The Wallabies Thread

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Thinking about it further, we could also see Rob Horne play in the centres with the injury situation being as it is too.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Being on his feet is about all he has at the moment. Leali'ifano is showing nothing of late to convince me he is the answer. I mean the past few years have shown not even Larkham knows where to play him or To'omua. Or how. I struggle to remember which combo actually worked in the past 2 years. It's a problem.

I agree that he's not playing consistently good atm, but I have always thought he goes better at 12 than 10. Nonetheless, if not CL, then who else is there to play 12 for the Wallabies, assuming Kerevi, Beale and To'omua are all unavailable?

It looks like we will be scratching to put a test standard backline together for June, but just as critical will be the makeup of the reserve bench. Surely, there will be opportunities for a few smokies to get a run, or will Cheika be forced to bring players like Giteau and Mitchell back from Europe?

The current list of backline scratchings looks likely to be:

Beale, Tomane, Speight, To'omua, Kerevi.

I think the starters atm would probably be:

Folau, DHP, Kuridrani, Lealiifano, Horne, Foley, Phipps, with bench players coming from Hunt, Morahan, Godwin, Debreczini, Frisby and Stirzaker. Any others?

 

[cyclopath]

I agree that he's not playing consistently good atm, but I have always thought he goes better at 12 than 10. Nonetheless, if not CL, then who else is there to play 12 for the Wallabies, assuming Kerevi, Beale and To'omua are all unavailable?

It looks like we will be scratching to put a test standard backline together for June, but just as critical will be the makeup of the reserve bench. Surely, there will be opportunities for a few smokies to get a run, or will Cheika be forced to bring players like Giteau and Mitchell back from Europe?

The current list of backline scratchings looks likely to be:

Beale, Tomane, Speight, To'omua, Kerevi.

I think the starters atm would probably be:

Folau, DHP, Kuridrani, Lealiifano, Horne, Foley, Phipps, with bench players coming from Hunt, Morahan, Godwin, Debreczini, Frisby and Stirzaker. Any others?

Which is, as I said, the problem.
The Brumbies threads, and several Wallabies threads over the past 2-3 years have been littered with discussions about where to play Leali'ifano and To'omua, and it would be hard to say there has ever been consensus. You like them switched to what they are currently playing, but I remember many arguing the opposite for similar reasons.
They are both fine players, but I honestly don't think they have ever been able to settle completely and confidently in one place for long enough - obviously injuries have been a factor too for both which is unfortunate.
Either at their best are obviously quality Test players.
With the way injuries are mounting, it may be that Cheika re-thinks the position he has stated previously about overseas based Wallabies for this series.
I can't see Debreczini being in the team this year; Godwin - who knows? He might be good enough but he's never been allowed to show it consistently enough in the Force style of play. I suspect he's easily good enough to be a Test 12. Dunno if we'll see it this year.

 

[Slim 293]

I would assume that unless Cheika manages to get Giteau back, Lilo will be the frontrunner having been around the Wobs squad for the past few years...........

Hopefully they can get a bit more out of him at 12 playing alongside Foley.

 

[boyo]

As Eddie Jones once famously said: you need one who mostly plays on the ball, and one who mostly plays off the ball, and one who's sometimes on and sometimes off the ball.

Channelling Donald Rumsfeld?

 

[Brumby Runner]

@Cyclo, I wasn't trying to further the discussion about the best spots for To'omua/Lealiifano, but rather to look at what the Wallabies might look like, both starting and bench, in light of the injury toll.

It's probably true that Jack Debreczini hasn't progressed as well as we would have hoped this year, but in reality is there another back up No 10 in the Aussie teams who might sit on the bench - I think not. No good falling into the Brumbies' trap either of planning to use Lealiifano as a starting player and also to cover 10, with the paucity of test quality or proven No 12s currently available.

I can quite readily see one of Jack or Godwin on the bench to cover 10, 12, 13. Wing/Fullback then would go to DHP/Horne/Folau with Morahan, maybe English (with some experience around the Wallabies), Hunt also in the equation.

An alternative backline might look like DHP, English, Folau, Lealiifano, Horne, Foley, Phipps with Kuridrani plus either of Godwin or Debreczini on the bench with Stirzaker/Frisby. All I can say is that I hope we don't get any more serious injuries either before or during June. We really are near rock bottom for players atm.

 

[cyclopath]

@Cyclo, I wasn't trying to further the discussion about the best spots for To'omua/Lealiifano, but rather to look at what the Wallabies might look like, both starting and bench, in light of the injury toll.

It's probably true that Jack Debreczini hasn't progressed as well as we would have hoped this year, but in reality is there another back up No 10 in the Aussie teams who might sit on the bench - I think not. No good falling into the Brumbies' trap either of planning to use Lealiifano as a starting player and also to cover 10, with the paucity of test quality or proven No 12s currently available.

I can quite readily see one of Jack or Godwin on the bench to cover 10, 12, 13. Wing/Fullback then would go to DHP/Horne/Folau with Morahan, maybe English (with some experience around the Wallabies), Hunt also in the equation.

An alternative backline might look like DHP, English, Folau, Lealiifano, Horne, Foley, Phipps with Kuridrani plus either of Godwin or Debreczini on the bench with Stirzaker/Frisby. All I can say is that I hope we don't get any more serious injuries either before or during June. We really are near rock bottom for players atm.

I realise that, but I think it is a significant factor as to why he might not be the next logical automatic choice for Cheika, even with the injury toll. If he was a settled and firing 12, it's a no-brainer.
I will be very surprised if Jack D is in the Wallabies 23 this year.

