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The Rugby Championship 2016

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Scoey

Scoey

Tony Shaw (54)
Highlander35 said:
I loved that. I really really did. 100% correct decision. Don't know why there was any backlash.
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It's properly off topic but I can tell you why I thought it was a wrong decision. I was at the game. The Brumbies had won the game but were up by less than 7 so the Reds were going to get a BP. The Brumbies weren't going to benefit from us not getting a BP so correct decision was to put the ball out and take the win. Taking a shot at goal, they risked the ball hitting the posts and remaining in play. The way that game was going, I would've backed the Reds to get up the other end of the field and possibly steal the win. It was pretty self indulgent and I felt he was putting the team second to his own interests. Squeak wasn't the only Brumby not happy with it on the field.

But I digress. He's grown a shit load as a player since then but still. I think the Wallaby captain has to be Australian based.
 
Viking

Viking

Mark Ella (57)
Braveheart81 said:
There's not really any evidence to suggest that Pocock is a good captain either. His manner with referees is probably better but he doesn't necessarily do a good job of captaining a side in terms of decision making.

Maybe the Wallabies need to work hard on identifying who is the best communicator with referees and having a co-captain system.
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There is evidence he will be a good Captain. I think their is a crap load of evidence of Poey communicating to ref's in a good manner. You only have to look at Nigel Owen's comments post RWC final to see how respected he is by refs.

So in term's of effective ref communication there is no better in the wallabies. At least no evidence suggesting so.

Although I agree about your final statement. He has been given Captaincy before and often has made poor decisions. So the question is, can this be fixed easier then ref management? I think so, effective game-plan communication with the coach should be able to fix that pretty easily. I hope.

Only thing that worries me is Poey's body being able to hold up over the next couple of years, given the way he plays and how often he is bashed at rucks.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Maybe the answer is simple. Treat them like 12 year olds and have one of the assistant coaches on the bench with big signs saying "Scrum" "Lineout" "Posts" that they hold up each time a decision needs to be made.

Realistically those are the only choices the captain has to make that they can get wrong.

Then the captain's sole responsibility is dealing with the referee and the captain and senior players can all help rally the team and get them focused and firing.
 
Scrubber2050

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
Whichever way it proceeds nothing should be taken from the often important role a VC has towards the last 20 (if the captain has been injured or replaced)

More than ever our 15man game should really be called the 23man game Players get replaced. No problem if it is the Captaino as long as the VC is good.

Poey is a brilliant footballer, but a chap who has some personal views that may be contrary to many in the mainstream rugby hold. The only concern to me is that he may use the position to further publicise those views.

Would he be a good on-field captain - shit yes
Great player, respected by all
Good communicator with Referees
Has a great "standing" and "presence"

But sadly, he's pissing off next year.
May have to keep Stephen until his return.
 
Viking

Viking

Mark Ella (57)
We should probably move the captaincy talk to the wallabies 2016 and beyond thread.

I don't think Moore is going anywhere before the Rugby Championship.

Sure I would prefer to see another Captain, But I am one poster who actually believes the Captaincy has little bearing on the game.
 
Scrubber2050

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
Seb V said:
We should probably move the captaincy talk to the wallabies 2016 and beyond thread.

I don't think Moore is going anywhere before the Rugby Championship.

Sure I would prefer to see another Captain, But I am one poster who actually believes the Captaincy has little bearing on the game.
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Generally I'd agree but those big decisions make a difference

eg Pocock "lost" the test V Scotland at Newcastle by a bad decision
Hooper in the first test V AB's last year by taking a another scrum instead of the kick and another one I just cannot recall ATM

Sometimes matches are won or lost on the back of a good or bad decision.
 
upthereds#!

upthereds#!

Peter Johnson (47)
Read a large squad has been in training. Apart from the Brumbies players who are not there, and the Euros who are there (Meakes, gits, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), quade, mitchell & kepu) who else has got an invite? heard it was something like 45 people discluding brumbies....
 
KOB1987

KOB1987

John Eales (66)
Scrubber2050 said:
Generally I'd agree but those big decisions make a difference

eg Pocock "lost" the test V Scotland at Newcastle by a bad decision
Hooper in the first test V AB's last year by taking a another scrum instead of the kick and another one I just cannot recall ATM

Sometimes matches are won or lost on the back of a good or bad decision.
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Whether a decision is good or bad depends on the outcome of said decision, does it not? It's highly subjective.
 
G

galumay

Guest
Scrubber2050 said:
Generally I'd agree but those big decisions make a difference

eg Pocock "lost" the test V Scotland at Newcastle by a bad decision
Hooper in the first test V AB's last year by taking a another scrum instead of the kick and another one I just cannot recall ATM

Sometimes matches are won or lost on the back of a good or bad decision.
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Your argument is a logical fallacy though, there is no way of knowing what the outcome of an alternative decision would have been.
 
Strewthcobber

Strewthcobber

Simon Poidevin (60)
upthereds#! said:
Read a large squad has been in training. Apart from the Brumbies players who are not there, and the Euros who are there (Meakes, gits, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), quade, mitchell & kepu) who else has got an invite? heard it was something like 45 people discluding brumbies..
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Where is Gits at the moment? (posted 9 hrs ago...)

CoULuViWYAE68HO.jpg


 
G

galumay

Guest
Scrubber2050 said:
So where does logic play its part in the consideration of coming to a decision.
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Not sure what your point is. Mine is that its a logical fallacy to assume that had a different decision been made, that we can know what the outcome of that alternative reality would have been.

A simple example would be that had a captain chosen to go for a try instead of taking a penalty kick for goal, we cant assume that the kicker would have been successful, and there are also potentially many other outcomes, the opposition might have scored another try in the alternative reality, or made an error leading to a try to the other team, or a key player might have been injured, or a myriad of other possible things could happen affecting the outcome of the game.

The only we thing we can be objectively sure of is the outcome of the singular reality.
 
Groucho

Groucho

Greg Davis (50)
KOB1987 said:
Whether a decision is good or bad depends on the outcome of said decision, does it not? It's highly subjective.
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It depends on the outcome over time. The quality of a decision depends purely on the correctness of the risk analysis performed while making it, not the individual outcome. Guessing right is luck. Systems based on the exploitation of skill consistently win over systems based on the explotation of luck.
 
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