The impending Hooper vs Pocock Dilemma

[BDA]

Look I'm not bagging pocock he's great, but he does not deserve to be judged on his best games over 2 years ago, he will have to start again and show what he can do throughout the next super rugby season. because hooper is doing it week in and week out right now, and is clearly the most consistent and outstanding wallaby forward, all the awards and accolades are no coincidence.

I might just point out that people were saying Pocock shouldn't replace Hooper at this same time last year. Pocock came back from a long term injury in the EOYT against Wales, dominated the breakdown, won several crucial turnovers and was just about our best player that day. That is what I judge Pocock on.

 

[Train Without a Station]

Brumsfan, I firmly believe that because of Hooper's noticeable other aspects, people overlook and assume a deficiency in his breakdown work.

People see what they want to some times. I remember a Reds game with Robinson and Gill playing. Robinson made a great counter rucking effort, Gill picked the ball up on the Reds side of the ruck and the commentators bang on about what a great pilfer it was from Gill.

 

[BDA]

It'll certainly be interesting to see both guys battle it out next year. I suspect they'll bring the best out in each other.

One thing which must taken into consideration is the type of rugby that is going to played at the World Cup where defence becomes paramount. That probably favours Pocock

It's interesting to read the NH press constantly tout Hooper as being strong at the breakdown. He certainly is a breakdown pest and probably hits just as many rucks as Pocock. The big difference is pococks strength and effectiveness at the breakdown. He's really twice as effective as Hooper in that area. At the same time he doesn't offer all that much in attack and currently we lack genuine attacking forwards like Hooper. food for thought.

 

[Train Without a Station]

One thing which must taken into consideration is the type of rugby that is going to played at the World Cup where defence becomes paramount. That probably favours Pocock

I disagree. Defensively you don't lose anything with Hooper. He is also a more dominant tackler/hitter.

In my view it will come down to which side of field position and attacking game plan we go.

 

[Dumbledore]

One more thing to consider as regards Pocock is he has the ability to single-handedly take charge of games in a way I haven't seen from Hooper yet. I'm mainly thinking of the WC quarter against South Africa but there have been others as well.

Still, it's a good problem to have. One of those only areas where we've got genuine depth.

 

[brumsfan]

How do you measure the comment that pocock is twice as effective as hooper at the breakdown, hooper is winning at least 2 penalties a game which is about the same as pocock at his best?
Totally disagree with pocock dominating the game against Wales last year, according to the JE medal points pocock got 16 points for his game against Wales, hooper started 12 games and achieved 297 points at a average of 24.75 per game.so it's probable fair to say hooper is nearly twice as effective as pocock. In the eyes of his team mates anyway.

 

[RoffsChoice]

I've said it before, but there is a lot of repeating anyway so I'll say it again:
Hooper shines in a backrow with average-at-best ball runners (Eg. Mowen and Fardy). Pocock shines in a backrow with good ball runners (Eg. Higgers and Palu).

If we have our best 6 and 8, who also happen to be good ball runners, then Hooper doesn't shine and Pocock does, so we pick Pocock. If we don't have a 6 and 8 who are good ball runners then we pick Hooper.

 

[Tip]

 

[Viking]

I disagree. Defensively you don't lose anything with Hooper. He is also a more dominant tackler/hitter.

In my view it will come down to which side of field position and attacking game plan we go.

100% disagree - no way is Hooper is a more dominant tackler/hitter! I actually think he is poor in contact - he's a good ball runner because he hits half gaps at pace with good body height, he's a good tackler because he has good technique - he will lift and dump a player but rarely would he hit another forward dominantly (he does it to backs often tho) - reminds of the way JOC (James O'Connor) tackles - He makes the tackle but doesn't win the contact - this makes his stats look good but doesn't paint the whole picture.

I think Pocock was one of the best if not the best defensive player in the world. When your team is on the back foot there was no-one better to have on your team.

Hooper - He will probably shine more-so then Pocock in games where our forward pack is dominating the breakdown - think Ireland.

One thing I do agree on now is - Pocock will need to get back to playing at the same level he was at prior to his injury before he replaces Hooper.

I cannot possibly agree that Hooper is a better tackler or a better breakdown player then Pocock was.

 

[TheKing]

Haven't seen the stats vs Wales yet, but fuck me dead Hooper played well.

Hooper had all his usual positives out of this game, ran hard, a few dominant tackles, that one towards the end of game blasting (Cuthbert? maybe a sub) in to touch was fantastic.

But, the best thing for me coming out of that game were his turnovers. I counted 2 at least, and he potentially made 2 more. His most well-rounded performance yet.

While Hooper obviously isn't as successful as Pocock was in the breakdown, this performance showed he can get it done.

 

[Train Without a Station]

I thought he jagged 3-4 pilfers/penalties. Was a massive game for him in that regard.

 

[Dave Beat]

Another good game, he simply has varying degrees of good.
Average is rare.
Poor is very rare.

