U18 Academy Games and Australia U18s

[InsiderScoop]

Watching the Australian U18’s “trial” games in Canberra to pick a touring team to go to NZ next week. If I was NZ I wouldn’t be concerned as it is some of the worst rugby I have seen in a longtime. I cannot believe that the majority of these players are in academies…..

Completely agree. Embarrassing that Aussie schools are even winning at half time against the u18s.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Score?

 

[InsiderScoop]

Score?

12-7 with 15 to go

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Standouts for either?

 

[Brian O’Driscoll]

Schools just won 12-7 Australia was abysmal. The academies need to have a good hard look at themselves especially the reds because the majority were embarrassing. Howard was good, Grenfell that would be it from the Reds. Again NSW will have the majority.

 

[farrellybros]

I think

Schools just won 12-7 Australia was abysmal. The academies need to have a good hard look at themselves especially the reds because the majority were embarrassing. Howard was good, Grenfell that would be it from the Reds. Again NSW will have the majority.

My thoughts were that some (and only some) of the Aus 18's were good and clearly deserved to be there but there is a critical lack of depth in some positions (won;t mention which ones due to the fact it identifies certain boys but safe to say they are largely in key positions) and more than a handful of the Rugby AU 18's squad were not up to the task today. Perhaps to your point regarding Academies - some of the boys today looked like they had benefitted from that style pf program and did well - others including some of the headline names had a day they will not remember favourably.

 

[farrellybros]

Standouts for either?

Ata guess and by position:
Prop: Langi/Hill
Hooker: Kruger
Lock: Thomson
Backrow: Langi
9: Grover
10: Fowler (the younger)
Wing: Possibly Hartman
Centre: Takai
Fullback: Poynton

 

[Ringer From the Top End]

Did you have to pay to watch?

 

[Raytah]

Standouts for either?

- Heinz Lomoto looked class at 8
- Bassingthwaite looked good at 15
- Fittler got isolated a couple of times but was bending the line.
- Makasini looked a handful on the sting
- Liked the look og Rylands and Robinson in the backrow
- Fonua and Thompson looked solid in the row.
- Hill looked promising at THP. One of the Looseheads looked okay but didn't catch his name.

 

[The Whisperer]

When is the final squad named?

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

First of all. Well done to Aus Schools. Great effort to get an underdog win and play with a chip on your shoulder.

It's somewhat good to read the names most thought would be good performers, perform at least. Grover, Fonua Makasini...

Lemoto is a handful every time I saw him play this year. Seems simplistic he was shoved at 12 for a couple of games for Scots when he's clearly an effective 8. Can't see league letting this guy go. He's the prototype metre eater for them.

@Raytah could the other Prop have been Goddard? Didn't see the game but I rate him highly as a prospect.

 

[Game_Day_Ritual]

Watching the Australian U18’s “trial” games in Canberra to pick a touring team to go to NZ next week. If I was NZ I wouldn’t be concerned as it is some of the worst rugby I have seen in a longtime. I cannot believe that the majority of these players are in academ

I think

My thoughts were that some (and only some) of the Aus 18's were good and clearly deserved to be there but there is a critical lack of depth in some positions (won;t mention which ones due to the fact it identifies certain boys but safe to say they are largely in key positions) and more than a handful of the Rugby AU 18's squad were not up to the task today. Perhaps to your point regarding Academies - some of the boys today looked like they had benefitted from that style pf program and did well - others including some of the headline names had a day they will not remember favourably.

The system simply just isn't working in Oz.

1. We are now ranked 10th in the world was 9th.
2. 2024 Waratahs ran dead last.
3. We have an obsession with academies and would rather a kid not play club/school and attend an 1.5hr academy session.
4. The fast improvers have been the UK based teams over past 10-15 years. Reason why is the kids play like 20-25 games per season, whereby we play 10-12 tops. The system needs a complete overhall.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

The system simply just isn't working in Oz.

1. We are now ranked 10th in the world was 9th.
2. 2024 Waratahs ran dead last.
3. We have an obsession with academies and would rather a kid not play club/school and attend an 1.5hr academy session.
4. The fast improvers have been the UK based teams over past 10-15 years. Reason why is the kids play like 20-25 games per season, whereby we play 10-12 tops. The system needs a complete overhall.

Not trying to defend RA because they have been a disaster for 20 years which is a large part of why we are 10th in the world. Tahs are a smaller version of this and have recruited and retained poorly for a decade since winning a title.

I will say our players do get 20-25 games in now. They use to not but just this season in the Sydney GPS you would have played at least 15 games for your School not counting any games in the holidays while in camp or tour which many get another 2-3 in a year. Then if picked for a rep side you add another 2 at least. Go further and there will be state games and now these rep games will take most of them to 23-25 games for the year.
We have an absolutely shit platform for kids to go out on after they leave the age system. We shove them into Club comps build on a foundation from the amateur days and expect it to create pros. Then we smash some kid who isn't up to it when they get thrown out there for Tahs. Don't tell the Clubs this though because they are very important if you go ask their Director of Rugby and pop gun positions that they like to think is like being an NFL GM but really it's who can get another $100 on top of a match payment for a couple extra players. They have zero incentive or care in making Rugby better but rather get the pats on the back at the local.

