Sydney Colts 2012

[Blackers13]

Ok I like to watch I am wrong and I now fully understand
Penrith and parramatta are not able to attract 45 players to play at least 2 sides.
Both clubs should at least accept having there grant from the ARU cut to reflect the numbers of teams they can field.
I am sure you would appreciate this is fair.

Tahboy, do you really think cutting ARU funding is the way to solve the problems of Colts in Western Sydney? If anything the ARU should be throwing money at Penrith and Parramatta to attract and retain their junior players into Colts through structured programs. Your attitude exemplifies why the code is struggling in Western Sydney and therefore at Waratah level. The AFL, NRL and now Soccer are pouring millions into development in Western Sydney. Cash strapped clubs like Penrith and Parramatta simply don't have the resources to attract and retain junior talent from other Rugby clubs let alone other codes. Having said that, Parramatta established an academy with $3k from a sponsor and it will go around again this off season. Compare that to the 24 development officers the AFL have roaming the West or the fully funded Rugby League Academy at St Marys; or compare it to the free education or "petrol money" paid by some clubs to attract talent.

 

[southsider]

Tahboy, do you really think cutting ARU funding is the way to solve the problems of Colts in Western Sydney? If anything the ARU should be throwing money at Penrith and Parramatta to attract and retain their junior players into Colts through structured programs. Your attitude exemplifies why the code is struggling in Western Sydney and therefore at Waratah level. The AFL, NRL and now Soccer are pouring millions into development in Western Sydney. Cash strapped clubs like Penrith and Parramatta simply don't have the resources to attract and retain junior talent from other Rugby clubs let alone other codes. Having said that, Parramatta established an academy with $3k from a sponsor and it will go around again this off season. Compare that to the 24 development officers the AFL have roaming the West or the fully funded Rugby League Academy at St Marys; or compare it to the free education or "petrol money" paid by some clubs to attract talent.

can tell you its a hell of a lot more than 24 development officers....im one of them hahaha. although i wish the tahs could get their act together so i could work for them instead

 

[Informer]

and you can bet the minute he gets offered somthing by league he''ll go right back over again.

Not sure what the game is with Adrian but his final 15 minutes with Uni colts 3rds on the weekend would suggest he does not have a career in rugby. I have watched this kid since under 12's and if he is a genuine rugby player I will eat my shorts: can't pass, steps into the defence in attack and lazy in defence. He may have a career in the NRL and good luck to him but he looked like a duck out of water on the weekend in every sense. I have no doubt that Uni are just are just helping him on his way to the next NRL contract.

 

[Drew]

Hangana had his rabbits contract ripped up for some indiscretion or another.

 

[southsider]

Not sure what the game is with Adrian but his final 15 minutes with Uni colts 3rds on the weekend would suggest he does not have a career in rugby. I have watched this kid since under 12's and if he is a genuine rugby player I will eat my shorts: can't pass, steps into the defence in attack and lazy in defence. He may have a career in the NRL and good luck to him but he looked like a duck out of water on the weekend in every sense. I have no doubt that Uni are just are just helping him on his way to the next NRL contract.

totally agree informer, i played against him for school and the only reason he did well then was because he was big. Just a shame that union administration are so eager to sign league guys in the hope that they'll get better and eventually be good union players, especially uni with the abundence of players they already can call upon

 

[Tahboy]

Ryan09 why should Penrith and Parramatta have more money to throw at there 1st grade side
No colts mean they don't have to buy
60 jumpers
60 shorts
60 socks
Tape for 60 players for 16 weeks
Plus gear like dress shirts etc
General costs to run colts
All this money other clubs have yo find to just run the basics of colts
So your idea is give them more money to do nothing with

 

[Dave Beat]

Ryan09 why should Penrith and Parramatta have more money to throw at there 1st grade side
No colts mean they don't have to buy
60 jumpers
60 shorts
60 socks
Tape for 60 players for 16 weeks
Plus gear like dress shirts etc
General costs to run colts
All this money other clubs have yo find to just run the basics of colts
So your idea is give them more money to do nothing with

Firstly I havent paid attention to the colts comp - but Tahboy some very very good points.
I thought I saw Parra compete very strongly in the state junior comp - did I?
I think if a club plays in first division it should field the required teams.
All other "clubs" should be able to draw on geographic area to field a "club" I am just amazed how Uni always draws and fields such quality teams - how?

