#1 Tah
Chilla Wilson (44)
Dont think KB (Kurtley Beale)'s paycheck is anything too impressive - he was injured and had alcohol problems when he was signed. I'm sure he took a pay cut to be with his family and support network in Sydney
Waratahs 2014
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Dont think KB (Kurtley Beale)'s paycheck is anything too impressive - he was injured and had alcohol problems when he was signed. I'm sure he took a pay cut to be with his family and support network in Sydney
Alex
Jimmy Flynn (14)
Theres not much physically between Beale and Conrad Smith, Brian O'Driscoll or Wesley Fofana and they go alright at 13 - all around the six foot, 90+kg mark.
None of them hit like Kuridrani (with or without the ball), but they create and make the players around them better than they are, and for that reason they are much more valuable to their team than someone like Kuridrani. Not to denigrate his play, but he is not in the same league. I don't know if Beale could be as good at these guys in 13, but I think he is one of the few Australian players who has the raw materials to be a great 13 (as opposed to a good one).
Incidentally, I think James O'Connor is another one and he is not big either, but his ability to create space outside him and pass under pressure and in contact is reminiscent of O'Driscoll. I think it is a real shame that we did not get to see how a Godwin/O'Connor centre pairing for the force went this year. That might have been special with the lads they would have had running off them.
Brumby Runner
Jason Little (69)
It seems to me that the only discussion about where Folau should play comes from the Tahs' fans, while those with other leanings almost invariably want him to stay at 15 (probably with Wallabies' interests at heart). Funny that. But it is the Tahs thread so Tahs' fans should be at liberty to discuss the issue to their hearts' content.
On Beale, however, I would wait to see if he overcomes his demons and actually makes a comeback before considering putting him anywhere in the team. A Tahs' backline of Betham, Foley, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Crawford, Folau is very potent and will cause a lot of problems to opposing defences this year.
On Beale, however, I would wait to see if he overcomes his demons and actually makes a comeback before considering putting him anywhere in the team. A Tahs' backline of Betham, Foley, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Crawford, Folau is very potent and will cause a lot of problems to opposing defences this year.
Well, Folau, Beale and Foley all played 15 for the Wallabies at various points in 2013 so they should fight it out for that position.
Horwitz and Volavola can fight it out for the 10 jersey
Jokes aside, I think Cheika will not be trying to reinvent the wheel to get all his Wallabies on the field in the same starting XV. We may well see Folau be trialled at 13 and we might see Beale play somewhere other than 10 or 15 at times but on the whole I think they will stick with positions they know. That will mean that someone like Beale might spend some time on the bench.
On a side note, my seating allocation for 2014 has been stuffed up so I need to get my tickets re-issued. No indication yet of when I receive the 2014 jersey I ordered.
Horwitz and Volavola can fight it out for the 10 jersey
Jokes aside, I think Cheika will not be trying to reinvent the wheel to get all his Wallabies on the field in the same starting XV. We may well see Folau be trialled at 13 and we might see Beale play somewhere other than 10 or 15 at times but on the whole I think they will stick with positions they know. That will mean that someone like Beale might spend some time on the bench.
On a side note, my seating allocation for 2014 has been stuffed up so I need to get my tickets re-issued. No indication yet of when I receive the 2014 jersey I ordered.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Well, Folau, Beale and Foley all played 15 for the Wallabies at various points in 2013 so they should fight it out for that position.
Horwitz and Volavola can fight it out for the 10 jersey
Jokes aside, I think Cheika will not be trying to reinvent the wheel to get all his Wallabies on the field in the same starting XV. We may well see Folau be trialled at 13 and we might see Beale play somewhere other than 10 or 15 at times but on the whole I think they will stick with positions they know. That will mean that someone like Beale might spend some time on the bench.
On a side note, my seating allocation for 2014 has been stuffed up so I need to get my tickets re-issued. No indication yet of when I receive the 2014 jersey I ordered.
Agree.
Except on the seating allocation.
The last time I had a season ticket that was my assumption: "no team looking after a die hard would put a top $$$ (meaning I bought the most expensive package I could) season ticket holder in the eastern stand on the northern tryline" thought I.
