School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[DragonMan]

What about the other 20?
You pick one kid who is doing something noteworthy apart from Rugby and think that explains away a cynical process of buying a premiership.
No one says the kids on the scholarships are not great kids.
It's the morally bankrupt method of the School that people object to.
There are several kids at that School that will derive absolutely no benefit from attending that school apart from
enhancing their prospect of a Schoolboy rep jumper.
But when they are mid twenties,have a Mungo career that never took off and have qualifications that might get them a job in the drive thru at Mcdonalds. They will always have that premiership to look back on.
But then that's not your problem is it?

You asked for an example and I gave you an example. You had intially referred to 13 of 15 boys, it was then pointed out that much less than that number are on full schoarship. Whe did it suddenly jump to 20 boys who are on pure sports scholarships? I presume that you have fingers (you are quick to point them) so do youur own research before making unfounded accusations. In addition you refer to some of these boys as "semi professional footballers" Were they 'semi-professional' at the age of 12 or 15 when they were allegedly offered sports schoalrships? I have said that I do not agree with pure sports scholarships in my initial post, but if a boy can contriubte ot the school in many other other areasit can only be mutually beneficial. A GPS education (whether or not the lad ends up playing league) opens a lot more doors that a job at a McDonald's drvie thru.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

http://newslocal.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx,
go ahead denigrate this humble and thoughtful young man's contribution to the wider community

All sorts of people make contributions to the wider community not just GPS attendees or scholarship holders.
Unless you are arguing that it is entirely coincidental that all these "leaders" and "all rounders" happen to be good footballers who have signed mungo contracts the morality of stacking a team is in question.
And in the wider scheme of things is not stacking a team to win, an ultimately meaningless, premiership sending a very bad message of materiality and win at all costs?

 

[I like to watch]

Me Voyeur,
thats a pretty simplistic view. If they don't attend that school then what do they have ? Likely not much.
I know of more than a few kids that have had/will have a much better grounding and enrty into the adult world because of the few years spent at a school like Newington.

The other alternative was to end up in a school where the educational care factor is a hell of a lot less.

Your arrogance astounds me.
If they didn't attend a GPS School, they would have no future.
So when they attain no Scholastic qualifications, from a GPS School they are all the better for the experience?
I think in many of the cases, from an education point of view.
Struggling students would actually be better off staying local, saving 12 to 15 hours commuting, and another 10? hours of training a week.
The School tie is only going to get them a job washing your daddy's car isn't it?

 

[DragonMan]

All sorts of people make contributions to the wider community not just GPS attendees or scholarship holders.
Unless you are arguing that it is entirely coincidental that all these "leaders" and "all rounders" happen to be good footballers who have signed mungo contracts the morality of stacking a team is in question.
And in the wider scheme of things is not stacking a team to win, an ultimately meaningless, premiership sending a very bad message of materiality and win at all costs?

You asked for an example where the recipient of an all rounder scholarship made a contribution other than on the football field and I gave you one. I never said altrusitic contributions were limited to GPS scholarship holders. Has this young man signed a league contract? Have any of the other alleged scholarship holders. If so please post a copy of the preamble of thec ontract and the execution clause wih their siganture (or more appropiately signature of their legal representative) here. In any event there are many all rounder sholarship holders (inlcuding Tongan boys) who are not in the First or Second XV.

 

[sarcophilus]

http://newslocal.newspaperdirect.com/epaper/viewer.aspx,
go ahead denigrate this humble and thoughtful young man's contribution to the wider community

Sorry haven't seen the article as the link went to about three different local papers.
Having said that I am sure most High schools have a social justice or similar group and I would not denigrate disparage or discourage social contribution or engagement of any adolescent.

what I would hold as week and irrelevant is anyone that uses their efforts as a distraction from the central issues of the discusion at hand or worse something to hide behind

 

[Ted S]

Your arrogance astounds me.
If they didn't attend a GPS School, they would have no future.
So when they attain no Scholastic qualifications, from a GPS School they are all the better for the experience?
I think in many of the cases, from an education point of view.
Struggling students would actually be better off staying local, saving 12 to 15 hours commuting, and another 10? hours of training a week.
The School tie is only going to get them a job washing your daddy's car isn't it?

Be astounded as much as you want. I am a product of the public school system so no private school blinkers.
I am merely saying that I personally know of more than a couple of boys that due to scholarships to private schools are getting a better environment than the one that they were in.
Even though I may have given the impression that it was all about education, its also about the kids they are hanging around and in some of the instances I know of, there is a huge difference.

I could be wrong but I get the perception that you have a big problem with kids getting into private schools that can't afford it.
You appear to be labeling these kids as idiots with no future merely because they they are on scholarships and are good at football.

Oh well I am arrogant so what do I know ....

 

[sarcophilus]

Hiding behind a cartoon character and a nom de guerre is legitimate and really tough

 

[Inside Shoulder]

You asked for an example where the recipient of an all rounder scholarship made a contribution other than on the football field and I gave you one. I never said altrusitic contributions were limited to GPS scholarship holders. Has this young man signed a league contract? Have any of the other alleged scholarship holders. If so please post a copy of the preamble of thec ontract and the execution clause wih their siganture (or more appropiately signature of their legal representative) here. In any event there are many all rounder sholarship holders (inlcuding Tongan boys) who are not in the First or Second XV.