 

[Blackers13]

Ryan09 why should Penrith and Parramatta have more money to throw at there 1st grade side
No colts mean they don't have to buy
60 jumpers
60 shorts
60 socks
Tape for 60 players for 16 weeks
Plus gear like dress shirts etc
General costs to run colts
All this money other clubs have yo find to just run the basics of colts
So your idea is give them more money to do nothing with

Did I say throw at 1st Grade? I said the ARU should be throwing money at Penrith and Parramatta to attract and retain their junior players into Colts through structured programs. Tahboy, you are naiive if you think the cost savings in not fielding Colts has a significant impact on a club budget. Player rego fees cover that cost in any case. As with any sport, if you wish to remain competitive you must invest in your development programs. Given the socio economic profile of the areas, Penrith and Parramatta cannot raise enough funds through sponsors and chook raffles to put together a program that is attractive enough to do the job. While the ARU snoozes, the AFL and FAA will slowly win the hearts and minds of the Greater West and I fear the code may die west of Concord. But maybe that's just what the heirachy want.

 

[Blackers13]

Firstly I havent paid attention to the colts comp - but Tahboy some very very good points.
I thought I saw Parra compete very strongly in the state junior comp - did I?
I think if a club plays in first division it should field the required teams.
All other "clubs" should be able to draw on geographic area to field a "club" I am just amazed how Uni always draws and fields such quality teams - how?

Parra won the 17's and performed strongly in other age groups. The problem is and has been, moving those boys up into Colts and keeping them. Lets remember 2 years ago, Parramatta was about to be thrown out of the comp. They were a rabble with no structure, poor facilities and completely broke. No player with any aspirations wanted to associate with them, witnessed by the fact that the sons of 3 former premiership winning 1st graders are playing with other clubs. Parra are gradually getting their act together through a smart coach and hard working board but they've had to do it all themselves. Next year is shaping as a comeback for Colts as many of the 17's and some schools players now see an opportunity to be part of the rebuild. That only goes so far until another club comes waving cash, education, accommodation and other inducements to leave their junior district. If the ARU was fairdinkum about keeping Rugby alive in Western Sydney, they would be supporting both Parramatta and Penrith to retain and grow their juniors into Colts.

 

[I like to watch]

All other "clubs" should be able to draw on geographic area to field a "club" I am just amazed how Uni always draws and fields such quality teams - how?

They are the most professional and best resourced club in the land. They have the best coaching panel in the country IMO and recruit aggressively.The financial packages they offer some of their colts cannot be matched by any other club. No one has better facilities and Uni players appear to have a significant advantage with selectors in rep squads.
Frankly I am amazed that any colt with rep ambitions does not play for them.

 

[Blackers13]

They are the most professional and best resourced club in the land. They have the best coaching panel in the country IMO and recruit aggressively.The financial packages they offer some of their colts cannot be matched by any other club. No one has better facilities and Uni players appear to have a significant advantage with selectors in rep squads.
Frankly I am amazed that any colt with rep ambitions does not play for them.

I rest my case.

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

They are the most professional and best resourced club in the land. They have the best coaching panel in the country IMO and recruit aggressively.The financial packages they offer some of their colts cannot be matched by any other club. No one has better facilities and Uni players appear to have a significant advantage with selectors in rep squads.
Frankly I am amazed that any colt with rep ambitions does not play for them.

I know Uni have good coaches and good resources but I belive any good colt must weigh up the advantages UNi certainly provides with the opportunities that are available at other clubs.

A player, say who has made OZ schools would go to UNI in his first year, play probably 2nd grade colts due to the strength of the player roster and the abundance of players with a year or 2 experience in Colts already, may get some 1st colts but may not. In their 2nd year out they would most probably play 1st colts. After this they step up to grade with UNI and what grade do they play given the strength of the grades that UNI have. May take a while to get into first grade.

Then he could go and play with a club like Norths, Wests or Manly - good clubs with a strong colts program. Should play a majority of the year in 1st Colts. In the second year he has the opportunity to play full grade if he has dedicated himself and learnt and improved skills and strength in his first year - possibly an opportunity to play 2nd grade or if not then another full year in 1st Colts. He would definitely play grade, most probably 2nd and possibly some 1st Grade in the immediate years after leaving colts.

 

[Casnovian]

I know Uni have good coaches and good resources but I belive any good colt must weigh up the advantages UNi certainly provides with the opportunities that are available at other clubs.

A player, say who has made OZ schools would go to UNI in his first year, play probably 2nd grade colts due to the strength of the player roster and the abundance of players with a year or 2 experience in Colts already, may get some 1st colts but may not. In their 2nd year out they would most probably play 1st colts. After this they step up to grade with UNI and what grade do they play given the strength of the grades that UNI have. May take a while to get into first grade.

Then he could go and play with a club like Norths, Wests or Manly - good clubs with a strong colts program. Should play a majority of the year in 1st Colts. In the second year he has the opportunity to play full grade if he has dedicated himself and learnt and improved skills and strength in his first year - possibly an opportunity to play 2nd grade or if not then another full year in 1st Colts. He would definitely play grade, most probably 2nd and possibly some 1st Grade in the immediate years after leaving colts.