As the season progressed and it became apparent that many many groups of 4 tickets on the half way line on the eastern side had not been allocated to season ticket holders and were filled with Canes supporters etc I came to the view that my initial thought had been uncharacteristically generous.
I complained by email to a former CEO of the Tahs. After a couple of Basil Fawlty like explanations which made no sense he terminated the exchange.
I have not bought any, let alone 4, season tickets since.
If you put the rusted on's in the corners its a lot easier to sell the tickets between the 22s to the big games.
(I must have been waiting years to get that off my chest)
The problem with my seating allocation is that I sit with a group of five other guys (and we have had the same seats since 2008) and this year I've been allocated seats on the opposite side of the ground.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Thats how you treat good customers.
suckerforred
Chilla Wilson (44)
You don't get the option to keep you same seats?
That is a good thing with the Reds, current season ticket holders get first chop at their existing seats.
Yes. I did re-purchase my previous seats.
There was apparently an issue with renewals that happened during the first few weeks the system was up and running and they emailed some members to confirm their ticket allocations.
I didn't get emailed so I assumed there wasn't an issue with mine but then I got allocated the wrong seats.
They'll sort it out. I'm not particularly worried.
T
TOCC
Guest
I dont doubt at some point Izzy will play 13 and he will probably go well in that position because he is a naturally talented guy... The debate is whether that strengthens the overall backline or weakens it.
suckerforred
Chilla Wilson (44)
Personally I think that moving Izzy to 13 will weaken the overall backline. Not only will a person weaker than him in taking the highball be moving into 15 you would be pushing AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) out of 13 & that is his strongest position.
I agree that at some point in time he will end up in 13 most likely through injury, but just think that he is best left at the back. I think that some of his indecision that a lot of people are menitioning is not because of him not 'knowing' what to do but because of him being faced with so many options that he is not sure what is the best. This is only to come with time. Moving him around like an indian rubber ball is not going to help. It did not help AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper).
Yes I know I am a bit of an AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) fan, but I still maintain that he is currently, on last years form, the best outside centre in Australia & until someone is better why move him. Same goes for Izzy.
I agree that at some point in time he will end up in 13 most likely through injury, but just think that he is best left at the back. I think that some of his indecision that a lot of people are menitioning is not because of him not 'knowing' what to do but because of him being faced with so many options that he is not sure what is the best. This is only to come with time. Moving him around like an indian rubber ball is not going to help. It did not help AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper).
Yes I know I am a bit of an AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) fan, but I still maintain that he is currently, on last years form, the best outside centre in Australia & until someone is better why move him. Same goes for Izzy.
Langthorne
Phil Hardcastle (33)
I have read this Beale - Folau, who plays where discussion with interest. As with all similar discussions, it is difficult to know what is being compared. Beale at his best, Beale at his worst, Beale's potential, Folau's potential....
For the purposes of this post, I am assuming all mentioned players are fit, firing and motivated. I don't believe Chieka would play anyone otherwise (which is a nice thing to be able to say).
Beale is faster and a better ball player than Folau. Folau is by far the best under the high ball and a better defender (except when pace over the ground is an issue).
For me, Beale at 15 offers more pace and playmaking (in the line and kick return) than Folau. Folau is a weapon under the high ball though (whereas Beale can be very hit and miss), particularly under pressure and in traffic. Folau is also more dificult to tackle than Beale (although Beale does take some bringng down too). So in a second playmaker situation, or a long kick return (assuming he takes the ball cleanly), and in a straight footrace, I would prefer Beale at 15. In a shorter high ball situation, when he is joining the backiline (especially in the opposition 22), and when there is a last ditch tackle to be made (especially a potential 'hold up'), I'd prefer Folau.
I think both players also have attributes that could be beneficial in other positions too. They could both be good at 13, with Folau having the obvious SBW offloading ability. Beale could make a good 12 too. The only question is the defensive requirements, for both players.
As there is always the potential for injuries over a long season, I would be interested in trialling different players in different positions, but not too much - getting the team firing for the first competition round should be the priority. Also, having Beale on the bench from the outset is no big problem - he'll get his chance off the bench for tactical or injury reasons.