I most certainly did not ask for that.
Im not going to discuss kids who are still at the school - you can do your own research to see who is mentioned where and join the dots.
Last year the drum was that Moerea had signed with Parra during or prior to last season.
Low and behold he is in their Holden cup team for 2013. So the rumour mill was spot on with that one and it is generally pretty accurate on those things.
http://www.parraeels.com.au/nycplayerprofiles

 

[DragonMan]

I most certainly did not ask for that.
Im not going to discuss kids who are still at the school - you can do your own research to see who is mentioned where and join the dots.
Last year the drum was that Moerea had signed with Parra during or prior to last season.
Low and behold he is in their Holden cup team for 2013. So the rumour mill was spot on with that one and it is generally pretty accurate on those things.
http://www.parraeels.com.au/nycplayerprofiles

Sorry that was Speiber. Yes Tepai has signed with Eels And the other 20 kids allegedly on full lsports scholarships. Where are their contracts? I also do not want to mention lads when they are at school but I feel I need to defend them from baseless aacusations.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Be astounded as much as you want. I am a product of the public school system so no private school blinkers.
I am merely saying that I personally know of more than a couple of boys that due to scholarships to private schools are getting a better environment than the one that they were in.
Even though I may have given the impression that it was all about education, its also about the kids they are hanging around and in some of the instances I know of, there is a huge difference.

I could be wrong but I get the perception that you have a big problem with kids getting into private schools that can't afford it.
You appear to be labeling these kids as idiots with no future merely because they they are on scholarships and are good at football.

Oh well I am arrogant so what do I know ..

That's not the point at all. Or at least its not mine.
Maybe you need to read the thread from the beginning before attributing those sort of motives to people.
This is a rugby forum not a social justice forum.
As such my interest is, relevantly, in making Australian rugby as good as ti can be in every sense.
You may not have noticed but the ARU lets the private schools do most of the heavy lifting in junior development.
In consequence the few boys who get bursaries benefit and the thousands of potential players who cannot be accommodated in the private schools struggle to get a game of union, particularly in the west of sydney.
They therefore play other codes.
When they make their CHS U16 sides or whatever the GPS schools poach them from the CHS system and thereby weaken that system further.
This reduces the pool of available talent to the detriment of rugby at all levels.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Sorry that was Speiber. Yes Tepai has signed with Eels And the other 20 kids allegedly on full lsports scholarships. Where are their contracts? I also do not want to mention lads when they are at school but I feel I need to defend them from baseless aacusations.

Do the research -hell, go back to the posts in this thread about August 2011 and see the names and numbers of kids brought over from the NSW u16s side coincidentally coached by a Newington teacher.
What part of the accusation is baseless?

 

[DragonMan]

We are going around in circles here. Yes these kids are good football players but does that conclusively mean that they are at the school ONLY for their ability to play football?

 

[rugbyscribe]

1. Vuni Fifita Year 10 (Scholarship)
2. Campbell Shearer Year 7
3. Sione Fonua Year 11 (Scholarship)
4. George Prassas Year 9 (Scholarship)
5. Anthony Vasilis Year 11 (Scholarship)
6. Stuart Mill Year 11 (Scholarship)
7. David Morris Year 11 (Scholarship)
8. Lachlan Cannell Year 11 (Scholarship)
9. Joey Lussick Year 9 (Scholarship)
10. Ellis Abrahams Year 9 (Scholarship)
11. Sepesa Loga Year 7 (Scholarship)
12. Tepai Moeroa Year 9 (Scholarship)
13. Taane Milne Year 11 (Scholarship)
14. Josh Mitchell Year 7
15. Simon Kennewell Year 11 (Scholarship)

Putting aside the issue of scholarships for a moment what does it do to the morale of those who battled through the 13- 16 A's & B's etc only to have 7 of the 1st XV positions taken by boys who started in Yr 11????
I can probably understand maybe one boy arriving at a school in Yr 11 who was good enough to walk into the 1sts but not 7!!!

 

[Spieber]

We are going around in circles here. Yes these kids are good football players but does that conclusively mean that they are at the school ONLY for their ability to play football?

What was the criteria for these scholarships, was it broadly advertised, and how many other boys were allowed to apply. My guess is if you place an ad late year offering 10-20 bursaries for families suffering financial hardship you would attract an extremely high calibre of young men, who probably can play some sport reasonably well and would kick on at university etc. To take a couple of guys straight out of the U16s state team stinks of impropriety.

 

[DragonMan]

What was the criteria for these scholarships, was it broadly advertised, and how many other boys were allowed to apply. My guess is if you place an ad late year offering 10-20 bursaries for families suffering financial hardship you would attract an extremely high calibre of young men, who probably can play some sport reasonably well and would kick on at university etc. To take a couple of guys straight out of the U16s state team stinks of impropriety.

I do not work as an admissions officer for the College, perhaps your queries are best directed there. I do know however that the College advertises its scholarship/bursaries (which include criteria) on its website and I have posted that link previously.

 

[rugbyscribe]

I do not work as an admissions officer for the College, perhaps your queries are best directed there. I do know however that the College advertises its scholarship/bursaries (which include criteria) on its website and I have posted that link previously.

7 boys arriving in year 11 all on scholarships good luck to them. But all 7 walking into the 1st XV - that's just wrong!!!

 

[Inside Shoulder]

My guess is if you place an ad late year offering 10-20 bursaries for families suffering financial hardship you would attract an extremely high calibre of young men.

From what I hear at another school they dont get as many applicants as you'd expect

 

[Inside Shoulder]

We are going around in circles here. Yes these kids are good football players but does that conclusively mean that they are at the school ONLY for their ability to play football?

I think thats why this topic has its own thread and discussion of it outside the thread is verboten

 

[rugbyscribe]

Are there any other schools anywhere near where Newington are at - I can assure you that Joeys aren't.

 

[DragonMan]

Still unsure where the number "7 boys in the 1st XV coming in year 11" comes from.