 

[moa999]

Question is what's the solution.

A Colts Super Rugby comp might help grow and protect the players, but it's not going to generate much $s to even cover travel costs, let alone be able to compete with NRL $s.

 

[Steve_Grey]

Question is what's the solution.

A Colts Super Rugby comp might help grow and protect the players, but it's not going to generate much $s to even cover travel costs, let alone be able to compete with NRL $s.

It is a good idea - but I think you need to raise the age to maybe U23, as there are limited showcase opportunities after U20s as a group (some play Grade, some give up, some go to NRL etc.)

 

[Steve_Grey]

Not trying to defend RA because they have been a disaster for 20 years which is a large part of why we are 10th in the world. Tahs are a smaller version of this and have recruited and retained poorly for a decade since winning a title.

I will say our players do get 20-25 games in now. They use to not but just this season in the Sydney GPS you would have played at least 15 games for your School not counting any games in the holidays while in camp or tour which many get another 2-3 in a year. Then if picked for a rep side you add another 2 at least. Go further and there will be state games and now these rep games will take most of them to 23-25 games for the year.
We have an absolutely shit platform for kids to go out on after they leave the age system. We shove them into Club comps build on a foundation from the amateur days and expect it to create pros. Then we smash some kid who isn't up to it when they get thrown out there for Tahs. Don't tell the Clubs this though because they are very important if you go ask their Director of Rugby and pop gun positions that they like to think is like being an NFL GM but really it's who can get another $100 on top of a match payment for a couple extra players. They have zero incentive or care in making Rugby better but rather get the pats on the back at the local.

Not sure about the 23-25 games? Sydney AAGPS play 10 games each season (home and away for 6 teams). Couple of trial games, and a couple of rep games.

15 games if you are lucky? Or has the season expanded to more than home/away now?

 

[Steve_Grey]

The system simply just isn't working in Oz.

1. We are now ranked 10th in the world was 9th.
2. 2024 Waratahs ran dead last.
3. We have an obsession with academies and would rather a kid not play club/school and attend an 1.5hr academy session.
4. The fast improvers have been the UK based teams over past 10-15 years. Reason why is the kids play like 20-25 games per season, whereby we play 10-12 tops. The system needs a complete overhall.

We should steal/copy the UK approach in my opinion - support / align our Clubs and put academies in / on top of each of the Clubs.

Exactly what England does (not putting them on a pedestal, but they have just won the U20s World Cup).

That allows for more players in the academy system, and allows for more meritocracy of movement. The English system is brutal - the moment a player is not meeting KPIs, they are put on notice to improve or they leave and are replaced in the academy.

We can still have State Representative matches, but take the responsibility away from the Super Rugby Franchises for the Academies.

In fact, we should have way more representative State Matches over the year so the players can put their hands up for selection to JWBs and beyond - and I would extend the State vs State Matches to include a new level of U23 to keep those interested after U20s.....sort of a stepping stone towards Super Rugby or even Australia A.

This all relies on collaboration between Clubs and RA - easier said than done of course

 

[Mule]

New Waratah Fittler, Makasani included as Australia U18s squad named for New Zealand tour

www.rugby.com.au

 

[Rugby Survivor]

Not trying to defend RA because they have been a disaster for 20 years which is a large part of why we are 10th in the world. Tahs are a smaller version of this and have recruited and retained poorly for a decade since winning a title.

I will say our players do get 20-25 games in now. They use to not but just this season in the Sydney GPS you would have played at least 15 games for your School not counting any games in the holidays while in camp or tour which many get another 2-3 in a year. Then if picked for a rep side you add another 2 at least. Go further and there will be state games and now these rep games will take most of them to 23-25 games for the year.
We have an absolutely shit platform for kids to go out on after they leave the age system. We shove them into Club comps build on a foundation from the amateur days and expect it to create pros. Then we smash some kid who isn't up to it when they get thrown out there for Tahs. Don't tell the Clubs this though because they are very important if you go ask their Director of Rugby and pop gun positions that they like to think is like being an NFL GM but really it's who can get another $100 on top of a match payment for a couple extra players. They have zero incentive or care in making Rugby better but rather get the pats on the back at the local.

That is a pretty unfair comment on what the clubs do and their respective Colts coaches or Directors of Rugby. If you did not have the clubs or those employees then you don't have somewhere for those school graduates to play. The clubs provide the structure and coaches for training up to three times per week. They support those players with S&C and medical throughout the whole year. They do this without any funding support from Rugby Australia. We need a better pathway for the elite players but if they don't play for their club they aren't playing in any other competition.
The pathways have been poorly coached and I must say poorly identified for a long time. How can you have the third rate Australian Schools team beating the supposedly Australian U18's team. It is a joke and the people in those positions who have done the selections need to have a big hard look at themselves and what they are actually doing at the selection table.

 

[hituplover]

whats the go with no jaques, brial, poyton, le maitire etc.

Did they just not pick the best players ?. Surley they are not all injured