Wallabies 2021

[Braveheart81]

Injury or not, McDermott had a poor first half by his recent standards (which was being our best player in the previous test). He threw some errant passes and his box kicking was poor. It's clearly more important against the Springboks because they will kick away so much possession.

White came on and played well.

That said, if McDermott is fit, he's the starter now. He's earned that.

 

[Tah Man]

Injury or not, McDermott had a poor first half by his recent standards (which was being our best player in the previous test). He threw some errant passes and his box kicking was poor. It's clearly more important against the Springboks because they will kick away so much possession.

White came on and played well.

That said, if McDermott is fit, he's the starter now. He's earned that.

Disagree I think we will see White come in for the only form related change. Tupou to start with AAA absent. The rest of the team unchanged, time to build some combinations

 

[Adam84]

Disagree I think we will see White come in for the only form related change. Tupou to start with AAA absent. The rest of the team unchanged, time to build some combinations

Time to build combinations, and make selections based on form but you want to drop the one player who was close to Australia's best the previous two games and had one game where he was injured? ok...

 

[Joe King]

The thing it misses though is when you're comparing players of substantially different abilities.

Likewise, the Wallabies play more than enough tests to create cohesion there. On top of that, the more experienced players are, the quicker they build cohesion.

If Rory Arnold or Will Skelton plays 10 tests a year they will have plenty of cohesion with the other Wallabies.

My understanding is skill level is taken into account by Gain Line as a separate factor to cohesion. Skill levels make a difference, but given roughly equivalent ability, cohesion levels make a significant difference to how successful a team will be.

The level of cohesion for a test team needs to be compared to other test teams. A combination playing together for 10 tests may not be enough if another team has had that combination together for 20 tests, so it can be a bit relative. And if a test team has had that combination playing together at the tier below test level as well, it's an even greater advantage.

The biggest difference the cohesion level makes to a team is in its ability to defend. And fortunately, I don't think the Boks tested our defence the same way a team that likes to maintain possession would.

Not taking anything away from QC (Quade Cooper), but I actually think the Boks gameplan really suited us playing new combinations in the halves and centers especially. It highlighted our skill level rather than our cohesion level.

Anyway, there were a lot of other real positives to take away from the way we played against the Boks.

 

[formerflanker]

It highlighted our skill level rather than our cohesion level.

Speaking of skills, all those who said Kerevi can't or doesn't pass have been quiet since his long, accurate, left to right pass to put Kellaway away.

 

[eastman]

Speaking of skills, all those who said Kerevi can't or doesn't pass have been quiet since his long, accurate, left to right pass to put Kellaway away.

This forum really struggles to recognise and reward consistency - we're very quick to praise or cancel individuals from individual performances or efforts.

If Kerevi continues to make that pass or even better starts distributing effectively before contact across multiple games, then sure let's praise his improvement in passing skills, but he hasn't earned it yet.

Quade Cooper is currently a strong defender - let's see how long that lasts.

 

[Viking]

JOC (James O'Connor) at 15... you guys are nuts. Giving him too much credit.

 

[Viking]

If Cooper is a lock in at 10 then he should be a package deal with Kerevi. As I don't see Cooper able to neutralise some of the defensive pressure without Kerevi, so many time he was able to pass the ball quickly to Kerevi, often flat footed, but Kerevi was still able to win the contact area. This is a great 10-12 combo IMO, both play to each others strengths so beautifully.

Kerevi is getting better with ball in hand and defensively too.

 

[dru]

If Cooper is a lock in at 10 then he should be a package deal with Kerevi. As I don't see Cooper able to neutralise some of the defensive pressure without Kerevi, so many time he was able to pass the ball quickly to Kerevi, often flat footed, but Kerevi was still able to win the contact area. This is a great 10-12 combo IMO, both play to each others strengths so beautifully.

Kerevi is getting better with ball in hand and defensively too.

Agree. 10: Cooper; 12: Kerevi. Bench needs thought though and I don't mind 23: JOC (James O'Connor) being ready to take over from Quade, as JOC (James O'Connor) get's game fit. But JOC (James O'Connor) can also double across the rest of the back line. Sure, Hodge is more proven recently, but JOC (James O'Connor) would be fine.

Personally I'd drop Banks for Hodge until he get's his head back in the game.

 

[Viking]

I don't see JOC (James O'Connor) at any position besides 10 though, he just doesn't have the speed or strength these days.
I think his current game is built around maturity, leadership and having a calming head. We really only need that at 10. I don't see that at 12,13, or 15 as you're given up too much.

