School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[Braveheart81]

I went to a CAS school and when I was in year 12 I'd guess that there were around 5 boys in the first XV who arrived after year 7.

None of them were on a sporting scholarship.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I went to a CAS school and when I was in year 12 I'd guess that there were around 5 boys in the first XV who arrived after year 7.

None of them were on a sporting scholarship.

No one in the 1st XV was on any sort of scholarship when I was in it: we were all on last warnings!

 

[Quick Hands]

Are you therefore saying that there are 3 schools that satisfy the "over 10 new arrivals out of 15 post Year 7" test?

No, what I'm saying is that there are 3 schools who are systematically approaching boys based on their rugby ability. i.e. The schools or their agents are initiating the process rather than the boys or their parents. The usual process with bursaries and scholarships is that the school advertises them and then interested parties then apply. In the vast majority of cases this involves boys starting in Year 7 or Year 11.

The last sentence was clearly addressing your point about boys starting late who had siblings/fathers/grandfathers previously at the school.

 

[CTPE]

No, what I'm saying is that there are 3 schools who are systematically approaching boys based on their rugby ability. i.e. The schools or their agents are initiating the process rather than the boys or their parents. The usual process with bursaries and scholarships is that the school advertises them and then interested parties then apply. In the vast majority of cases this involves boys starting in Year 7 or Year 11.

The last sentence was clearly addressing your point about boys starting late who had siblings/fathers/grandfathers previously at the school.

I don't accept that either Joeys or Riverview have clean hands when it comes to enticing promising rugby players to the schools.

 

[I like to watch]

I went to a CAS school and when I was in year 12 I'd guess that there were around 5 boys in the first XV who arrived after year 7.

None of them were on a sporting scholarship.

Pre GFC I enquired with a GPS School regarding enrolments.
I was advised that unless you are wait listed in the first 10, it was extremely unlikely that a vacancy would occur in that cohort over the next 6 years.
So for 5 new arrivals to be of 1st XV quality is an unusually high hit rate.
In any event,does anyone credibly argue that Scots and New are not extremely active in the marketplace?

 

[Quick Hands]

I don't accept that either Joeys or Riverview have clean hands when it comes to enticing promising rugby players to the schools.

You may or may not be right with that view. In the conversations that I have with parents and players from this area is that 3 schools are initiating contact with them with a view to their sons changing schools. Riverview and Joeys aren't among those 3 schools.

As I see it their is a difference between parents being impressed with a school, going through the usual advertised scholarship/bursary process and then ending up at the school to parents or boy being approached by the school, sometimes in the middle of a school year, when to the general populace, there aren't any scholarships/bursaries to be applied for.

 

[Quick Hands]

Pre GFC I enquired with a GPS School regarding enrolments.
I was advised that unless you are wait listed in the first 10, it was extremely unlikely that a vacancy would occur in that cohort over the next 6 years.
So for 5 new arrivals to be of 1st XV quality is an unusually high hit rate.
In any event,does anyone credibly argue that Scots and New are not extremely active in the marketplace?

So true.

More red herrings on this thread than on a Scottish trawler.

Some people choose not to apply common sense for whatever reason.

 

[CTPE]

So true.

More red herrings on this thread than on a Scottish trawler.

Some people choose not to apply common sense for whatever reason.

Pre GFC I enquired with a GPS School regarding enrolments.
I was advised that unless you are wait listed in the first 10, it was extremely unlikely that a vacancy would occur in that cohort over the next 6 years.
So for 5 new arrivals to be of 1st XV quality is an unusually high hit rate.
In any event,does anyone credibly argue that Scots and New are not extremely active in the marketplace?

So five of Riverview's 2012 first XV started their rugby careers at the school in Year 10 or later (see #1198) - yet they have clean hands?

 

[Quick Hands]

So five of Riverview's 2012 first XV started their rugby careers at the school in Year 10 or later (see #1198) - yet they have clean hands?

Which was a rehash of a previous post, explained by fleshman in post 1036 on page 52.

 

[CTPE]

Which was a rehash of a previous post, explained by fleshman in post 1036 on page 52.

Noted but I'm not altogether convinced as both Riverview and Joeys have far too many boys of rep rugby quality who start at the schools after Year 7 - I think that this previous quote best sums up the situation up:

I think that your proposition only applies in strict terms to Grammar, High and probably Shore. I believe that all other GPS schools, including Riverview and Joeys, recruit rugby players but some just do it more subtly and on a lesser scale than others.

 

[rip]

Having a son in the Under 16 age group this year who has been involved in Rugby( Club/ Rep) since he was in the Under 7's and managing these teams I can assure you that neither the current View Shore or Joeys teams have offered financial inducements to any of their boys however the same cannot be said of New and Scots who have chased several players in this age group form both the Northern Beaches and Southern Suburbs

 

[Freddo Frog]

rip, just because you haven't heard about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. I have serious doubts that one third of the first XV would arrive at a school in yr 9 or 10 without some type of inducement. I'm not suggesting full scholarships, more likely a bit of fee relief to make one school more attractive than another.

 

[Quick Hands]

Adolescent boys can't keep this stuff secret. If they were approached by a school, they wouldn't be able to resist telling someone. I've never heard of a boy being approached by Joeys, Shore, Riverview, High or Grammar either from boys or parents whereas, like rip I have been told repeatedly of the activities of other schools. They can't all be making it up.

 

[random2]

I have a mate who left Joeys after playing in the As from 13s-15s, he was offered a straight up rugby scholarship to Riverview but turned it down because they wouldn't let him play league.

