Wallabies 2023

[Highlander35]

I'm fairly sure that minutes spent on non-recovery activity (see things like swim, bike, row, light weights) would probably be very tightly controlled by physios/sports scientists etc. for better or for worse.

 

[PhilClinton]

Hmmm yeh. And our injuries and lack of results on field haven’t exactly been great with those tightly controlled measures.

Might be time to swap out the massage gun for a kicking tee.

 

[dru]

I mean, I guess it's good you are willing to do additional unpaid work but I somehow doubt you are our goalkicking solution.

More to the point - many of us spend time in training outside of work related to maintaining professional qualifications.

 

[Braveheart81]

It's good to know that any of our players can become a test quality goal kicker with some extra training.

I'm still unsure how any of this changes the equation for Carter Gordon.

 

[Drew]

If he is going to kick for the Rebels though I would expect he is putting in extras though. Not sure who else in their line-up has the ability with Hodge gone.

Critiques of his play will be greater if we are forced to select others in a side purely because we lack kicking. Is this fair on Carter? No. But he can lock a job away if he adds the skill to a high level.

I hope someone like Jorgenson can develop his goal kicking and JS has kicked well in the past season in the NRL. If this is the case then problem solved...

Agreed. I’d want a fullback kicking goals myself. They usually play the whole game.

 

[Ignoto]

Who in the Wallabies team that doesn't currently kick goals is about to become a test level goal kicker?

Is this really acceptable? Australia has never placed much emphasis on kicking from the tee and we reap what we sow. Similar to what Eddie Jones did to our scrum in 03, it took over a decade for Australia to fix the lack of emphasis.

Not every back will be someone who can kick 90%+ and we saw the work Dave Aldridge did with the Reds pay off both from tee and general play.

I just don't buy this argument that having a core group of backs who can all kick at a high level is somehow wasted. It's not like the world cup we just witnessed wasn't the closest ever where a missed conversion or penalty is costly.

 

[Ignoto]

Hmmm yeh. And our injuries and lack of results on field haven’t exactly been great with those tightly controlled measures.

Might be time to swap out the massage gun for a kicking tee.

Outside of Quade (Len doesn't count as he had someone flop on his shohlder), but what back had a catastrophic injury in the last 12-24 months?

All the major injuries were to the forwards from memory.

Or you know, the guys who do a toe punt at goal while waiting for the backs to get out of the locker room.

 

[Rebel man]

If he is going to kick for the Rebels though I would expect he is putting in extras though. Not sure who else in their line-up has the ability with Hodge gone.

Critiques of his play will be greater if we are forced to select others in a side purely because we lack kicking. Is this fair on Carter? No. But he can lock a job away if he adds the skill to a high level.

I hope someone like Jorgenson can develop his goal kicking and JS has kicked well in the past season in the NRL. If this is the case then problem solved...

To be fair Foote said he only didn’t kick this year because he was managing a groin injury.

Every test back needs to be able to kick preferably off both feet. It is such a basic concept where rugby is so far behind other sports.

 

[Braveheart81]

Is this really acceptable? Australia has never placed much emphasis on kicking from the tee and we reap what we sow. Similar to what Eddie Jones did to our scrum in 03, it took over a decade for Australia to fix the lack of emphasis.

Not every back will be someone who can kick 90%+ and we saw the work Dave Aldridge did with the Reds pay off both from tee and general play.

I just don't buy this argument that having a core group of backs who can all kick at a high level is somehow wasted. It's not like the world cup we just witnessed wasn't the closest ever where a missed conversion or penalty is costly.

It is what it is.

Yes, it would be great if more of our players could perform more skills but the reality is that they don't.

Are we going to stop selecting the majority of backs at various age groups and then in professional teams if we don't consider their goal kicking to be good enough?

This all stems from the Carter Gordon situation. It's entirely on him that he plays the position where you're expected to be a good goal kicker and at this point he isn't and it has hurt his selection and will likely to continue to do so if he can't work it out. Now of course if there's someone in a different position who earns selection who is a good goal kicker then that will help his chances massively but he hardly has a right to get upset that there isn't.

There are so many shortfalls in most of our players I'm not sure the place I'd start is trying to improve everyone's goal kicking.

 

[Rebel man]

It’s simply not acceptable to rely on one player to kick the ball. Rugby is stuck in the Stone Age when it comes to this.

There should be an emphasis in the pathways placed on this. If you play Aussie rules you are told from the age of 4-5 that if you want to make it you have to be able to execute your skills of both sides of your body.

You look at a player like Nick Daicos he is 20 and his foot skills would be far superior to any international fly half. Of course I am talking general in play kicking and not drop goals or goal kicking as it’s a slightly different skill set.

