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Wallabies 2019 Thread

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Bobby Sands

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John S said:
Does Lord Laurie even want in? I thought he was happy back at the Brumbies?
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No idea, but this is hypothetical, and Stiles is not the answer. I’d rather get a forwards coach from England.
 
dru

dru

David Wilson (68)
It may well be that we can do better than Stiles. But it’s premature to write him off I think, especially re forwards.
 
Adam84

Adam84

Rod McCall (65)
I think Australia needs to discriminate between forwards coach and set piece coach.. seemed to be plenty of formers props/hookers in the role of forwards coaches, but reality is most of these older props/hookers were rubbish at general forwards play because it wasn’t as expected of them.

I guess what I’m saying, coaching needs to seperate the roles of set piece and forwards coaching role, because when we’re good at scrums, mauls line outs; we suck at rucks, running lines and collisions.

Stiles and Foley are examples of this. Good set price coaches, but their forwards sucked elsewhere around the park.
 
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Bobby Sands

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upthereds#! said:
Oh I agree, but that 4 man combo (rennie, taylor, wisemantel, stiles) were written up in an article recently as targets. Stiles is highly regarded for his set piece nous which is fair enough.
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Is it?

I didn’t see him do anything at the Reds or Force for that matter. Even when our scrum was very good it wasn’t a weapon.

Not shooting the messenger, would just be disappointed.

Tattsy Taylor would be a massive upgrade on Grey though.
 
molman

molman

Jim Lenehan (48)
Adam84 said:
I think Australia needs to discriminate between forwards coach and set piece coach.. seemed to be plenty of formers props/hookers in the role of forwards coaches, but reality is most of these older props/hookers were rubbish at general forwards play because it wasn’t as expected of them.
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Adam84 said:
I guess what I’m saying, coaching needs to seperate the roles of set piece and forwards coaching role, because when we’re good at scrums, mauls line outs; we suck at rucks, running lines and collisions.

Stiles and Foley are examples of this. Good set price coaches, but their forwards sucked elsewhere around the park.
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Not to harp on about Japan, but to see the footwork their forwards put in going into contact, they just always seemed to edge the ad line even without being the biggest (or I suspect most powerful) players. Just really good detail and just so consistent. They were just smart about contact. Their ruck work, cleanouts and the way they presented for the 9 was a masterclass, not to mention their hands, such that the offloading in tight even by the big boys was beyond impressive at times. I think there is a lot to be gained in our forwards continuing to refine a smart game around their role. Someone like Tupou could be a world beater if he has the right people around him, helping him to develop. He's got all the attributes in spades, power, speed, agility.

So yes, I agree, I think there is a distinct range of skills that need developing. Potentially the old structure of assistant coaches doesn't make as much sense in an age where things transition fluidly from 1 to 15. Maybe there is a place for more expertise in certain areas of the coaching team the same way many teams have had specialist kicking coaches.
 
upthereds#!

upthereds#!

Peter Johnson (47)
Bobby Sands said:
Is it?

I didn’t see him do anything at the Reds or Force for that matter. Even when our scrum was very good it wasn’t a weapon.

Not shooting the messenger, would just be disappointed.

Tattsy Taylor would be a massive upgrade on Grey though.
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SMH article about Cheika going to France/Argentina discusses it. https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-...tpellier-after-world-cup-20191009-p52z69.html

In case this is protected by a paywall, After talking about Rennie there is this, which is followed by a brief explanation of each of them - I've included Stiles one for you

"Of all the potential candidates for assistant coaching roles, the likes of Nick Stiles (forwards), Matt Taylor (defence) and Scott Wisemantel (attack) are being touted as the top targets."

Stiles has recently recruited Quade Cooper and Will Genia to second division Japanese team Kintetsu but has long been on RA's list of overseas-based Australians they want to bring home. He is widely regarded as one of Australia's top forwards and set piece coaches.
 
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Bobby Sands

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upthereds#! said:
SMH article about Cheika going to France/Argentina discusses it. https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-...tpellier-after-world-cup-20191009-p52z69.html

In case this is protected by a paywall, After talking about Rennie there is this, which is followed by a brief explanation of each of them - I've included Stiles one for you

"Of all the potential candidates for assistant coaching roles, the likes of Nick Stiles (forwards), Matt Taylor (defence) and Scott Wisemantel (attack) are being touted as the top targets."