I just don't see him as a running threat anywhere besides 10, he has good footwork in tight or across short distances, which suits 10, as he can make half-breaks and distribute. Can't see him making clean breaks, or even being threatening in broken play.

I see QC (Quade Cooper) and JOC (James O'Connor) as like for like now. Start one, bench one.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Article on rugby.com.au about wallabies winning close contests with French test and now SA. Good point I thought about improving mental toughness and staying in the fight as wallabies of old would lose a lot of the close contests in last decade. Another small sign of hopefully things turning.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I don't see JOC (James O'Connor) at any position besides 10 though, he just doesn't have the speed or strength these days.
I think his current game is built around maturity, leadership and having a calming head. We really only need that at 10. I don't see that at 12,13, or 15 as you're given up too much.

I just don't see him as a running threat anywhere besides 10, he has good footwork in tight or across short distances, which suits 10, as he can make half-breaks and distribute. Can't see him making clean breaks, or even being threatening in broken play.

I see QC (Quade Cooper) and JOC (James O'Connor) as like for like now. Start one, bench one.

He was playing 12 in Europe and skill set suits in my mind...let’s see what he offers off the bench is my view as yeh JOC (James O'Connor) returning and would not be right to jettison him in after layoff. Cooper 10 and JOC (James O'Connor) on the bench with JOC (James O'Connor) to earn his spot back in starting line up - which really could be 10, 12 or 13. But let his footy decide.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

They both can go 80. But 9 is so key you’ll pretty much always have one on the bench. When they are this good, you use them.

We are lucky to have two in form and world class 9s - hence as long as both in the 23 I am less concerned about who starts or finishes.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Ha! Perhaps not the pilfer itself, but the maddening intent to not be outdone by the pack - well I don't mind that in a 9. And we sure as hell got use of it on Sunday. Awesome scrum would have meant nothing if White had not pounced.

I'd start Tate mostly. But we should think about White against the Boks.

I think they are both awesome - McDermott shades white for running game - but white shades for workrate and kicking game (Better box kick which now days seems so important as so much box kicking)

 

[Viking]

He was playing 12 in Europe and skill set suits in my mind.let’s see what he offers off the bench is my view as yeh JOC (James O'Connor) returning and would not be right to jettison him in after layoff. Cooper 10 and JOC (James O'Connor) on the bench with JOC (James O'Connor) to earn his spot back in starting line up - which really could be 10, 12 or 13. But let his footy decide.

I could see him at 12 at super rugby level, but not at test level. I feel the position is too physically demanding these days. Maybe he would balance out the backline at 13 with Kerevi at 12 but he has the least experience at 13, and that is probably even more critical on defence then 12, which isn't one of his strengths.

I still think Kerevi, Hunter, Ikitau and even Petaia if he can find some form offers so much more at 12 and 13. I would even prefer Simone if he can step up a level.

Plus Cooper has enough playmaking ability for two backlines

 

[Viking]

I think they are both awesome - McDermott shades white for running game - but white shades for workrate and kicking game (Better box kick which now days seems so important as so much box kicking)

I actually rate Tates box kicking, it has been pretty good this year. Under-rated part of this game.

Whites experience and decision making was certainly handy last match. Hard to seperate them. Happy if either started, but personally just love seeing Tate in full flight, so good to watch.

 

[eastman]

I could see him at 12 at super rugby level, but not at test level. I feel the position is too physically demanding these days. Maybe he would balance out the backline at 13 with Kerevi at 12 but he has the least experience at 13, and that is probably even more critical on defence then 12, which isn't one of his strengths.

Agreed - JOC (James O'Connor) has lost much of the athleticism/ robustness that made him such a weapon in his younger days.

As you said he could maybe do a job as conservative inside centre (doubtful if he would add any net benefit over current options) and you definitely don't want him any wider than that.

 

[eastman]

In saying all that though - who's quicker over 20 metres out of Hodge and JOC (James O'Connor)?

 

[dru]

In saying all that though - who's quicker over 20 metres out of Hodge and JOC (James O'Connor)?

More than that. If JOC (James O'Connor) starts it is at 10. Fine. If he is on the bench, and there is an injury somewhere - he'll do fine. It works whatever your thoughts on ageing. And recently the rugby ageists hit a little glitch. Not terminal perhaps, but a glitch all the same.

 

[Members Section]

I actually rate Tates box kicking, it has been pretty good this year. Under-rated part of this game.

Whites experience and decision making was certainly handy last match. Hard to seperate them. Happy if either started, but personally just love seeing Tate in full flight, so good to watch.

It has significantly improved, his ratio of "successful" would be lower than Nic's but compared to this time last year his is streets ahead.