You need to invest the time into your craft from when you’re a kid. Kicking can not continue to be an afterthought

 

[Braveheart81]

It’s simply not acceptable to rely on one player to kick the ball. Rugby is stuck in the Stone Age when it comes to this.

There should be an emphasis in the pathways placed on this. If you play Aussie rules you are told from the age of 4-5 that if you want to make it you have to be able to execute your skills of both sides of your body.

You look at a player like Nick Daicos he is 20 and his foot skills would be far superior to any international fly half. Of course I am talking general in play kicking and not drop goals or goal kicking as it’s a slightly different skill set.

You need to invest the time into your craft from when you’re a kid. Kicking can not continue to be an afterthought

He's one of the most talented players in a game played by far more people where kicking is the primary skill required.

It's one thing to say it's simply not acceptable but the reality is that outside a handful of the best players in international rugby, no one kicks well off either foot because it simply isn't a skill that is required to be executed frequently.

 

[Rebel man]

He's one of the most talented players in a game played by far more people where kicking is the primary skill required.

It's one thing to say it's simply not acceptable but the reality is that outside a handful of the best players in international rugby, no one kicks well off either foot because it simply isn't a skill that is required to be executed frequently.

And that’s the sort of myopic thinking that gets us nowhere. Until the 90s it was rare for players to kick both feet. Wasn’t seen as a required, now it is.

We can sit back and say it’s not needed, we can sit back and stick with the status quo of only the 10 kicking. Or we can take the game forward.

No longer trying to find a left footed centre to complement a right footed 10.

It is a fundamental skill of the game

 

[Tomthumb]

It's good to know that any of our players can become a test quality goal kicker with some extra training.

I'm still unsure how any of this changes the equation for Carter Gordon.

It’s not just goal kicking, it’s all skills

Our players don’t seem to be showing the same dedication to their crafts as others nations players are. Tate McDermott kicked a box kick backwards ffs, that is simply unacceptable

 

[Dctarget]

It’s not just goal kicking, it’s all skills

Our players don’t seem to be showing the same dedication to their crafts as others nations players are. Tate McDermott kicked a box kick backwards ffs, that is simply unacceptable

Jalibert did the same thing if it makes you feel better.

 

[Braveheart81]

And that’s the sort of myopic thinking that gets us nowhere. Until the 90s it was rare for players to kick both feet. Wasn’t seen as a required, now it is.

We can sit back and say it’s not needed, we can sit back and stick with the status quo of only the 10 kicking. Or we can take the game forward.

No longer trying to find a left footed centre to complement a right footed 10.

It is a fundamental skill of the game

My take is that pretty much all our players have greater deficiencies in skill areas for more critical to the game than to be shifting the focus substantially towards kicking.

 

[Braveheart81]

It’s not just goal kicking, it’s all skills

Absolutely.

Hence my reply after you posted this.

Kicking for a lot of the players is pretty far down the list of skills that should have greater time invested in.

 

[HogansHeros]

Absolutely.

Hence my reply after you posted this.

Kicking for a lot of the players is pretty far down the list of skills that should have greater time invested in.

I think this is kind of supports my point. The 10 shouldnt be pressured into kicking because he is the 10... he has a lot of other skills that need developing. It seems that you must kick if you play 10 surely we can be a bit more open minded then that.

 

[Braveheart81]

The 10 shouldnt be pressured into kicking because he is the 10... he has a lot of other skills that need developing. It seems that you must kick if you play 10 surely we can be a bit more open minded then that.

My entire point here is that this is the circumstance Carter Gordon finds himself in. Every other option at 10 is a better goalkicker. No one else in our first choice backline or even those on the fringes are a recognised goal kicker.

The situation for Gordon isn't going to change anytime soon. He either convinces the new coach that he's a good enough goal kicker to be the first choice kicker for the Wallabies or he ends up in a selection battle across multiple positions like we saw at the RWC.

The fact that goal kicking shouldn't just be a requirement for the 10 to fulfil doesn't change the situation now.

 

[HogansHeros]

My entire point here is that this is the circumstance Carter Gordon finds himself in. Every other option at 10 is a better goalkicker. No one else in our first choice backline or even those on the fringes are a recognised goal kicker.

The situation for Gordon isn't going to change anytime soon. He either convinces the new coach that he's a good enough goal kicker to be the first choice kicker for the Wallabies or he ends up in a selection battle across multiple positions like we saw at the RWC.

The fact that goal kicking shouldn't just be a requirement for the 10 to fulfil doesn't change the situation now.

Yeah i guess we are arguing different points, now vs generally.

Im sure everyone agrees we are currently in a predicament

 

[Adam84]

i disagree that we are currently not in a predicament