GaffaCHinO
Peter Sullivan (51)
Pocock has said that godwin will be a future wallaby so i guess that means he is on the godwin train.
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Athilnaur
Arch Winning (36)
There are a few rational reasons;
1 - McCabe is a dominant tackler
2 - McCabe is very good at cleanouts and support play
3 - McCabe has one of the highest tackle completion rates in Super Rugby
4 - McCabe is a machine, every run, every ruck he is there doing what needs doing
5 - McCabe has proven all of these things at test and world cup level
6 - While we hardly got to see it during test rugby last year due to injury McCabe has added (needed) dimensions to his game in the past two years
There are rational reasons not to pick him, but to say there isn't one rational reason to pick him is bullshit and frankly I expect more from posters here.
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
Maybe he should be playing in the backrow then.
None of those things completes the skill set of a 12, or 2nd 5/8 if you are a Kiwi. McCabe is a very good winger. As a 12 he fills a role that the coaching staff have set, much the same as Tom Carter did for the Tahs in years past with exactly the same results. Now the difference between the Tahs this year and years past is stark, it isn't that much to do with the selections, but more about the selections being made in conjunction with an attacking game plan and players being selected for their skill set to play that.
A selection of McCabe at 12 means the Wallabies are going to play a defensive plan with all attack being based around the individual "x player" skills and a grinding 10+ phase play system, just like the Tahs of yesteryear and similar to that of the Force now. It will grind out wins against similar sides and is risk averse, but it is mind numbing and IMO not really Rugby. McCabe is not a bad player, in fact he is the opposite. It is what he is selected for that has unfairly earned him this response. Play him in position on the wing and he would win fans, the problem for him is there are far better options in those positions then him.
A few observations from the weekend. The general theme is established players catching up to, and overtaking, Brumbies upstarts who began the season well but are beginning to fade. Obviously this is all opinion, so feel free to disagree:
Slipper has overtaken Palmer as the leading tighthead. Palmer was poor today, and the scrum visibly improved when he went off. When was the last time the Brumbies pack demolished an opposition scrum like the Tahs have the past two weeks?
Higgers has drawn level with Mowen. Contrary to earlier posters I thought Mowen was average today. Certainly not the worst, but he missed a few soft tackles, and was held up in contact once. The lineout was also fairly shambolic, for which he needs to take some responsibility. He did do good things, but in the past two weeks I think Higgers has shown a bit of class and x-factor that Mowen lacks. It's neck and neck for me here.
Moore isn't as far ahead of TPN as many might think. He had a bad game today. If TPN played the game that Moore played there would be a fair bit of vitriol directed at him- wonky throws, general anonymity. The fact is apart from a couple of games Moore has been solid but unspectacular this year. I would pick him, but let's not pretend he is playing the house down.
Mogg may now be third in the fullback pecking order. Now that could change next week, but Folau and Beale were both outstanding, while Mogg was listless. I think it is testament to how close the competition for spots is that one bad game can really make a difference. Obviously Mogg could have a barnstormer next week and Folau a shocker and that will change again. But Mogg was one who went missing today, which was made much worse after what happened in Melbourne and Port Elizabeth in the preceding nights.
Digby is a lock. There was a 80-90% chance he would be picked before this weekend. Make that 100%.
Anyway, just a few things to chew on.
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Slipper has overtaken Palmer as the leading tighthead. Palmer was poor today, and the scrum visibly improved when he went off. When was the last time the Brumbies pack demolished an opposition scrum like the Tahs have the past two weeks?
Higgers has drawn level with Mowen. Contrary to earlier posters I thought Mowen was average today. Certainly not the worst, but he missed a few soft tackles, and was held up in contact once. The lineout was also fairly shambolic, for which he needs to take some responsibility. He did do good things, but in the past two weeks I think Higgers has shown a bit of class and x-factor that Mowen lacks. It's neck and neck for me here.
Moore isn't as far ahead of TPN as many might think. He had a bad game today. If TPN played the game that Moore played there would be a fair bit of vitriol directed at him- wonky throws, general anonymity. The fact is apart from a couple of games Moore has been solid but unspectacular this year. I would pick him, but let's not pretend he is playing the house down.
Mogg may now be third in the fullback pecking order. Now that could change next week, but Folau and Beale were both outstanding, while Mogg was listless. I think it is testament to how close the competition for spots is that one bad game can really make a difference. Obviously Mogg could have a barnstormer next week and Folau a shocker and that will change again. But Mogg was one who went missing today, which was made much worse after what happened in Melbourne and Port Elizabeth in the preceding nights.
Digby is a lock. There was a 80-90% chance he would be picked before this weekend. Make that 100%.
Anyway, just a few things to chew on.
