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The League Media

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mxyzptlk

Colin Windon (37)
Would you bring back the shoulder charge?

The stiff-arm tackle?

The spear tackle?
Hell, they should just bring back the tackle. That'd be a good start.

There's a lot of noise being made about the annual meeting -- the first time all the coaches have showed up, the problem with slowing down play in the tackle situation, the problem with the lowest offload rates and least desire to keep the ball alive leading to the most success, much of it stemming from turning the tackle into a slow-motion hug-crash.

There must be a middle ground between decapitating someone with a shoulder and three guys clinch-dancing with each other they gradually topple over. I think that'd just be a normal tackle, but I'm sure papabear will set me right. Now if they had a maul law --

(Was that short enough MrTabua?)
 

Lindommer

Simon Poidevin (60)
Staff member
My, somewhat flippant, description years ago of league as biff/bash/barge/pass/run/kick has been proven to be very prescient by subsequent events. I do wish Roy Masters had've had the good grace to acknowledge my prior observation. :cool:
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
What would your priorities be to "toughen" your preferred code up?

Would you bring back the shoulder charge?

The stiff-arm tackle?

The spear tackle?

Presumably a return to players keeping their heads in the sand and ignoring the damage smashing each other in the head does.

Matthew Johns wrote an article earlier this year that I thought was very good. Talked about the attitudes that used to exist and how everyone just considered it part of the game but then ignored the fact that lots of people were dying way too young.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...ys-matthew-johns/story-fni3fh9n-1226854212408
 
T

TOCC

Guest
If the top teams in the NRL want to play like England's national rugby union team, they're on their way.
You mean the England national rugby Union that beat the Wallabies on Saturday? Whose fans do you think were happier after the match?
 

mxyzptlk

Colin Windon (37)
You mean the England national rugby Union that beat the Wallabies on Saturday? Whose fans do you think were happier after the match?

TL;DR for MrTabua: Some Australian fans just want to see running rugby win or lose; Forward play is a lot more appreciated in the northern hemisphere; Top NRL teams are following an England-like rugby union game plan because it's effective under the current laws; Not every other NH country is a fan of England's style when the backs don't have much to do. Sorry man, this one was multiple paragraphs. Hope the abstract helps.

Depends on where you're watching from, I guess. There have been plenty of people on these boards who've said they're happy to see the Wallabies lose heroically, as long as they play ball-in-hand and "have a go." At the same time, there are plenty of people in England who are more than happy to watch 10-man rugby where the forwards just punch and bash it up the middle channels and the set piece sets the platform. Lately England only really brings in the backs (aside from a kicking fullback) when they're playing teams ranked 5th or below, teams they think they can take a risk against and if anything goes wrong, their forwards can win it back.

Plus the northern hemisphere just cares more about forward play and the set piece than Australia does. Some of the highest-paid players in the NH are tighthead props. Conversely, in the thread on what Australia can do about their scrum, there's been talk about Australian stigmas against being seen as fat, and how everyone wants to be a flash back growing up, not a thudding forward. Not that being a forward or a prop necessarily equals being fat, but that seems to be the impression.

Here's the ironic thing: Australian rugby and rugby league are renowned for ball-in-hand running rugby. League markets itself based on that premise, and that impression partly drives other Australian union teams to focus on a running rugby game -- gotta maintain that fan attention (which wouldn't be as much of a problem elsewhere). Yet the driver of that bus, the NRL, is the organization with more teams playing in the mode of the Old Enemy's rival code, driving the ball up with the forwards and keeping the offloads to a minimum. Why? Presumably because it works, but that's also partly because the rules allow for that kind of strategy. Apparently nothing is going to change, based on the annual meeting. When rugby saw a similar problem with slow rucks, they introduced the 5-second "use it" law, and that's pretty much taken care of that problem. (But at least there's still a contest for the ball at the rugby ruck, so even if it's not fired out in 1.5 seconds, it's usually because they're dealing with flankers and counter-rucking; they're not waiting for everyone to back off and reset themselves.)

For what it's worth, Australia isn't alone in questioning England's girth and heft-based gameplan. Some Irish commentators have noted just how big many of the England forwards are and how little the backs have to do except have foppish hair and stay clean. That'd never fly on a Joe Schmidt Ireland team; if a back isn't running lines, he'd better be hitting rucks, or he won't be on the field long. Just recently Matt Dawson was on the BBC talking about what the England locker room was like when he played for the national team. While the forwards were head-butting each other, he was making sure his hair was right, his shorts fit tight, and he put vaseline under his cheekbones so they'd "glisten" and he'd look good. Being concerned about whether you "glisten" or not just seems... wrong, like the backs have enough leisure and lack of pressure to concern themselves with such things. (But really -- glisten? FFS.)

