor crowd figures, especially given the population of NSW and status as a rugby State.. Obviously rugby on a Friday is Sydney rates below cleaning the toilet at your own home whilst Face Booking how great cleaning your toilet is on a Friday night.

Cheika has been talked up massivley in the press and so far the Tahs still look like..well the same old Tahs. Foley has been blamed for everything that is probalby systematically bad in NSW rugby.

Maybe the Tahs will kick on and do something for the rest of the year but with the resources you have.seriously someone should be fired.

I don't care what anyone says; it takes a special kind of person to bag a team that is currently performing better than his own.

Everyone else seems to get that Cheika (and even Foley FFS) are playing with someone else's squad. But it's round 4 and you are thanking God for Foley. No wins, mind you, but let's not worry about that little statistic.

Seriously?

 

[daz]

Guys like Ben Volavola, Peter Betham and Tom Kingston would be snapped up by the Force or Rebels.

That bit of snapping has been and gone already. Melbourne Rebels in 2011 for 8 caps.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Only a f----- point but just sad for Tahs fans. every supporter wants their team to win. F--k all has changed. Would also add to the list Robbo. Good scrummager blah blah blah but so hot and cold. Kepu, Taf & Robbo should be let go and these young blokes given a real opportunity to play with do-or-die passion for the jersey. Fitzy, poor bugger is just too injury riden to be kept.

Think Cheika will get there in the end but how long do we have to wait ?

Season looks shot and the drawing board with question marks all over it !!!!

Whislt a Reds supporter I also want a strong NSW and Brumbies team so that Wallabies can be a real force once again in world rugby. doesn't happen unless our major franchises are all playing very well. Brums are playing great rugby (and winning), Reds are just playing OK (and winning) and the Tahs are fairly poor (and not winning). Suppose "2 out of 3 ain't bad"

 

[Bowside]

What I fail to understand is how established international players can put in such poor performances when in a sky blue jersey.

And what a pathetic crowd. If things don't change the tahs are going to turn into the lions of super rugby. Big City = Shithouse team.