 

[cyclopath]

Thinking about it further, we could also see Rob Horne play in the centres with the injury situation being as it is too.

It's possible, but Cheika seems to favour a different skill set to Horne at 12, his defence obviously being the exception in my statement. I'm sure he favours a defender like that! And between Kuridrani and maybe Folau, it seems that 13 is covered. Although with Beale gone, I think the chance of Folau playing 13 at Wallaby level has dropped.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Like you @Cyclo, I can't see Horne being used in the centres for the tests, except maybe for defense. Kuridrani will probably start 13 given the injury to Beale, with Folau at 15. But who would be the bench cover for 10 if not Debreczini? I think the only alternative would be Godwin, but I'd rather have Jack than Kyle based on recent form. Is there a 10 overseas whom Cheika might bring back? Quade?

 

[Caputo]

You're assuming that the bench is 5/3 it wouldn't surprise me he goes 6/2.
I would be 21. Frisby 22. Hunt 23. Morahan.

 

[Gnostic]

The loss of Beale is more significant than just covering 12. The lack of wingers in Australia who can kick effectively is a huge risk against England and the ABs. The Tahs got absolutely mullered last year more than a few times because they didn't have effective back three kicking options.

With the loss of Beale, Folau will certainly play 15 and while he has improved a bit his kicking is not to be relied upon again and again. That would leave Foley dropping back all the time to cover and against a fast counter it would leave the Wallabies badly exposed.

We can rightly assume with the injuries and incumbency that Folau and Horne are starters, IMO that means that the second wingers has to be a second 15/ accomplished kicker and the 12 should also be a foil for Foley.

Like Cyclo I question whether Lilo has shown much in the past few years to show he is the man, but he is last one standing with the experience in Oz. Again given what we know he is capable of, I'm left worried by Larkham's lack of demonstrated ability to have a functioning backline at the Brumbies for more than a game or two.

The final problem is who is going to be the reserve 10? It may well be that Lilo doesn't start at 12 but is benched as that reserve and we see a left field candidate on at 12.

 

[Froggy]

I think Lilo now has to be 12 based on the Bradbury rule.
Back-up 10 is a massive problem, best idea I can come up with is Harris.
I think back-up 9 is also a bit of a problem, Stirzacker has a reasonable pass, but is way out of form, only gets to every second ruck, is offering zero attacking threat and does little in defence. I was a big fan, but he's obviously one of those players who takes a long time to play himself back into form after injury.
Two players who really impressed me this weekend were Arnold and Ready. I think Arnold could be ready to join Simmons as run-on lock. Ready probably still has Taf in front of him for that bench hooker job, but he's certainly breathing down his neck.

 

[p.Tah]

After seeing Beale get injured I think Chek may be on the phone to Giteau

 

[galumay]

I really worry about the loss of Beale, I cant see any player in the wings that would be a good enough replacement. I agree with the assessment that his kicking will also be a loss difficult to replace.

The task against the poms has certainly got significantly harder, lets hope cheika has a master plan!

 

[Highlander35]

Gits is still injured as far as I'm aware.

 

[RebelYell]

Harris was at the Wallaby camp at Cockatoo Island, I wouldn't rule out him getting the call-up. Jack's certainly not ready, Hodge's versatility probably puts him into the mix in a 1 on 1 battle with KHunt

 

[Brumby Runner]

Have to admit I'd forgotten about Mikey Mike, but he is tried and tested at this level and will no doubt come into Cheika's deliberations. He could be a chance of starting at 12, or be a good bench option covering 10, 12 and 15.

 

[Groucho]

I realise that, but I think it is a significant factor as to why he might not be the next logical automatic choice for Cheika, even with the injury toll. If he was a settled and firing 12, it's a no-brainer.
I will be very surprised if Jack D is in the Wallabies 23 this year.

I'll eat my Wallaby jersey if Debra gets a run. The Canterbury one, with the chewy textured man-bra. Debraczini has all the flakiness of the young Amigos, with little of the exceptional performance upside. Obviously he'll get better, but not yet

 

[Groucho]

Harris was at the Wallaby camp at Cockatoo Island, I wouldn't rule out him getting the call-up. Jack's certainly not ready, Hodge's versatility probably puts him into the mix in a 1 on 1 battle with KHunt

Hodge must be considered a real possibility. He's what Godwin promised to be, with added sidestep.

 

[Groucho]

The loss of Beale is more significant than just covering 12. The lack of wingers in Australia who can kick effectively is a huge risk against England and the ABs. The Tahs got absolutely mullered last year more than a few times because they didn't have effective back three kicking options.

With the loss of Beale, Folau will certainly play 15 and while he has improved a bit his kicking is not to be relied upon again and again. That would leave Foley dropping back all the time to cover and against a fast counter it would leave the Wallabies badly exposed.

We can rightly assume with the injuries and incumbency that Folau and Horne are starters, IMO that means that the second wingers has to be a second 15/ accomplished kicker and the 12 should also be a foil for Foley.

Like Cyclo I question whether Lilo has shown much in the past few years to show he is the man, but he is last one standing with the experience in Oz. Again given what we know he is capable of, I'm left worried by Larkham's lack of demonstrated ability to have a functioning backline at the Brumbies for more than a game or two.

The final problem is who is going to be the reserve 10? It may well be that Lilo doesn't start at 12 but is benched as that reserve and we see a left field candidate on at 12.

Lilo can cover 10 perfectly well from the field. The priority is to get seven test-quality backs out there.