Wallabies 2019 Thread

[Derpus]

Yeah, i dunno why Foley has stopped taking the ball to the line. But it was the best aspect of his play and its gone.

 

[Slim 293]

Thanks Derpus.
Fair call on the defense capabilities of a 10. I guess I'm just so irritated with the work of Nathan Grey that this could be a Knee Jerk reaction.
There are more layers to this;
The options that i think will be considered are; Foley, Cooper, Beale and To'omua.
Each of the other 3 players have fatal flaws that ultimately ruled them out, of which defense was a common denominator.
Ie
Beale at 10; ( Runs sideways and ruins the space for others, but is fast and can kick + needs to be hidden in D )
Quade ( Yellow card magnet that hasn't been the same since he did his knee in RWC 2011 vs Wales. + needs to be hidden in D)
Foley ( Kicking too short. Dropping into the pocket + Needs to be Hidden in D ).

And all four of those options play for two teams, with To'omua to miss most of the Super Rugby season and then most likely play inside centre when he returns.........

 

[Rebels3]

Yeah, i dunno why Foley has stopped taking the ball to the line. But it was the best aspect of his play and its gone.

I suspect the structures are the biggest problem, although on saying that the players aren't savvy enough to realise this mid game.

The out the back, second man play is an epidemic in Australian rugby, the receiving second receiver is receiving it so far back they are either in line or behind their support play or options. Its leaving three options against the rush defense, crab sideways to get around the shooting defender, shuffle the ball to the stagnate support player or hack the ball down field so they don't get isolated.

If we are going to play this style, the initial receiver needs to be very flat. If you watch the NRL, where this tactic has come from, they use a forward to draw the ball back as they are on a hiding to nothing. The player passing it back will turn their shoulders beyond square at the line meaning they are going to get belted, but 1-2 defenders will be committed and the second receiver will get the ball 8-10m behind the gain line. Whats happening to us, is our receivers aren't flat enough, or not willing to get beaten and bashed every time they attempt the draw back, meaning they are 2-3m behind the gain line when it happens, our second receiver is then 10-13m behind the gain line on receiving and this is where the stagnant of crabbing options arise.

 

[Derpus]

Has Lilo officially retired from international duties?

 

[Joe Blow]

Dare I say it but that is Quades forte. Standing very flat and delivering accurate balls, sometimes taking on the line.
He seemed to take on the line less more recentlyat Super or test level but that may have been tactical.

It is risky and generally there are more errors but the payoff is good.

 

[fatprop]

Dare I say it but that is Quades forte. Standing very flat and delivering accurate balls, sometimes taking on the line.
He seemed to take on the line less more recentlyat Super or test level but that may have been tactical.

It is risky and generally there are more errors but the payoff is good.

It all comes down to providing efficient, quick front foot ball. Without that they all end up 15m back

 

[A mutterer]

Yeah, i dunno why Foley has stopped taking the ball to the line. But it was the best aspect of his play and its gone.

anything that a player stops doing is something he has been told to stop doing by the coaches.

i'd say it might be a part of the overly complicated running around way behind the gain line tactics and plays that bernie seems so fond of.

 

[fatprop]

anything that a player stops doing is something he has been told to stop doing by the coaches.

i'd say it might be a part of the overly complicated running around way behind the gain line tactics and plays that bernie seems so fond of.

With back foot ball combined with rush defences - there isn't a lot of opportunity to jam the gain line in attack

 

[southsider]

With back foot ball combined with rush defences - there isn't a lot of opportunity to jam the gain line in attack

We have the forward pack to get that front foot ball, just need to select non-powder puffs in the second row and a balanced back row, put that with Kerevi, Kuridrani, Koroibete crashballing when needed and cooper should (hopefully) have all the time he needs

 

[Derpus]

We have the forward pack to get that front foot ball, just need to select non-powder puffs in the second row and a balanced back row, put that with Kerevi, Kuridrani, Koroibete crashballing when needed and cooper should (hopefully) have all the time he needs

Sort of. The big bruising packs like South Africa and England have not really hand any problem containing our forwards.

 

[KOB1987]

And all four of those options play for two teams, with To'omua to miss most of the Super Rugby season and then most likely play inside centre when he returns...

Good, that’s his position.