Stiles has recently recruited Quade Cooper and Will Genia to second division Japanese team Kintetsu but has long been on RA's list of overseas-based Australians they want to bring home. He is widely regarded as one of Australia's top forwards and set piece coaches.
Click to expand...

The TSS coach before Tattsy was a bloke called John Mulvihill who currently is head coach of Cardiff. He has never really been embraced completely in Australia but is a very good coach. Not directly relevant to Stiles though as he is primarily a backs coach.
 
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Adam84

Adam84

Rod McCall (65)
Bobby Sands said:
Is it?

I didn’t see him do anything at the Reds or Force for that matter. Even when our scrum was very good it wasn’t a weapon.

Not shooting the messenger, would just be disappointed.

Tattsy Taylor would be a massive upgrade on Grey though.
Click to expand...


I have a different memory of the Reds scrum in 2015-2016, my memory is that the scrum was about the only thing the team had going for it and in one of those seasons topped the count for most forced penalties. Holmes moved overseas at the end of 2016, but Stiles helped Holmes become the form THP in Australia those last 2 years he was in Australia. Sam Talakai took over as THP in 2016? and was been spoken about as a future wallaby when he first arrived on the scene. I'd say Talakais form plateaud around 2017.

Stiles is a very good set piece coach, he isn't a very good forwards coach or head coach.
 
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Bobby Sands

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Adam84 said:
I have a different memory of the Reds scrum in 2015-2016, my memory is that the scrum was about the only thing the team had going for it and in one of those seasons topped the count for most forced penalties. Holmes moved overseas at the end of 2016, but Stiles helped Holmes become the form THP in Australia those last 2 years he was in Australia. Sam Talakai took over as THP in 2016? and was been spoken about as a future wallaby when he first arrived on the scene. I'd say Talakais form plateaud around 2017.

Stiles is a very good set piece coach, he isn't a very good forwards coach or head coach.
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Was the scrum a weapon Adam? Did we get penalty tries? Did we win opposition feeds, and extract penalties?

That was the point, in spite of the scrums being very good as written.

I don’t want to have an obtuse argument mate.

In summary, Stiles is a glorified scrum coach.
 
Tomikin

Tomikin

David Codey (61)
Adam84 said:
I think Australia needs to discriminate between forwards coach and set piece coach.. seemed to be plenty of formers props/hookers in the role of forwards coaches, but reality is most of these older props/hookers were rubbish at general forwards play because it wasn’t as expected of them.

I guess what I’m saying, coaching needs to seperate the roles of set piece and forwards coaching role, because when we’re good at scrums, mauls line outs; we suck at rucks, running lines and collisions.

Stiles and Foley are examples of this. Good set price coaches, but their forwards sucked elsewhere around the park.
Click to expand...
This is so true, Stiles was a great scrum coach but his time at the Reds they were shit at the ruck and maul and general play. Its a special kinda coach that can get the scrum and lineout going but also deal with the rest of the forward play. Its why we love Lord Laurie his really good at all of it, but he also seems to love having a specific scrum coach with him..
 
Tomikin

Tomikin

David Codey (61)
Bobby Sands said:
Was the scrum a weapon Adam? Did we get penalty tries? Did we win opposition feeds, and extract penalties?

That was the point, in spite of the scrums being very good as written.

I don’t want to have an obtuse argument mate.

In summary, Stiles is a glorified scrum coach.
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Yep I would take Lord Laurie and his bob cap every day of the week. I think Stiles could though become a very good coach, just needs time learning other aspects. I dont want him lost, but coaching Japan England anywhere else, will probably do him a world of good... But he had as bad or worst record then Dick Graham..
 
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Bobby Sands

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Tomikin said:
Yep I would take Lord Laurie and his bob cap every day of the week. I think Stiles could though become a very good coach, just needs time learning other aspects. I dont want him lost, but coaching Japan England anywhere else, will probably do him a world of good. But he had as bad or worst record then Dick Graham..
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Dick Graham didn’t even hold a gig in Georgia for long, Qlds’s darkest days.
 
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