The impending Hooper vs Pocock Dilemma

[Viking]

@Stationless Train, spot on. There are quite a few fringe 6/8's champing at the bit to get a chance at Gold. Palu won't be around for ever but there is a real scrum of capable 6's and 8's that will probably offer better value in the long term than Mowen does.

Captaincy though. Bam Bam was really only adequate last year, and he is going to need to play himself back into form. Big Kev is out of form, and is not all that good at having Sir do as we need him to do. Sanchez plays badly with the C after his name. Squeaky doesn't need any extra baggage, and I'm not convinced that he could carry it off. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) plays too far away from the action, and I've never really been a fan wearing a jumper > 12 as a Captain. QC (Quade Cooper) could do it sometime in the future if he continues his recent form, but I'd like to see more Swallows before summer is declared.

If Higgers continues to improve he could be the next captain too. Just a thought.

 

[Tip]

Just an aside, whoever thought Hooper had done enough to be nominated for IRB player of the year needs to put their beer down, take their glasses off and give themselves a hard uppercut.

Hooper may be the best wallaby over the last 2 years, however looking over the last 30 tests that the Wallabies have played... it's not much of a distinction. He's just been the best of a bad bunch.

The day I see Hooper go a whole match without standing in the Outside centre hungrily waiting for a meat pie is the day I will be happy with him as a rugby player. But no, he's the anointed and criticizing forwards for seagulling is wholly restricted to Slipper & Alexander on this forum otherwise you run the risk of upsetting the e-mob

 

[Dave Beat]

Hooper may be the best wallaby over the last 2 years, however looking over the last 30 tests that the Wallabies have played. it's not much of a distinction. He's just been the best of a bad bunch.

The day I see Hooper go a whole match without standing in the Outside centre hungrily waiting for a meat pie is the day I will be happy with him as a rugby player. But no, he's the anointed and criticizing forwards for seagulling is wholly restricted to Slipper & Alexander on this forum otherwise you run the risk of upsetting the e-mob

Tip he's done something right to clean up with all the awards, and now Moore is joining him in the centres putting the outside back into gaps.
Up the Front Rowers club - way to go Moore!!

 

[Tip]

Tip he's done something right to clean up with all the awards, and now Moore is joining him in the centres putting the outside back into gaps.
Up the Front Rowers club - way to go Moore!!

My point was winning all the wallaby awards isn't a great achievement because the whole team has been so poor. Him not being up for IRB player of the year proves this. He's been the best of a bad bunch, not the best of the best.


Yes but you're comparing apples and oranges
Moore runs straight and hard and has been timing his passes to perfection.
Hooper crabs more than Quade and passing is his last option

 

[Dave Beat]

My point was winning all the wallaby awards isn't an achievement because the whole team has been so poor. Him not being up for IRB player of the year proves this. He's been the best of a bad bunch, not the best of the best.


Yes but you're comparing apples and oranges
Moore runs straight and hard and has been timing his passes to perfection.
Hooper crabs more than Quade and passing is his last option

Interesting some pundits like Bob Dwyer who has a little rugby experience says Hooper is the best go forward forward we have. We have been blessed with 7's - David Wilson, G Smith, Pockock, Hooper, Gill, all quality and I'm not looking to critique any of them

 

[Tip]

Interesting some pundits like Bob Dwyer who has a little rugby experience says Hooper is the best go forward forward we have.

I'm just going to paste what I wrote earlier in this thread.

Yes, Hooper is Aus' best ball running forward. Not an achievement considering our forward pack is full of people who rarely bust a tackle. (Mowen, Simmons, Horwill, Fardy, Timani, Douglas, McCalman, Dennis...) However, he doesn't do it in tight like Squeaky, and he gets man handled when he picks & go's. Fact is, we won't need Hooper's carries next year as both Higginbotham and Palu are better than Hooper with the ball in hand.

Bottom line is, Hooper's effectiveness with the ball is almost irrelevant when Palu, Higginbotham & possibly Elsom return from injury next year

 

[Dave Beat]

I'm just going to paste what I wrote earlier in this thread.

Bottom line is, Hooper's effectiveness with the ball is almost irrelevant when Palu, Higginbotham & possibly Elsom return from injury next year

Elsom???
Next we'll have Deans playing in the 15 jersey for the Wobs.

 

[Tip]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...-home/story-e6frg7o6-1226763776246#mm-premium

Frothing at the thought of Elsom being 100% fit. Regardless he is a better bench option than McCalman & Dennis...

 

[brumsfan]

Hooper is like having 16 players in a team, he does everything, leads the turnover count, both pilfers and forced penalties, makes the most tackles, makes the most forward running metres every week, pressures the ball runners hard, is the first to the breakdown most of the time, when the wallabies make a break he is the first forward to clean out by miles due to speed to ball, and the great thing is that he does all of this every game, hence all the awards.
Hooper is obviously doing what he is being asked to do otherwise he wouldn't be there, so please open your eyes or take your blinkers off.
In my opinion the only reason hooper wasn't nominated by the irb is that he was replaced by smith in the 3rd lions test, hard to nominate a player that was dropped from the starting team even though we all know that it was a mistake.

 

[brumsfan]

Also last year higgers was in and out of the team and couldn't cement a spot, Palu was there and hooper still dominated the running stats, still won more motm and players player awards.

