Shute Shield 2018

[cyclopath]

Temporarily, in transit to Connacht (Ireland).

Is he getting a boat from Coogee?

 

[the coach]

Is he getting a boat from Coogee?

Probably a currach

 

[Pfitzy]

The talk about conspiracy theories around Penrith is completely understandable - we've all seen them struggle for years and now the axe comes down just as the powers that be decide to increase development resources.

You could say that its a good emergency action by NSWRU.
You could just as easily say it was the plan all along.

NSWRU are not doing themselves any favours putting the two things together, and any development plan isn't simply going to stand up in a couple of months before season starts.

 

[wamberal]

Anybody read the Parrot's diatribe in today's Rupert?

 

[barbarian]

If this was a grand conspiracy, it's a pretty shit one. Wouldn't you just punt them at the start/end of the season? Doing it a handful of weeks into the comp creates a lot of mess.

 

[The Honey Badger]

If this was a grand conspiracy, it's a pretty shit one. Wouldn't you just punt them at the start/end of the season? Doing it a handful of weeks into the comp creates a lot of mess.

Got me why they didn't just cut the 2 1st grade teams. At least there would be 5 grades still playing and should have been more competitive.



Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[Quick Hands]

The talk about conspiracy theories around Penrith is completely understandable - we've all seen them struggle for years and now the axe comes down just as the powers that be decide to increase development resources.

You could say that its a good emergency action by NSWRU.
You could just as easily say it was the plan all along.

NSWRU are not doing themselves any favours putting the two things together, and any development plan isn't simply going to stand up in a couple of months before season starts.

I think you're giving NSWRU too much credit. I strongly doubt that they would be capable of thinking up a conspiracy. More likely that the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing./

 

[Quick Hands]

Got me why they didn't just cut the 2 1st grade teams. At least there would be 5 grades still playing and should have been more competitive.



Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk

I tend to agree, but I suspect that NSWRU have come to the same conclusion that I have, which is that Penrith are/were unsalvagable and that nothing could really be done to save them.

Starting from scratch is the way to go, but there's going to be a lot of money, time and resources involved to make it a success.

 

[wamberal]

I tend to agree, but I suspect that NSWRU have come to the same conclusion that I have, which is that Penrith are/were unsalvagable and that nothing could really be done to save them.

Starting from scratch is the way to go, but there's going to be a lot of money, time and resources involved to make it a success.

If the wider community can be brought on board, we have a chance. No way can a Shute Shield standard rugby club survive on outside "money, time, and resources.'

 

[Quick Hands]

If the wider community can be brought on board, we have a chance. No way can a Shute Shield standard rugby club survive on outside "money, time, and resources.'

That's true, but I think that the broader community are far more likely to bond with a club which is successful, well-run and playing at a reasonable facility.

Unfortunately Penrith haven't really been able to achieve any of these - and the fault isn't necessarily with the volunteers doing their best. They had a mountain to climb, did their best, but their best isn't enough. The way of the world means that the SRU came to the only decision that they could in the circumstances.

I support the NSWRU if as it seems that any new club will be started from scratch and supported by NSW DOs and other resources. Hopefully they are able to play out of somewhere like the facility at Blacktown.

It's been my experience in a range of sports that the uncommitted will gravitate to clubs which they perceive to be well-run and competitive (even if they don't win all the time).

 

[wamberal]

Mmmmmm. According to Google map, it is 20 kms from Blacktown to the Riff. That is a long way.


As for people gravitating to clubs that are well run, there are a heap of junior leagues clubs, I used to play for Parramatta in under 19s way back when, and a pal of mine played for Guildford as an adult (to earn some spare dosh). I don't know how well run they are, but their money is competitive, I would guess.


There is a lot to like about our game, not least that there are playing opportunities for people of all abilities and none. But young kids who are good at sport and who live way out in the western suburbs are spoiled for choice, and if their choice is our game, why oh why wouldn't they up sticks and go to play for Manly? For example. What would you do?

 

[Quick Hands]

Mmmmmm. According to Google map, it is 20 kms from Blacktown to the Riff. That is a long way.


As for people gravitating to clubs that are well run, there are a heap of junior leagues clubs, I used to play for Parramatta in under 19s way back when, and a pal of mine played for Guildford as an adult (to earn some spare dosh). I don't know how well run they are, but their money is competitive, I would guess.


There is a lot to like about our game, not least that there are playing opportunities for people of all abilities and none. But young kids who are good at sport and who live way out in the western suburbs are spoiled for choice, and if their choice is our game, why oh why wouldn't they up sticks and go to play for Manly? For example. What would you do?

Correct. I'm not advocating a team at Penrith. Blacktown is part of the same greater western Sydney region (that might be a good name for a team ).