I agree with you Iluvmyfooty!

As an aside I understand as a matter of course Uni send out letters to Australian Schoolboys congratulating them on their selection which is a great promotional strategy! No offers just acknowledgement which could lay some ground work in the future. Playing with Uni is a hard gig to get into if you are not one. I know of a NSW player from a couple of years ago was very interested playing with Uni (other clubs showed interest in him as well). Uni kept him on a string and the phone call never came - despite constant reassurances of assistant coaches at Uni - piss poor behaviour in that respect as he kept putting off the other clubs - great learning experience for him..

He is quite happpy playing first colts elsewhere and at last conversation with him he has been totally turned off Uni - as he said there was a long line to play grade if that was your ambition. There is a stock pile of talent at Uni not only from the year he began but immediate years as well. A case in point is that Uni still have an Austraian Schoolboys playing first grade colts when his contemporary Australian schools mates are playing Schute Shield first and second grade.

 

[Tahboy]

Ryan 09 if you think the $250 from fees covers costs you should rethink that statement
How much do you think it costs to just insure the player for the year?
I have been informed from 2 club general managers it costs about $500 per player when you take in costs of gear, ground fees, insurance, tape, costs of paying a head coach etc all these costs are part of running a club
So you think the money saved in not playing colts won't go to first grade costs? Where will it go? To lower grades? They are are struggling so that's not money well spent.

 

[I like to watch]

It is common for businesses to share costs across their business to understand the unit cost.
The head coach's pay does not change according to how many colts players there are. Strapping costs are also divided by player numbers, but look at the strapping 1st grade & 2nd grade use, and compare that to the strapping used in colts 3's. Ground fees also are not dependant on how many grades a club has in colts etc etc etc.
maybe talk to one of your colts mates that might be doing economics and ask about fixed costs and variable costs.

 

[Dave Beat]

They are the most professional and best resourced club in the land. They have the best coaching panel in the country IMO and recruit aggressively.The financial packages they offer some of their colts cannot be matched by any other club. No one has better facilities and Uni players appear to have a significant advantage with selectors in rep squads.
Frankly I am amazed that any colt with rep ambitions does not play for them.

I know just wanted to have it said again.
But it also confirms there is talent out there, and I do believe with the right culture players will want to play for their club - make it more tribal.

 

[Blackers13]

Ryan 09 if you think the $250 from fees covers costs you should rethink that statement
How much do you think it costs to just insure the player for the year?
I have been informed from 2 club general managers it costs about $500 per player when you take in costs of gear, ground fees, insurance, tape, costs of paying a head coach etc all these costs are part of running a club
So you think the money saved in not playing colts won't go to first grade costs? Where will it go? To lower grades? They are are struggling so that's not money well spent.

Tahboy, you are missing the point. It's not the cost of running 3 colts sides, that is irrelevant to the discussion. The point is that Penrith and Parramatta and a couple of other non western Sydney clubs simply cannot afford to run a Colts program that will attract and retain their junior talent. By program, I mean quality coaching across the grades, proper strength and conditioning, access to adequate gym facilities and employment or education opportunities. As iluvmyfooty says, Uni can offer those things, as can one or two other clubs with the means to do it. Those clubs without the means, ie cash benefactors, scholastic providers or benevolent sponsors simply cannot compete at the same level. Therefore, to enable the development of talent across the clubs, in the face of increasing competition from other codes, the ARU must find a way to support those clubs in attracting, retaining and developing their local junior talent.

 

[grant pedlebury]

who is the norths no. 14?

 

[Cubesquare]

I know Uni have good coaches and good resources but I belive any good colt must weigh up the advantages UNi certainly provides with the opportunities that are available at other clubs.

A player, say who has made OZ schools would go to UNI in his first year, play probably 2nd grade colts due to the strength of the player roster and the abundance of players with a year or 2 experience in Colts already, may get some 1st colts but may not. In their 2nd year out they would most probably play 1st colts. After this they step up to grade with UNI and what grade do they play given the strength of the grades that UNI have. May take a while to get into first grade.

Then he could go and play with a club like Norths, Wests oPr Manly - good clubs with a strong colts program. Should play a majority of the year in 1st Colts. In the second year he has the opportunity to play full grade if he has dedicated himself and learnt and improved skills and strength in his first year - possibly an opportunity to play 2nd grade or if not then another full year in 1st Colts. He would definitely play grade, most probably 2nd and possibly some 1st Grade in the immediate years after leaving colts.

Imagine if uni offered players a contract with a salary every week.

 

[lily]

who is the norths no. 14?

Christian Jones. Went to Shore, lives in Sth Curl Curl.