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p.Tah
John Thornett (49)
I know Robbie picks players out of position but not even he would do that would he?
Gnostic
Mark Ella (57)
I would disagree about Mowen - I thought he was the best Brumbies forward along with Carter. The rest were just flat or worse.
I would also disagree with you regarding the form of Beale. His contribution was about a half of Rugby. Mogg had a average game in a team that played average after a barnstorming season.
As for the arguments surrounding Slipper and Palmer, I would like to have somebody with serious front row credentials do a front page examination of their respective strengths and weaknesses with regard to technical application. The scrum is perhaps the most concentrated form of team effort on the Rugby field and it is difficult to pick a winner when the individuals are against different opponents, on different days, with different support players around them, but given at least one of these players will be fronting up in a Lions series this should be Top Secret until after the tests, much like an ARU performance review.
I have no doubt as I have posted elsewhere, that Beale will be selected, I dispute that his selection will be on the basis of form. The Wallabies have not been selected on the basis of form for many years.
I would also disagree with you regarding the form of Beale. His contribution was about a half of Rugby. Mogg had a average game in a team that played average after a barnstorming season.
As for the arguments surrounding Slipper and Palmer, I would like to have somebody with serious front row credentials do a front page examination of their respective strengths and weaknesses with regard to technical application. The scrum is perhaps the most concentrated form of team effort on the Rugby field and it is difficult to pick a winner when the individuals are against different opponents, on different days, with different support players around them, but given at least one of these players will be fronting up in a Lions series this should be Top Secret until after the tests, much like an ARU performance review.
I have no doubt as I have posted elsewhere, that Beale will be selected, I dispute that his selection will be on the basis of form. The Wallabies have not been selected on the basis of form for many years.
No4918
John Hipwell (52)
Agree with most of that.
- I haven't seen the last few Tahs games so can't really comment on Folau or TPN but agree Moore has been just better than solid this year. Still my first pick at hooker.
-Slipper is definitely my number 3, Reds really missed him at the set piece and around the park this week.
-Good to see Higgers back to form as well. Was worried my Red glasses had been doing too well when in seasons past and blinded me to his weaknesses. May well have been the case but he is probably a better player now and the captaincy is growing on him.
- I haven't seen the last few Tahs games so can't really comment on Folau or TPN but agree Moore has been just better than solid this year. Still my first pick at hooker.
-Slipper is definitely my number 3, Reds really missed him at the set piece and around the park this week.
-Good to see Higgers back to form as well. Was worried my Red glasses had been doing too well when in seasons past and blinded me to his weaknesses. May well have been the case but he is probably a better player now and the captaincy is growing on him.
I have to agree, sadly. I thought he was the goods last year and early this year. I'm sure he'll get it back, but he might miss a BIG career moment with the Lions based on his current form.
The big difference between Beale and Mogg is that Beale doesn't have to prove what he is capable of doing. He just has to show he's fit enough and switched on enough to do it.
In half a game of football Beale did two sublime things which both resulted in tries. That's pretty impressive for a guy playing his first rugby in around two months.
Mogg isn't going to be able to afford many average games between now and the Lions series. Rounds 12-16 are going to be the important ones in dictating who is selected for the Lions Tour, not rounds 1-11.
USARugger
John Thornett (49)
This is a myth. Our defensive stats have not changed much between 2008-2013.
Slipper only played 1/2 an hour of footy but the point everyone has missed is he played a loosehead and Holmes played the entire game at tighthead. But they looked good didn't they.
I have concerns over Palmers technique and I think Scott Allen does too but I don't want to put words in his mouth.
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I have concerns over Palmers technique and I think Scott Allen does too but I don't want to put words in his mouth.
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Joe Mac
Arch Winning (36)
1. Benn Robinson
2. Stephen Moore
3. Ben Alexander
4. James Horwill
5. Hugh Pyle
6. Scott Higginbotham
7. George Smith
8. Ben Mowen
9. Will Genia
10. Quade Cooper
11. JOC (James O'Connor)
12. Christian Lealiifano
13. Adam Ashley-Cooper
14. Israel Folau
15. Beale
I know BennyA doesn't deserve his place after today however, if the game were next weekend, this would be our best team...
2. Stephen Moore
3. Ben Alexander
4. James Horwill
5. Hugh Pyle
6. Scott Higginbotham
7. George Smith
8. Ben Mowen
9. Will Genia
10. Quade Cooper
11. JOC (James O'Connor)
12. Christian Lealiifano
13. Adam Ashley-Cooper
14. Israel Folau
15. Beale
I know BennyA doesn't deserve his place after today however, if the game were next weekend, this would be our best team...
