Super Rugby Au Rnd 3 Waratahs vs Force 5th March, Sydney
- Thread starter Forcefield
- Start date
Forcefield
Ken Catchpole (46)
I look at the team lists and I feel confident. Then I remember what the Tahs did to the Reds in their second game last season. It often seems like the more confident you feel in the Force, the more likely they are to balls it up.
If he can catch, make a yard, tackle effectively and clean out accurately he is an upgrade
Force by 50
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Seems pretty clear with that Tahs team that the aim is to get moving quick smart, and challenge the ruck. Might be sacrificing a bit of set piece grunt for that after a notable improvement in the lineout and scrum (ref issues notwithstanding) last week.
As for Nawaqanitawase moving to FB. Well they're only backs, so it doesn't mean much. Expect us to play 3 back on the coathanger and counterattack a lot.
Kahui vs Moeroa in midfield should be interesting.
As for Nawaqanitawase moving to FB. Well they're only backs, so it doesn't mean much. Expect us to play 3 back on the coathanger and counterattack a lot.
Kahui vs Moeroa in midfield should be interesting.
PhilClinton
Mark Loane (55)
What's the general vibe with Force fans regarding what they're trying to achieve here? You mention they're rebuilding, but that starting team is full of journeymen and blokes in key positions on the wind down who likely won't be around in a few years, all the below guys are 27 or older this year so if your 2 year theory is correct they'll be pushing 30 at least:
Kaitu'u (probably getting his best years now)
Thursh
Stander
Cubelli
McIntyre (unproven at Super Rugby standard and one bad season and he's likely done)
Kuridrani
Kahui
Kearney
The bench options aren't exactly spring chickens either
Ready
Holmes
Prior
I don't know much about the new Argentinian blokes so can't comment on them but the makeup of that team doesn't scream rebuilding to me, unlike the Tahs who are straight up young and inexperienced and getting belted because of it, but hopefully will learn some lessons along the way etc etc and become a better team.
Probably because Maddocks has dropped almost every high ball kicked to him so far this season.
And if I was the Force coach, the isolating box kick would continue Maddock's woes
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Get Cubelli down their left edge putting up kick after kick, and Pulu chasing through with Kearney.
VassMan
Darby Loudon (17)
PhilClinton. It's smarter rebuilding than the Waratahs using list management. They've gotten in experienced guys to guide the younger players to take over in a few years. Unlike the Tahs, this team won't get beaten by 60 points, which disheartens the players and turns the fans away.
chiraag
Larry Dwyer (12)
Yep, As VassMan says I think it's a pretty smart strategy. Unfortunately there wasn't any real certainty with what competition the Force were going to be in this year (if any) until relatively late in the general recruitment window. So while it would've been ideal to get a few more promising young players in, they've done well getting a mix of young, middle and older players. The older players will help develop the young talent that we have and help attract fans and kids back to the game of rugby in WA.
With much more certainty over what the Force will be doing in 2022, I imagine and hope the team is working very hard on recruiting to fill the current gaps and those likely to be left by our older players like Holmes, Longbottom, Kahui, Thrush and Kearney in the next year or two. A few wins on the board should help with recruitment as well...
PhilClinton
Mark Loane (55)
You guys, the supporters seem convinced they're on the right path and that's what counts as you're the ones putting bums on seats and buying memberships etc.
From an outsider looking in, it seems like they've gone too heavy with the experience side and put themselves in a position where if the young talent doesn't prosper in the next year or two, a fair chunk of their current side will either be retired, moved on or not providing enough value and then you're left with the Waratahs model that you're dreading.
I admit I'm not up to speed on WA Rugby so maybe you've got 20 blokes in an academy ready to rumble in two years and this current recruitment is a masterstroke.
Finsbury Girl
Trevor Allan (34)
I reckon NSW will be up for this. 'Tahs by 10.
Equalizer
Trevor Allan (34)
Following on from my previous post the Force couldn't afford to come back into Super Rugby and just field a team of young up and coming players. Whilst we have one of the most loyal fan bases in rugby, there is a need to re-launch the brand and attract the casual rugby fan back to the game and the team. Getting whacked by huge margins first year back in the comp would provide unwarranted fodder for commentary around "that's why they were kicked out in the first place".