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is a very good 13, doing all things very well except distribution (which is generally adequate). I think he is just as good on the wing too. I think it would be very harsh for him not to start the season at 13.
Having said all of that, I am generally unconcerned with fitting players into the backline.
My big concerns are:
- can TPN play a season without getting broken (especially the self inflicted variety)?
- how good is Latu? He will need to be playing (or able to) from the outset
- who is the third hooker? Can he scrummage and throw?
- why didn't Potgeiter play lock for the Bulls? Was it just that they had Matfield, Botha and Roussow ahead of him? or is he really a backrower?
For the purposes of this post, I am assuming all mentioned players are fit, firing and motivated. I don't believe Chieka would play anyone otherwise (which is a nice thing to be able to say).
Beale is faster and a better ball player than Folau. Folau is by far the best under the high ball and a better defender (except when pace over the ground is an issue).
For me, Beale at 15 offers more pace and playmaking (in the line and kick return) than Folau. Folau is a weapon under the high ball though (whereas Beale can be very hit and miss), particularly under pressure and in traffic. Folau is also more dificult to tackle than Beale (although Beale does take some bringng down too). So in a second playmaker situation, or a long kick return (assuming he takes the ball cleanly), and in a straight footrace, I would prefer Beale at 15. In a shorter high ball situation, when he is joining the backiline (especially in the opposition 22), and when there is a last ditch tackle to be made (especially a potential 'hold up'), I'd prefer Folau.
I think both players also have attributes that could be beneficial in other positions too. They could both be good at 13, with Folau having the obvious SBW offloading ability. Beale could make a good 12 too. The only question is the defensive requirements, for both players.
As there is always the potential for injuries over a long season, I would be interested in trialling different players in different positions, but not too much - getting the team firing for the first competition round should be the priority. Also, having Beale on the bench from the outset is no big problem - he'll get his chance off the bench for tactical or injury reasons.
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is a very good 13, doing all things very well except distribution (which is generally adequate). I think he is just as good on the wing too. I think it would be very harsh for him not to start the season at 13.
Having said all of that, I am generally unconcerned with fitting players into the backline.
My big concerns are:
- can TPN play a season without getting broken (especially the self inflicted variety)?
- how good is Latu? He will need to be playing (or able to) from the outset
- who is the third hooker? Can he scrummage and throw?
- why didn't Potgeiter play lock for the Bulls? Was it just that they had Matfield, Botha and Roussow ahead of him? or is he really a backrower?
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
On a good day he might be quicker over the first 10m but there is no way he has a higher top speed
Tomikin
David Codey (61)
Ive heard Beale (fit Beale) is one of the quickest in rugby..
Taking what ive seen. I would say his quicker top speed and first 20..
Izzys quick but not lighting Ive seen him out paced a few times..
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USARugger
John Thornett (49)
Beale used to be the fastest player in the entire Wallaby squad before the injuries and booze. He was easily in the Top 5 fastest players of any Tier 1 nation. He is just stupid fast:
Folau definitely lacks the top gear that some very gifted athletes like Beale seem to possess. Doesn't impact him much though as he's still got a silky step and even if the last two defenders get hands on the back of his shorts he will literally just drag them over the line, as he's done several times this year.
Anyone heard any updates on the last two squad positions?
I thought EPS was meant to be finalised prior to 31 December.
I thought EPS was meant to be finalised prior to 31 December.
Inside Shoulder
Nathan Sharpe (72)
I would say both are quick enough when fit.
Based on those clips Carter matched him stride for stride and had the angle and start on him and Carter is not exceptional over any distance.
Jayne was never any chance of getting him. I strongly disagree with the commentary to the effect that he "managed to get away from Jayne" - I reckon Jayne spotted him 10m and the angle and gave up early.
So I dont think that tape proves the point - and that's not to say I'm am dismissing your view as untenable.
Swat
Chilla Wilson (44)
Christian Cullen and Israel Folau have little in common. Cullen was a great full back because of his speed and vision, folau is a great fullback because of his athleticism. There have been success stories and failures for every positional change, I'd like to see it trialled before I pass judgement.
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