Clubs that aren't well run tend not to have money to spend on players - note how the Manly Sea Eagles league team are travelling.

At the moment, that player may well up sticks and come to Manly and play for the Marlins. Having Penrith in their current/recently lapsed incarnation does nothing to keep rugby players who want to play SS in that region. The only way a player who has aspirations of playing at a higher level would stay at a club in the greater western Sydney region (there's that name again ), is if the club is well-run and competitive and in my experience the two go together like a horse and carriage - you can't have one without the other. (apologies to Frank Sinatra)

 

[wamberal]

A combined Western Sydney club at Blacktown might be a goer, at least in theory. Especially if there is a centre for excellence there, something that would attract good prospects who want to stay in the 'burbs.


There are so many advantages that accrue from being at one of the traditional, inner city, clubs. The only thing that can counterbalance those advantages is money, money, money. Now, who sang that?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Mmmmmm. According to Google map, it is 20 kms from Blacktown to the Riff. That is a long way.

It sure is.
But guess what? Neither has moved in quite some time.
There’s been decades when 2, 3 or 4 senior clubs should have been encouraged in this area.
Including a decade when the ARU had a windfall $31m from RWC2003 and there was no GWS or Western Sydney Wanderers out there and they only needed to keep $2m aside for the JON golden handshake.
What they need is a fleet of Toyota coasters to transport rugby prospects to training and games.
Likelihood? 0%

 

[Quick Hands]

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Even they’re in better shape

 

[Quick Hands]

A combined Western Sydney club at Blacktown might be a goer, at least in theory. Especially if there is a centre for excellence there, something that would attract good prospects who want to stay in the 'burbs.


There are so many advantages that accrue from being at one of the traditional, inner city, clubs. The only thing that can counterbalance those advantages is money, money, money. Now, who sang that?

Certainly having money allows clubs to attract players, but I'd argue that the clubs with money tend to be the ones which are well run.

From my experience, there have been times when Manly weren't going so well and at those times the administration side of the club wasn't great. I've seen first hand that when there are changes in club management and the place is run properly then the on field results are better.

 

[wamberal]

Certainly having money allows clubs to attract players, but I'd argue that the clubs with money tend to be the ones which are well run.

From my experience, there have been times when Manly weren't going so well and at those times the administration side of the club wasn't great. I've seen first hand that when there are changes in club management and the place is run properly then the on field results are better.

It does not matter much why a given club is doing well. What matters is how we can support/encourage young players who live in areas where the clubs are not doing well.

The latter tend to be in areas away from the traditional rugby heartlands. They might not be doing well because the management is not performing well.

Or they might be doing well because they cannot afford good management, they do not have enough volunteers, they do not have enough members and supporters.

Finally, I would say that it is not only money which attracts players to a given club, what about the other advantages that can accrue from better employment potential, educational and other developmental facilities, lifestyle. Etc etc.

 

[Quick Hands]

There are so many advantages that accrue from being at one of the traditional, inner city, clubs. The only thing that can counterbalance those advantages is money, money, money. Now, who sang that?

Drummoyne were a traditional inner city club and that alone didn't help them that much.

Yes, it's definitely harder for a new team in a non-traditional area - that's why the governing body have a role in providing assistance. The AFL and the NRL both do it - and before you say that rugby doesn't have as much money as the AFL and the NRL, I'll simply point out that setting up a SS club in greater western Sydney would require a fraction of the money required to set up an AFL club in the same area. Same principle, just a different quantum of cash and resources required.

Even though the area itself isn't a traditional rugby heartland, there is a significant immigrant population of pacific islanders living in the area. You only have to get 10% (or less) of them, plus a similar percentage of the population at large to have the players. They need a well-run and competitive club to play for.

Using an example close to your expertise - Parramatta and Eastwood are neighbouring clubs (with a border which at times looks quite illogical - North Rocks part of Eastwood and Hills part of Parramatta). I know that there has been a significant leakage of colts and grade players from Parramatta to Eastwood over the years - the fairly obvious reason being that Eastwood are perceived to successful and well-run (certainly that's always been my perception). Not meant to have a go at Parra, but I think it's the perception out there (rightly or wrongly)

 

[wamberal]

I see that the Woodies scored the last five tries of the game against the Wicks. WTF????



On the other subject, yes, Eastwood has been pretty well administered for the last dozen or more years. A close relative of mine happens to be the GM of the Football club.


But of course we went broke to the tune of a lazy mill or so 15 or 20 years ago, which is why we had to sell our soul to North Ryde RSL Club.


We do have a strong supporter base, I don't think that is the result of good management, it has a lot to do with the demographics of our perceived supporter territory. Plus, success begets success. And we have been much more successful on the field than Parra for the last 30 years. Before that it was a different story, but before that they had a very different supporter base. The demographics of their perceived supporter territory has been going against them.