 

[Train Without a Station]

The day I see Hooper go a whole match without standing in the Outside centre hungrily waiting for a meat pie is the day I will be happy with him as a rugby player. But no, he's the anointed and criticizing forwards for seagulling is wholly restricted to Slipper & Alexander on this forum otherwise you run the risk of upsetting the e-mob

You do understand the difference in the role of an openside flanker who is a loose forward and a prop who is a tight forward, right?

 

[Bairdy]

Just an aside, whoever thought Hooper had done enough to be nominated for IRB player of the year needs to put their beer down, take their glasses off and give themselves a hard uppercut.

Hooper may be the best wallaby over the last 2 years, however looking over the last 30 tests that the Wallabies have played. it's not much of a distinction. He's just been the best of a bad bunch.

The day I see Hooper go a whole match without standing in the Outside centre hungrily waiting for a meat pie is the day I will be happy with him as a rugby player. But no, he's the anointed and criticizing forwards for seagulling is wholly restricted to Slipper & Alexander on this forum otherwise you run the risk of upsetting the e-mob

I'll bite.

I'd wholeheartedly disagree that Hooper was not close to being in the reckoning for IRB player of the year, behind Folau. I think it's an oversimplification and terribly unfair on Hooper to say that because the Wallabies have been bad, "it's not much of a distinction" for him to be the "best of a bad bunch".

Look at all the awards he's won this year - do you think that's by accident? But then again, you're probably of the opinion that Gill is better, even though he can't even show in training he deserves to start over Hooper.

The way I see it, Hooper is the incumbent, and Pocock has to outplay him next year in super rugby, or play off the bench

 

[Dave Beat]

I'll bite

Look at all the awards he's won this year - do you think that's by accident?

The way I see it, Hooper is the incumbent, and Pocock has to outplay him next year in super rugby, or play off the bench

Bite on what, entree, main, and desert had a couple of hours back.

I agree with you

 

[Bullrush]

In my opinion the only reason hooper wasn't nominated by the irb is that he was replaced by smith in the 3rd lions test, hard to nominate a player that was dropped from the starting team even though we all know that it was a mistake.

The 'only' reason?! C'mon…..he's been good but he's not even close to being 'best of the best' yet. Definitely not this year.

 

[Viking]

Hooper is like having 16 players in a team, he does everything, leads the turnover count, both pilfers and forced penalties, makes the most tackles, makes the most forward running metres every week, pressures the ball runners hard, is the first to the breakdown most of the time, when the wallabies make a break he is the first forward to clean out by miles due to speed to ball, and the great thing is that he does all of this every game, hence all the awards.
Hooper is obviously doing what he is being asked to do otherwise he wouldn't be there, so please open your eyes or take your blinkers off.
In my opinion the only reason hooper wasn't nominated by the irb is that he was replaced by smith in the 3rd lions test, hard to nominate a player that was dropped from the starting team even though we all know that it was a mistake.

Hooper was dropped because Warburton outplayed him every game. He was getting hammered from his lack of physicality. I thought he had a poor Lion series. Dean's brought in Smith because Hooper was being outplayed.

He has improved since but still no way is he close to IRB player of the year when he gets outplayed by his opposite number so often - please refer to any game Vs South Africa, or NZ - Examples: McCaw, Cane, & Warburton outplayed him.

 

[Dave Beat]

Hooper was dropped because Warburton outplayed him every game. He was getting hammered from his lack of physicality. I thought he had a poor Lion series. Dean's brought in Smith because Hooper was being outplayed.

He has improved since but still no way is he close to IRB player of the year when he gets outplayed by his opposite number so often - please refer to any game Vs South Africa, or NZ - Examples: McCaw, Cane, & Warburton outplayed him.

Seb I would have picked G Smith for all 3 if he was fit.
I'm not sure if I would have short listed him in the IRB team listing either given the teams performance over the last 12 + months, but he deserved the awards this year.
McCaw, Cane, - agree (didn't McCaw only play half a season, or was that last year?).
Warburton doesn't do a lot for me, seems to be a lot of hype about not a lot with him - looking forward to this weeks game.
As for the Lions series, if I was going to Isolate someone I'd pick on the coach - to single out one player for physicality against a 15 man team is unfair. Note first 2 games decided on the full time siren, last was a blow out and Hooper didn't play.

 

[Train Without a Station]

I thought there was a comment about Warbuton having a lack of success at the breakdown after the first test?

 

[Viking]

Yes I agree it was a whole team effort that lost the B & L Lions. And Hooper deserves all the award he has received - he has been in the top 5 or even 3 players for the wallabies most games (not the Lions series). But I still would have chosen Smith over him if he was fit!

Also when it comes to the IRB player of the year - I dont think he has consistently been in the top 3 or 5 players on the field - especially not in the RC or the Lions series. He has finished the season very well though - I would say top 5 on the field all EOYT.

He's had a great season - he would be in the top 20 IRB players. But I'd say it would be a stretch to be in the top 10.

 

[Phil]

Elsom???
Next we'll have Deans playing in the 15 jersey for the Wobs.

I think Tip lost all credibility when Elsom's name was mentioned.Give me Hooper any time over him.

 

[Slim 293]

Bottom line is, Hooper's effectiveness with the ball is almost irrelevant when Palu, Higginbotham & possibly Elsom return from injury next year

Elsom?

Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.........

I don't recall seeing his name in any squad sheets for next year?