 

[Viking]

Agree - He was great in contact as well. Which has been my main criticism of him in the past. Seems like a stronger player then he was at the start of the season. Very impressed.

Pocock remains the stronger player over the ball - but boy does he have some work to do to get back into the squad. God I love it when players prove the doubters (me) wrong.

 

[Dave Beat]

Seb V, I'll pay that come back, well done.
We are blessed with 7's, I'm going to let next years form pick the best - only fair way to judge.

 

[MungoMan]

Agree - He was great in contact as well. Which has been my main criticism of him in the past. Seems like a stronger player then he was at the start of the season. Very impressed.

Pocock remains the stronger player over the ball - but boy does he have some work to do to get back into the squad. God I love it when players prove the doubters (me) wrong.

True. But then again his oppo - other Oz Soup sides aside - was a bit less Kiwi and Saffer than at the start of the season.

 

[Viking]

This is true MungoMan. Although Hoopers last game verse NZ in the Bled.3 was pretty good.

I still think the Pocock of old edges Hooper (Pocock just has that X-factor around breakdowns) but it's hard not to praise the guy especially after last nights efforts.

 

[Train Without a Station]

This is true MungoMan. Although Hoopers last game verse NZ in the Bled.3 was pretty good.

I still think the Pocock of old edges Hooper (Pocock just has that X-factor around breakdowns) but it's hard not to praise the guy especially after last nights efforts.

Seb I think you will find Hoops outpointed Richie in Bledisloe 1 too. Had 2 pilfers in the first 10 minutes.

 

[Round 15]

You can use both at the same time in some matches. Depends on the team we are facing.

 

[fatprop]

Couldn't be bothered creating a seperate thead.

I received this email from amnesty & Mr Pocock

Respect Mr Pocock, very few (if any) prominent rugby players have the drive and social conscience to put their name to stuff like this

Dear Fatprop

Imagine if your country had laws that, instead of protecting you, promoted vigilante violence against you.
Imagine if your government, instead of defending your freedom, criminalised your very identity.
Imagine if your head of state, instead of representing you, encouraged others to hate you -- simply because of who you love.
My name’s Dave, and I play Rugby for the Australian Wallabies. Like many, I’m looking forward to watching the world’s best athletes compete at the Olympic Winter Games in Sochi (Russia) next month -- but I’m also deeply concerned.
Russia’s President, Vladimir Putin, has introduced laws that make it dangerous for same-sex couples to simply express who they are. Lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender and intersex (LGBTI) people are attacked and harassed, and officials not only fail to investigate these hate crimes, they incite them.
That’s why I’m inviting you to join me, and other Amnesty supporters around the world, as we demand freedom of expression, assembly and association in Russia.
The values of a 'level playing field' and a 'fair go' are part of Australian rhetoric, borne out of our sports-loving history. As the Games approach, it's time for us to make these more than slogans and stand up for what's right.
The LGBTI community in Russia certainly doesn't get a 'fair go', as their very identities are criminalised. Homophobic laws impose fines on individuals and organisations accused of promoting ‘propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations’.
As international attention turns to Russia for the Games, it's time to highlight the repression of the LGBTI community and to raise questions about a world that allows this discrimination to persist.
Sign Amnesty’s petition to remind Mr Putin that the world is watching. Russia must uphold the Olympic ideal of human dignity.
Russian authorities routinely refuse to grant LGBTI people permission to hold public events like pride rallies. On at least six occasions last year, activists were violently attacked during peaceful protests in Moscow and Saint Petersburg, with no action taken against their attackers despite overwhelming video and photo evidence.
But that’s not all. Over the last two years, Russia has passed laws that prevent people from enjoying all kinds of freedoms.
Members of the punk band Pussy Riot were sentenced to two years in jail after performing a song that criticised President Putin inside a church. More recently, thirty Greenpeace activists were arrested and charged with ‘hooliganism’ for protesting environmental destruction in the Arctic. There has even been a crackdown on human rights organisations like Amnesty -- now forced to register as ‘foreign agents’ under threat of being fined or shut down.
Like Amnesty, I believe that hosting the Olympic Games is a privilege. Respect for people's rights and freedoms must be demanded of any host country.
Join 90,000 others from around the world and sign Amnesty's petition to help tip the scales in favour of human rights in Russia.
Thank you for taking the time to help,

David Pocock
For Amnesty International Australia
@pocockdavid

 

[Scrubber2050]

Lovely sentiments and impossible to disagree with.

HOWEVEr, we live in a shitty world full of hate, the prejudices of race colour location and religion.

The ONLY way to change the thought processes of people is with a concentrated effort usually by politicans. Haman beings are the most dangerous of any species on the planet.

David, whilst having great thoughts needs to take up a career in politics but with that platform I doubt whether he would be successful in any Australian electorate.

PLEASE finish your rugby career first