Rassie
Trevor Allan (34)
Actually no. Jean De Villiers, and Kahui is their generals in the defensive alignment. They make sure its setup and all bases are cover and when they switch from drift to blitz (see they call it "umbrella defense" these days) as like attack you need to be unpredictable in defense as well. Crusaders, Tah's and Brumbies use similiar systems with Crotty, McCabe and Carter but they are not as flashy as Kahui and JdV are. JdV also straighten the attack when it needs to so does Kahui and their work rate is phenomenal. But it doesn't say your team is defensive and offer nothing in attack. That is not their jobs. That is your 9/10 combo's job to get the back line moving. The above mention 12's will just organize the defense when you need to defend. The better their ability the better your defense holds up same as you 9/10 the better their ability the better your attack is doing.
Just shows how underrated JdV as most do not realize what he actually does and why is he such a good leader. Especially in my own country. They think cause the Stormers are playing a 10 who is not as good as a Cooper or Carter and JdV notice that and try to add more responsibility on himself by sometimes throwing that skip pass to some one in space, its his job to create something and cause he do not do it every time, he is not worth anything.
They will straighten the attack as most of us know going sideways the touchline is a extra defender and you will lose ground and not going anywhere. That space needs to be created by your bruising ball runners, your tight five, you still need quick recycles, which your back 3 must provide so that your 9/10 have space to work in and set the other attacking players on their way.
Stormers fail they have some bruising ball carriers but their back 3 is not getting that quick recycles for them so the space is not there. That is why they look defensive. But a machine needs all its working parts to work well. If one is not 100 percent you are not going to perform 100 percent on attack.
USARugger
John Thornett (49)
I was a bit on the piss so there was some hyperbole in that last post, my fault. Yes he has a high work rate and yes McCabe is very solid on defense but he lacks half of the skill set you want from a 12 and as Gnostic already mentioned resembles an underweight loosie. Lilo also has a fantastic work rate and is solid in defense, having him at 12 also doesn't gut our attack. I'm tired of people saying we need a straight running center to 'straighten the back line'. What we need is to stop playing 10s that crab across the field before moving the ball. Taps and Lilo both run straight into traffic multiple times every single Super Rugby match they play anyway. McCabe is not a 'dominant' tackler at the test level. He makes some dominant tackles every once in a while but so do most players. If he is a dominant defender then so is AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Can you provide a source for that tackle completion stat?
I'd buy into the new dimensions thing if in his first 80 minutes of playing for the Brumbies this year he passed the ball once. Frankly I'd be surprised if he's at or over 20 passes on the season so far. That just doesn't work in today's game unless you are a monstrously large individual like Jamie Roberts or Manu Tuilagi. For all his heart McCabe is about the same size as Quade Cooper. You don't try to use a door knocker as a battering ram.
The only justification I could see for selecting McCabe at 12 would be his previous test experience as Lilo has none.
For the record I like Pat a lot as a player and his heart and fire are really wonderful qualities to have in any sporting camp or team. But I do not think he should ever pull on the Wallaby 12 jumper again. I liked watching him play at Fullback and on the Wing for the Brumbies last year and I think he would make a fantastic utility (center, wing, fullback) sub. Let him come on and smash into some tired bodies and give the boys the drive to close out the final 20 minutes. But he should not be starting at 12 if Lilo or even Tapuai is healthy.
USARugger
John Thornett (49)
Tries Scored Against the Wallabies On Average
2008 - 2.29
2009 - 1.07
2010 - 2.36
2011 - 1.56
2012 - 1.4
Games in which McCabe Started - 1.63
Fact is the Wallabies tries leaked:match figure hasn't fluctuated nearly as much as the tries scored:match figure. The difference between 2010 and 2011 was .8 tries leaked:game. Camp Wallaby also got a dedicated defense coach before the 2011 RWC for the first time under Deans. I think tighter defensive structures and more communication around the breakdown had a lot more to do with the relative defensive improvements the Wallabies have made than one new 12. By the numbers we're slightly below par defensively with Pat on the field but the numbers are too close to actually draw that conclusion. What it seems to be is that he is just towing the line like everyone else, nothing more.
Regardless, if you would actually trade 3 more tries scored per match in favor is .8 less tries leaked per match then I think Robbie may have an assistant coaching spot left for ya.
Rassie
Trevor Allan (34)
No he straightens when he needs to.
You notice straight leaves space out wide for his support runners and not running them into a touchline.
If your 10 crabs across the filed then something is wrong as that space is not there for him to work with. Either your tight 5 is not making those yards or those recycles is slow and your back 3 is not doing their job. But England had some success using Moody to rocket through on Quade Cooper from the back of lineouts in order to reduce his time to take the ball up to the gain line in the past. Won't be suprise if they employ the same tactic again.
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