I was listening to the rugby ruckus podcast today and they focused on three plays from the game, all of them tries to England and all of them were in some way attributable to To'omua rushing out of the line in defence and creating a gaping hole. Doing things on his own rather than as a team. In fairness I do think the system was part of that.

BUT - 17 points were also attributable to him kicking down their throats. There is no doubt some overlap in the points scored here and above. Again, systems were probably largely to blame.

I’m not saying he’s to blame for it all, as I’ve said repeatedly I like him at 12. But he’s not an international standard fly half.

 

[Derpus]

Good, that’s his position.

I was listening to the rugby ruckus podcast today and they focused on three plays from the game, all of them tries to England and all of them were in some way attributable to To'omua rushing out of the line in defence and creating a gaping hole. Doing things on his own rather than as a team. In fairness I do think the system was part of that.

BUT - 17 points were also attributable to him kicking down their throats. There is no doubt some overlap in the points scored here and above. Again, systems were probably largely to blame.

I’m not saying he’s to blame for it all, as I’ve said repeatedly I like him at 12. But he’s not an international standard fly half.

But, he is someone that people who particularly dislike Foley can point to and say 'him, he's the 10 we need'. Which is pretty much how he got picked in the first place.

See Beale before him.

Also see the litany of people pointing out that, actually, they aren't that good at 10.

I personally think Cheika knew what he was getting himself into when he started both of them at 10, but what choice did he have? one year out and still no back-up 10.

I'm really hoping Quade and/or Stewart really kill it at the start of next year.

 

[Up the Guts]

But, he is someone that people who particularly dislike Foley can point to and say 'him, he's the 10 we need'. Which is pretty much how he got picked in the first place.

See Beale before him.

Also see the litany of people pointing out that, actually, they aren't that good at 10.

I personally think Cheika knew what he was getting himself into when he started both of them at 10, but what choice did he have? one year out and still no back-up 10.

I'm really hoping Quade and/or Stewart really kill it at the start of next year.

To some extent Australian Rugby is really relying on Quade killing it.

 

[MarkJ]

If we're hoping on a flyhalf returning to the form they showed many years ago, then can I put in a request for 2012 vintage Lealiifano rather than Cooper?

 

[fatprop]

We seem to still be under the premise that a new coach will solve all ills

This is cut from a comment in the SMH - food for thought

Since 2012 in the u20's Rugby World Cup Australia has finished 8th,7th, 5th, 5th, 6th, 6th and 5th in 2018. These are players who should right now be at the peak of their game. If they were only ever 6th, 7th or 8th best how do we expect them to be near the best now.

 

[MarkJ]

Msybe the U20s coaches have been crap too?

 

[Derpus]

If we're hoping on a flyhalf returning to the form they showed many years ago, then can I put in a request for 2012 vintage Lealiifano rather than Cooper?

Both would be good.

 

[Spruce Moose]

We seem to still be under the premise that a new coach will solve all ills

This is cut from a comment in the SMH - food for thought

Think I wouldn't read too much into U20 rugby, for sure its a place to promote young guys to learn the stepping stones to test rugby. However we shouldn't push them to win at all costs rather learn the basics and also instill a good culture/team work in them from a young age.
Our best finish was in 2010 (2nd) so technically all those guys are 28 now and our team should be great according to SMH? On the other hand you have Ireland who on average finish 8th/9th (one 4th and a 2nd) and they are best team in test rugby atm. So think it shows that a good coach can make a good test rugby team out of 15 non-superstars.

 

[RugbyReg]

Think I wouldn't read too much into U20 rugby, for sure its a place to promote young guys to learn the stepping stones to test rugby. However we shouldn't push them to win at all costs rather learn the basics and also instill a good culture/team work in them from a young age.
Our best finish was in 2010 (2nd) so technically all those guys are 28 now and our team should be great according to SMH? On the other hand you have Ireland who on average finish 8th/9th (one 4th and a 2nd) and they are best team in test rugby atm. So think it shows that a good coach can make a good test rugby team out of 15 non-superstars.

yep Ireland's history is:

2018 - 11th
2017 - 10th
2016 - 2nd
2015 - 7th
2014 - 4th
2013 - 8th
2012 - 5th

 

[Brumby Runner]

Just saw the tail end of the world's shortest press conference where Clyne stated that the board is going through the process of its review and will be done by Christmas. Hope he was simply being smart arse with the last comment.