So, different approaches, I guess. I know which I'd rather see, but if you don't have forwards that can at least neutralize an England or South African or French pack, all the scything backs in the world won't be able to cut through that wall.
 

papabear

Watty Friend (18)
I never said league needs to be tougher, I have made pretty clear what I think could help both codes.

As for mxys last essay as for league adopting a union style game play they will at least shift the ball if they are in an attacking zone but I am glad league is looking to keep out rules that help negative game plans IMO all games should.
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Es gibt einen Muskelmasse Gebäude Diät mehr als nur konsumieren Protein. ht rush Dennoch ist dies der größte Ort, wenn Sie möchten, dass Muskel, um Oberfläche zu starten. Vergessen Sie nicht, Ihren Fortschritt oft aufzuzeichnen. Außerdem ist es ratsam, einen Lebensmittel Tagesordnung zu Ihrem neuen Diät zu machen. Diszipliniert und angeordnet, ermöglicht es Ihnen, diese Muskelaufbau Ziele schneller zu erreichen.

It's spam and in a foreign tongue, but it could more sense than some posters on some threads some of the time.:)

The OP has been reported and the mods will probably hoover the post up soon.
 

mxyzptlk

Colin Windon (37)
As for mxys last essay as for league adopting a union style game play they will at least shift the ball if they are in an attacking zone
Are my posts too long for you, too? Don't tell me the attention span in Australia is worse than in the U.S.

League is particularly good at managing play within 15-20 meters of the try line. That's often where a lot of the best play occurs. But that doesn't mean there's something inherent in union that means rugby can't shift the ball around that same zone. England doesn't often do that, and neither do many Premiership teams, but that doesn't hold for union across the world (Waratahs under Cheika, Leinster up until Matt O'Connor -- a league guy -- took over, Munster, Harlequins, Exeter, Llanelli, most teams in New Zealand, recent Glasgow, and I know it happens in the Top 14 but I don't watch enough to say).

The big difference -- and its the big difference between union and league fans, or at least union fans and you -- is that we appreciate double-digits of phases trying to get the ball across the line. Because they don't have to give the ball away after 5 tackles and the defense doesn't have to back off, the ball is always in contention and it really stretches both the defense and the offense to their limits.

but I am glad league is looking to keep out rules that help negative game plans IMO all games should.
Not sure what you mean here, because it's exactly the opposite case in league. The current laws allow for the negative game plans that Roy Masters, Peter Sterling, Matty Johns and others have complained about, and Todd Greenberg foregrounded in the annual meeting. The biggest problem is the wrestling in the game, but that's more or less a symptom of game-planning that tries to slow the tackle and the play-the-ball -- negative play.

But it looks like nothing is coming out of that meeting. The talk is that coaches were against introducing or changing any laws, saying it'd be too confusing and there's already been too many changes. Not sure why that's the case. Doesn't look like they'll be limiting the interchange either, which would introduce a real fatigue factor and make the wrestling less effective as the game progresses. So it looks like it'll actually be more of the same.
 

kandos

Frank Nicholson (4)
The biggest problem is the wrestling in the game, but that's more or less a symptom of game-planning that tries to slow the tackle and the play-the-ball -- negative play.
And lots of other rule changes that have dumbed down the game. The NRL named a team of the century. They should have named two teams because the game now and then (70's and before is radically different). I really don't see how you can pick players, especially forwards, in the same team.
 

Lindommer

Simon Poidevin (60)
Staff member
Too succinct, mxy..... , far too succinct. Can't you expand on a point or do you have the attention span of a gnat? :rolleyes:
 

mxyzptlk

Colin Windon (37)
hey mitzy, stop 'worrying' about a few here and there complaining about your posts.

stuff 'em. If they have the attention span of a gnat so be it.

the rest of us actually enjoy your posts m'k.

so carry on.

please.

(No worries at all here. Believe it or not, I'm having fun with it. In another life I actually taught writing at university and English as a second language, so this is a jog -- honest worry never crossed my mind. Although I am concerned about some people's comprehension skills.)
 
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