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Wallabies 2023

kiap

kiap

Steve Williams (59)
Derpus said:
Didnt realise Hoops wrote the match day program. What doesnt the man do?
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Take the points?

Win 42% as captain?

That's not all on Hoops, TBF, and I'm sure he goes to the RWC.

But it is not all about him either.
 
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qwerty51

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Toulouse rolled out Richie Arnold and Meafou as a locking combo last night.. what could've been. Meanwhile on the same night, Irish had Coleman and Simmons together.
 
molman

molman

Jim Lenehan (48)
qwerty51 said:
Toulouse rolled out Richie Arnold and Meafou as a locking combo last night.. what could've been. Meanwhile on the same night, Irish had Coleman and Simmons together.
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To think the Brums had Richie & Rory & Sam Carter (who is still playing ok at Ulster at the ripe age of 33)

I'm sure the Reds... or any Super club would love to have Emmanuel Latu-Meafou in their squad.
 
qwerty51

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Slim 293 said:
How so?
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You reckon it was purely 100% about money? Obviously the main element but also a chance to get out of dodge I reckon. I mean Rodda didn’t go back to the Reds despite lacking in lock depth. I would assume Thorn is especially harsh on locks too.
 
Slim 293

Slim 293

Stirling Mortlock (74)
qwerty51 said:
You reckon it was purely 100% about money? Obviously the main element but also a chance to get out of dodge I reckon. I mean Rodda didn’t go back to the Reds despite lacking in lock depth. I would assume Thorn is especially harsh on locks too.
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rodha makes up all kinds of wild, crazy statements... I'd prefer it if there was something to back up his claims.
 
Adam84

Adam84

Rod McCall (65)
qwerty51 said:
Well it’s all speculation but a player falling out with Thorn is hardly new or surprising..
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Yes it’s all speculation and a little revisionist, Rodda had signed a new long term contract with the Reds only months before COVID hit and refusing to take a pay cut, and then breaking contract. The only other major event in that period was selecting Wright as a the new Reds captain ahead of Rodda.
 
Froggy

Froggy

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
I don't think Rennie is a poor coach necessarily, I was surprised by his sacking and am far from convinced about Jones, BUT I just don't see this so-called upward trajectory we were on. FFS we had our worst ever loss to the Pumas, our first ever loss to Italy, and that's an upward trajectory?? Frightens me to see what a declining trajectory would look like.
 
rodha

rodha

Dave Cowper (27)
Froggy said:
I don't think Rennie is a poor coach necessarily, I was surprised by his sacking and am far from convinced about Jones, BUT I just don't see this so-called upward trajectory we were on. FFS we had our worst ever loss to the Pumas, our first ever loss to Italy, and that's an upward trajectory?? Frightens me to see what a declining trajectory would look like.
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The truth of the matter remains - you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, Rennie had a Wallabies 2nd string team for most of 2022, despite this they beat SA, almost beat NZ, came within 1 point of beating France, deserved to beat Ireland with a last minute line-out drive (ref incorrectly penalized Aus) and then put 39 points on the Welsh with a virtual 3rd string line-up.

Considering the players at his disposal compared to Cheika & Deans, along with the relative strength of the opposition (International Rugby has never been as competitive across the board as it is currently.) compared to the absolute cannon-fodder the NH sides were during Dean's (2008-2012) tenure - genuinely back then only 2-3 teams compared or bettered Australia's talent on paper, now there are about 7-8 international sides that can upset anyone on a given day and have comparable or better talent than Australia does.

Taking into account all these various factors (including the abysmal state of Australian pathways, U20's, Super Rugby teams, Covid impacts, ARU financial situation since 2020, etc...) we can unequivocally say that Rennie left Wallabies in a much better state than his not misfortunate predecessor's Cheika and Deans did.
 
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Adam84

Adam84

Rod McCall (65)
rodha said:
The truth of the matter remains - you can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear, Rennie had a Wallabies 2nd string team for most of 2022, despite this they beat SA, almost beat NZ came within 1 point of beating France, deserved to beat Ireland with a last minute line-out drive (ref incorrectly penalized Aus) and then put 39 points on the Welsh with a virtual 3rd string line-up.

Considering the players at his disposal compared to Cheika & Deans, along with the relative strength of the opposition (International Rugby has never been as competitive across the board as it is currently.) compared to the absolute canon-fodder the NH sides were during Dean's (2008-2012) tenure.

Taking into account all these various factors (including the abysmal state of Australian pathways, U20's, Super Rugby teams, Covid impacts, ARU financial situation since 2020, etc...) we can unequivocally say that Rennie left Wallabies in a much better state than his not misfortunate predecessor's Cheika and Deans did.
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And yet he coached the wallabies first every loss to Italy, he lost two highly qualified assistant coaches in 12 months, had a disproportionate number of injuries and had the most poorly disciplined Tier 1 test team in world rugby. I'd say Rennie lost his composure in the end, his decision making in 2022 shifted from someone with a plan, to someone of desperation.

He selected players who were under injury clouds or returning from injury early, and put himself under more pressure by forcing a recurrence of the injury. One week he would complain about discipline and talk about holding players accountable, the next week he is selecting players who had already been sin-binned for stupid decisions the preceding week. Something was clearly amiss in that Wallaby camp.

Not to ignore the variables which influenced the outcomes, but Rennie created some of these pressures himself.
 
Froggy

Froggy

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
No Rodha, WE can't unequivocally say that, you may believe it, but many (me included) don't.
I have said before that I don't hold Rennie solely, or even principally, responsible for the Wallabies poor performances, given Deans, McKenzie and Cheika also couldn't get them to perform. While it is popular among many here to particularly trash Cheika as a coach, his record both before and after the Wallabies would suggest he is one of the better coaches on the world stage.
Where we really disagree is the suggestion that the Wallabies are on an upward trajectory, there really is no evidence to support that. Beat the Springboks? We have at least once most years. Nearly beat the AB's? Most years we have beaten them once. I could go on, but the debacles against Argentina and Italy certainly don't support any suggestion of an upward trajectory.
And for what it's worth, I would NOT have sacked Rennie prior to the WC to lock in Jones. Let's not forget, when Jones took over the Wallabies we held the Tri-Nations championship, the World Cup, the Bledisloe Cup, the Mandella Trophy and the Cook Cup, by the time he was sacked (yes, he's been sacked from both tier 1 teams he's coached) we had lost the lot. He then moved on to take the Reds to their only ever last place in Super rugby.
So while there is certainly a question mark over Rennie, I don't see Jones as the answer to that question.
I most sincerely hope I'm wrong.
 
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