The Force is in transition with a clear direction of where they want to be in a couple of years time. The new Force CEO was instrumental in turning the Tasman Makos into a strong provincial team in the Mitre 10 Cup in NZ (champions 2019 & 2020) and has the resources at his disposal and impetus to invigorate grass roots rugby in WA. Once that happens we will see the tap turned back on for local talent to permeate the Force team.
In the interim, a good mix of up and coming talent and veterans seems like the best pathway to tick off some key objectives in the 2021 campaign. The veterans like Longbottom, Cubelli , Kahui and Kearney are the type of player/coaches needed to pass on their experience to those that will inevitably follow.
The Force is in transition with a clear direction of where they want to be in a couple of years time. The new Force CEO was instrumental in turning the Tasman Makos into a strong provincial team in the Mitre 10 Cup in NZ (champions 2019 & 2020) and has the resources at his disposal and impetus to invigorate grass roots rugby in WA. Once that happens we will see the tap turned back on for local talent to permeate the Force team.
In the interim, a good mix of up and coming talent and veterans seems like the best pathway to tick off some key objectives in the 2021 campaign. The veterans like Longbottom, Cubelli , Kahui and Kearney are the type of player/coaches needed to pass on their experience to those that will inevitably follow.
I like to watch
David Codey (61)
The other winger can kick.
Unless this guys runs 3km with the ball for the game, they’ll be conceding territory the entire match
Forcefield
Ken Catchpole (46)
I think the Force will need a few years to get good returns on their academy. In the meantime some shrewd recruiting is required, particularly at tighthead and lock. I am optimistic that the approaching World Cup and Lions tour will help recruiting efforts. By 2024, I'd hope we see the likes of Victor Harris, Michael McDonald, Alex Masibaka, Jackson Pugh, Tizzano coming home (he'll not get much game time with Hooper back), Grason Makara and whoever else steps up forming the backbone of a strong Force team with a few domestic and international imports.
Kevin77
Fred Wood (13)
It's a fairly complex question with a fairly complex answer. It's not all one thing.
It's rooted in the fact that the head was cut off four years ago. Any young player that had designs on representing the Wallabies was forced to decide whether to relocate or take a chance on Rapid Rugby. Many left.
Now the Force are back there is an obvious pathway in the West. But as previously mentioned there's been no surety around the Force's medium to long term future until very recently.
Last season was basically get a team of Rapid Rugby standard and add whoever is available to try and make them somewhat competitive.
This year was an upgrade but still a hard sell as you're generally offering short term contracts. The lead up time to recruit was also limited. It's difficult to convince a Rodda or Coleman to come home with the offer of a one year contract. There's also the issue of how much money can be offered when only 4-7 games are on offer and depending on COVID - what are the gate receipts going to be like? So many unknowns.
I understand a conscious decision was made not to raid other sides academies. When the Force started back in 06 the aggressive recruitment particularly of Queensland hurt other sides and led to resentment.
So in reality what is the Force to do?
We're not a huge rugby state but we have ambition.
We don't have a production line of over 100 years of Wallabies like Queensland or NSW.
We were left out in the cold by the shenanigans a few years ago.
So the plan is to produce our own, bring back talent from overseas and give opportunities to fringe/young players at other provinces. In the short term that is difficult due to the reasons outlined above.
It's going to take a few years to encourange Wallabies to return from overseas. We need to be able to offer them three year deals, regular rugby and a pathway to the World Cup. This all applies to recruting internally too.
It's also going to take time to grow our own.
So there are two solutions in the meantime;
1. Tough it out with all Australian players who either are journeymen or not ready and lose regularly.
2. Augment what we have with a sprinkling from overseas and hopefully deliver some results in the short term.
Option one is the noble choice but in reality will probably lead to the team failing, crowds being disinterested, the Eastern media slagging off reinstating the Force and possibly even expulsion again.
Option two means crowds will watch, some results are possible, we can build a culture and maybe in time we can have a mostly Australian side with a handful of Western Australians feeding into the Wallabies.
Who knows? We might even get a first finals appearance for the Force.
For neutrals it's a good opportunity to see how a Kearney goes in Super Rugby or the Argentinians in a non Argentinian team.
The hardcore fans have bought in. We always will. Let's hope some of the fence sitters will too.