The Israel Folau saga

[Rugbynutter39]

I don't think anybody expected Izzie to be on a mission to do this again. Clearly part of broader agenda he had (or others influenced him to drive) and interesting chose to do it just after getting record for highest super rugby try scorer.

Yep Izzie is gone and sadly probably from all professional football given he is refusing to back down on posting these sort of posts again. Wonder what he has planned as unless changes his tune on abiding by contract clauses to not make these sort of posts not much professional opportunities available to him...if any.

 

[formerflanker]

Cheika tried calling, Raelene tried calling, Gibson tried calling, Rugby Australian sent two welfare officers around to his house and he refused to talk to any of them, and now it's emerged that even through his agent he wouldn't discuss it.

He pushed them into a very awkward position by doing something extremely controversial and then blocking them all out, and I think they took what steps they believed to be necessary at the time.

Two welfare officers fail to speak to him and the next action by RA is a public announcement that his contract is to be terminated.
Any HR specialists, counsellors, or psychologists see anything wrong with this?

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Two welfare officers fail to speak to him and the next action by RA is a public announcement that his contract is to be terminated.

Any HR specialists, counsellors, or psychologists see anything wrong with this?

Nope - pretty strong grounds for termination. I know what would happen if I reacted the same way with any of my current and past employers.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Although I tend to think that 99% of people who read his posts are either committed followers of his church group or people monitoring trying to catch him out.

I can't honestly imagine any of the groups mentioned in the post in question following him. I'm not on twitter, but from what other posters here have said and reproduced, it's nearly all overtly religious in nature.

I wouldn't understimate the following these guys have. He's got 350k followers on Instagram, which is probably what you'd expect for a sports star of his magnitude. Quade has about 400k as an example.

The have a huge reach and each post gets a lot of visibility in the social media space

Up until March/April last year there were the standard sportsman training and group shots with the Wallabies and tahs, along with photos with him and his wife.

Since then for whatever reason, it's gone very religeous and quite dark. (although he has deleted the ASICS and land rover posts from the last year and he's also very recently changes his profile pic away from a Waratah shot.). 46 religeous memes by my count

 

[liquor box]

This is quite the contradiction.

I don't think Folau can return without issue. He's clearly not a team player and is more interested in other things. We've seen time and again in sport how the team needs to be the more than the sum of its parts to succeed.

I think "team" is overplayed at professional level, it is a game of individuals put together to follow a plan.

If you refused to work with him you get dropped and lose your pay.

Teams have always had players who are not popular, and they can win.

 

[sidelineview]

I'm glad someone has stated categorically that sponsors dictate the sport's strategic direction.
Like Buildcorp forcing sponsorship funds only go to clubs which support womens' rugby.
Or a pub insisting that the team they sponsor must have after game drinks at their pub.
The sport loses its autonomy when it agrees to bow to sponsors dictates.
Some directions will be small issues of no importance, but the Folau saga sees sponsors exercising the power of their dollars to force all of Australian rugby into their corporate mindset.
Whether we agree with that mindset or not, I fear for our game when it effectively sells its soul in return for big dollars.
The question we should be asking is whether Rugby should be apolitical, non judgemental, and open to all manner of people; or beholden to the viewpoint of the sponsor of the day. In RA's case, we see Qantas using RA to promote SSM and gay rights.

RA will have egg on its face if we lose Qantas and another sponsor comes on board with different priorities.

Right to the point.
This is one of the major points about this issue if not the biggest.

 

[Quick Hands]

I wouldn't understimate the following these guys have. He's got 350k followers on Instagram, which is probably what you'd expect for a sports star of his magnitude. Quade has about 400k as an example.

The have a huge reach and each post gets a lot of visibility in the social media space

Up until March/April last year there were the standard sportsman training and group shots with the Wallabies and tahs, along with photos with him and his wife.

Since then for whatever reason, it's gone very religeous and quite dark. (although he has deleted the ASICS and land rover posts from the last year and he's also very recently changes his profile pic away from a Waratah shot.). 46 religeous memes by my count

He's certainly undergone a change based on what, we don't know. As I understand what he is now saying is nothing particuarly different from many people who have undergone a religious awakening over the years. That is, much of his life to this point has been preoccupied with things of this world but those things no longer have that same allure and he is going to devote the rest of his life to God's work; whatever the cost to himself financially or otherwise.

Personally, I have no problem with his faith, I just wish he'd spend more time on the postive aspects of it.

 

[Pfitzy]

I can't be bothered reading 88 pages of this shit. Suffice to say - and I'm sure someone mentioned this - if you are tut-tutting over "freedom of speech/religion" and "people are too easily offended" or this diatribe about sponsor money, you're wrong.

Here it is in a nutshell:

Employer says "Hey The Thing you did was a Bad Thing to do. Please don't do it again. Consider yourself warned."
Employee - a grown-ass adult - says "OK".
Employee does The Thing again.
Employer decides time is up.

How fucking hard is it?

 

[sidelineview]

Which makes me think there is nothing rational about this.

He has been brainwashed. I suspect he is in a dark place and quite unwell mentally.

Its an impossible situation. He believes he is right at all cost. He is disturbed and will probably be terminated and never play again because of a mental illness. (Not that I am any Doctor, but I can see no other logical explanation of such an irrational stance)

I cant agree.
His burden would be heavy under the circumstances but its a choice he has made to priotise his faith.
He'll have a lot of support. It's got nothing to do with mental illness imo.

Anyone who is familiar with committed Christians would understand.

Christians think differently, not all, but the committed ones do.
Making sacrifices and resisting the temptations of this world is a constant test that fellow Christians applaud, therefore he has support not to weaken in his stance.