 

[George Smith]

Traditionally Joeys have been the pinnacle school for the Marist brotherhood. As such, underprivileged and/or talented students from the 49 Marist member schools are invited to complete their education at Hunters Hill.

Appearances of scholarships is therefore clouded. Many an Australian Schoolboy has attended Joeys on these 'scholarships' for the needy.

At Riverview, a Jesuit school, they proudly state that there are over 80 bursaries. These are not sporting scholarships but many a disadvantaged student excels as a person when given the opportunity.

 

[angrydog]

Traditionally Joeys have been the pinnacle school for the Marist brotherhood. As such, underprivileged and/or talented students from the 49 Marist member schools are invited to complete their education at Hunters Hill.

Appearances of scholarships is therefore clouded. Many an Australian Schoolboy has attended Joeys on these 'scholarships' for the needy.

At Riverview, a Jesuit school, they proudly state that there are over 80 bursaries. These are not sporting scholarships but many a disadvantaged student excels as a person when given the opportunity.

What a load of rubbish. Marist Canberra and Marist Ashgrove are probably the next strongest Marist rugby schools behind Joeys. Name one 'underprivilaged' kid who was invited to Joeys from either of these schools or any other for that matter who has gone on to play 1stXV or rep football ? Given Canberra has produced 30 odd Aussie schools reps (and 4 Wallabies and 4 current super players) and Ashgrove a similar number thats alot of these so called 'underprivilaged' that the pinnacle school let slip through the cracks. I can you tell you as an ex student of Canberra that this is untrue and actually rediculous. Where did you come up with this?

 

[angrydog]

Traditionally Joeys have been the pinnacle school for the Marist brotherhood. As such, underprivileged and/or talented students from the 49 Marist member schools are invited to complete their education at Hunters Hill.

Appearances of scholarships is therefore clouded. Many an Australian Schoolboy has attended Joeys on these 'scholarships' for the needy.

At Riverview, a Jesuit school, they proudly state that there are over 80 bursaries. These are not sporting scholarships but many a disadvantaged student excels as a person when given the opportunity.

I think you may have mistaken this form of scholarship giving, i.e under the guise of helping the needy, for the practice used by Christian Brothers schools such as Eddies, Nudgee and Augustines. They have perfected the art and assisted many an impoverished Pacific islander to progress to the schools 1stXV and Aussie schools team under a 'Edmund Rice scholarship'.

Marist schools are definately not afflicted by any obsession to win rugby comps by the assistance of scholarship giving, so much so that Joeys and Canberra have in recent years notcieably declined in their standards and success rates as opposed to schools who are highly active in scholarship offerings.

 

[George Smith]

What a load of rubbish. Marist Canberra and Marist Ashgrove are probably the next strongest Marist rugby schools behind Joeys. Name one 'underprivilaged' kid who was invited to Joeys from either of these schools or any other for that matter who has gone on to play 1stXV or rep football ? Given Canberra has produced 30 odd Aussie schools reps (and 4 Wallabies and 4 current super players) and Ashgrove a similar number thats alot of these so called 'underprivilaged' that the pinnacle school let slip through the cracks. I can you tell you as an ex student of Canberra that this is untrue and actually rediculous. Where did you come up with this?

hey "angrydog" your name suits you!
I remember playing with John Maguire in the '70s who then left a leading Catholic school in Canberra to go to Joeys where I believe he played a couple of years in their 1sts at 5/8 alongside the future Wallaby Steve Williams. (not to be confused with another Maguire in the same ACT age teams). Remember, back in those days Woden was just built and Tuggeranong was farmland! Maybe you were not born at this time?

 

[angrydog]

Not

hey "angrydog" your name suits you!
I remember playing with John Maguire in the '70s who then left a leading Catholic school in Canberra to go to Joeys where I believe he played a couple of years in their 1sts at 5/8 alongside the future Wallaby Steve Williams. (not to be confused with another Maguire in the same ACT age teams). Remember, back in those days Woden was just built and Tuggeranong was farmland! Maybe you were not born at this time?

Not quite sure what my DOB has to do with this?? You still havent answered my questions about who these supposed impoverished Marist students are that get offered up to the gods of St Josephs at the invite of the Brothers there? Was Maguire one of them or was he sent there by his parents? I could give you the names of numerous guys who went to Marist and Eddies and were sent to Joeys for high school or at least yr 11 and 12 by their parents. None of them were invited to Joeys, at least not until their parents had shown the Brothers the color of their money.

 

[Quick Hands]

I think you may have mistaken this form of scholarship giving, i.e under the guise of helping the needy, for the practice used by Christian Brothers schools such as Eddies, Nudgee and Augustines. They have perfected the art and assisted many an impoverished Pacific islander to progress to the schools 1stXV and Aussie schools team under a 'Edmund Rice scholarship'.

Marist schools are definately not afflicted by any obsession to win rugby comps by the assistance of scholarship giving, so much so that Joeys and Canberra have in recent years notcieably declined in their standards and success rates as opposed to schools who are highly active in scholarship offerings.

St Augustine's is NOT a Christian Brothers School, I don't know where you got that information from. They are not part of the Edmund Rice system or any other system, they are a stand alone school run by the Augustinian Order.

There is no mention of any form of scholarship or bursary on their website and in almost 50 years of living on the northern beaches, I've never seen them advertise any form of scholarship or bursary.

I'd be interested to know where your information came from about Edmund Rice Scholarships at Augustines.