Jesus himself, after being baptised by John the Baptist, who would have looked like an unwashed vagabond these days, fasted for 40 days and nights in the desert. He resisted all the temptations put before him by Satan. He resisted all of them and concluded with 'get behind me Satan". He was victorious.

This is what committed Christian aspire to. It's not easy.

Take it literally or metaphorically, its a test Folau, and his fellow Christians, would be conscientious about.
F...k the money and fame. Stick to the Christian game plan.
That's their mindset.

Mark 8:36 King James Version (KJV)
36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

I feel sorry for him because he obviously loves playing rugby, but I believe he will sacrifice it if forced to.
and he will be revered by fellow Christians and seen as an inspiration to resist the temptations of this world.

He will also stand tall to people who despise being subject to political correctness and commercial priorities.

 

[Derpus]

I can't be bothered reading 88 pages of this shit. Suffice to say - and I'm sure someone mentioned this - if you are tut-tutting over "freedom of speech/religion" and "people are too easily offended" or this diatribe about sponsor money, you're wrong.

Here it is in a nutshell:

Employer says "Hey The Thing you did was a Bad Thing to do. Please don't do it again. Consider yourself warned."
Employee - a grown-ass adult - says "OK".
Employee does The Thing again.
Employer decides time is up.

How fucking hard is it?

Very, apparently.

 

[Derpus]

I think "team" is overplayed at professional level, it is a game of individuals put together to follow a plan.

If you refused to work with him you get dropped and lose your pay.

Teams have always had players who are not popular, and they can win.

I disagree. I think team ethos is the key to success. But that's a discussion for another thread.

 

[barbarian]

I can't be bothered reading 88 pages of this shit. Suffice to say - and I'm sure someone mentioned this - if you are tut-tutting over "freedom of speech/religion" and "people are too easily offended" or this diatribe about sponsor money, you're wrong.

Here it is in a nutshell:

Employer says "Hey The Thing you did was a Bad Thing to do. Please don't do it again. Consider yourself warned."
Employee - a grown-ass adult - says "OK".
Employee does The Thing again.
Employer tries to contact Employee to discuss The Thing, but he blocks their calls and ignores them when they come to his house.
Employer decides time is up.

How fucking hard is it?

Added in one step you missed.
.

 

[Brumby Runner]

If there are literally thousands of PI players (40 + %) many of whom are also deeply religious, we are yet to see what consequence might follow of a termination.

I think many of them will be highly upset, but I wouldn't say it will necessarily result in any player strikes or tearing up of contracts. It is, after all, their living we are talking about.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Although I tend to think that 99% of people who read his posts are either committed followers of his church group or people monitoring trying to catch him out.

I can't honestly imagine any of the groups mentioned in the post in question following him. I'm not on twitter, but from what other posters here have said and reproduced, it's nearly all overtly religious in nature.

From what he said on the weekend, it's now a matter of God's will and divine destiny and he's not about to retract. If anything he's hardened his position because he sees it as part of God's plan for him.

I don't agree with his methods, nor to I agree with the way in which he expressed his beliefs but I certainly respect his faith and his commitment to what he believes is the right thing to do. Many of us (most of us?) would have blinked before now and taken the pragmatic option. He has a higher calling and it seems that that is the path he is going to follow. I suspect that this is going to go all the way through the courts, possibly to the High Court as he would view anything else as weakness and lack of faith on his part.

Not so sure about this QH. Whatever he decides to do, it will be because he believes that is his god's plan. Can be used to justify any course of action, including not going to court.

 

[Derpus]

Not so sue about this QH. Whatever he decides to do, it will be because he believes that is his god's plan. Can be used to justify any course of action, including not going to court.

It's a pretty crazy mentality. 'God told me to do it' really means either a) he thinks he literally heard God speak to him or b) someone who claims to know what God wants for him told him what to do.

Either way something pretty dark is up.

 

[Dismal Pillock]

Wonder what he has planned as unless changes his tune on abiding by contract clauses to not make these sort of posts not much professional opportunities available to him.if any.

Sounds like he won't be worried in the slightest as he seems to believe God will take care of him. Phew! That's a load off! Must be great to have a safety net threaded of such impermeable delusional grandeur. "It's ok mummy, the tooth fairy will look after me."

 

[wamberal]

Not so sure about this QH. Whatever he decides to do, it will be because he believes that is his god's plan. Can be used to justify any course of action, including not going to court.

Yep, that's the thing. Hard to argue with somebody who has these beliefs. As I have said earlier, he would have a lot more credibility if he was living out his faith in actions that help people in need, rather than using words to attack others (as they see it).

 

[Tex]

That's the things with the happy clappers isn't it? Their view is that us ignorant sinners need to be brought into the tent to bathe in the shining love of the great pasta god.

The more 'establishment' christians seem to express their religion either through personal faith or actual charity for those in need.

 

[Pfitzy]

It's a pretty crazy mentality. 'God told me to do it' really means either a) he thinks he literally heard God speak to him or b) someone who claims to know what God wants for him told him what to do.

Either way something pretty dark is up.

Nope, he's just as dumb as dog shit and religious with it.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Pfitzy said: ↑

I can't be bothered reading 88 pages of this shit. Suffice to say - and I'm sure someone mentioned this - if you are tut-tutting over "freedom of speech/religion" and "people are too easily offended" or this diatribe about sponsor money, you're wrong.

Here it is in a nutshell:

Employer says "Hey The Thing you did was a Bad Thing to do. Please don't do it again. Consider yourself warned."
Employee - a grown-ass adult - says "OK".​

Employee follows instructions while in final year of contract​

Employee signs a new $4m multi year contract​

Employee does The Thing again.
Employer tries to contact Employee to discuss The Thing, but he blocks their calls and ignores them when they come to his house.
Employer decides time is up.

How fucking hard is it?​

Added in one step you missed.

Added another. But only if you're very cynical