S15 Rd 1 - Brumbies v Reds, Friday 13th February

[Merrow]

I was one that expected boring Brumbies rugby

Fuck, I was wrong.

Exciting and expansive was the result, at least from one side anyway

I certainly expect the return fixture to be a completely different story. Lots of good players to come back for the Reds. But man it was a pleasure to see the boys starting the season in such a positive way.

 

[Ash]

I really disagree.

LHP: Slipper is better than Robinson and as I said one of the only Reds players that would start for the Tahs. I'd prefer Tilse to Daly.

I think that Paraka is a better scrummagaer by a mile than both Tilse and Daley. Tilse is an average scrummager and average around the park, Daley is a very poor scrummager but good around the park. I would take neither for my side if I could help it.

As much as I like Daley, he's had years to fix his scrummaging but he's just not done it. I hope Paraka gets a shot for the Reds at some stage.

Hooker: TPN is better than Fainga'a. Hanson is better than Latu but not by a lot. Who knows between Roach and Paraka but I'm happy with Roach.

You mean Ready and Roach. I'd probably take Ready, he's a bit bigger and a bit more of a hooker. Roach is a bit small for a Super rugby hooker, but handy if you want a second openside running around.

THP: Kepu is miles ahead of Holmes and I'd rate Ryan and Ala'alatoa higher than Talakai and Faagase.

I'd actually rate both Talakai and Faagase better at scrummaging right now than Ryan, they were better in the set piece than Ryan in the NRC. Ryan is better around the park, though. Boy, Ryan was dominated by club looseheads in the NRC. It was sad to watch.

Alaatoa? No way. You have the wrong brother. He's not up to this level, unlike his brother at loosehead who shows potential. I'd take Talakai and Faagase easily, and both were comfortable better in the NRC.

Lock: The one area where the Reds are stronger. Simmons is a clear first choice but at the moment I'd much prefer Skelton to Horwill. Dennis, Chapman and Lousi will probably serve us better at Super Rugby level than Ed O'D and Kotze.

Horwill is done I think. I don't like Skelton as a starter, unless you have a second lock and couple of flankers that can make up for his current weaknesses in his game. We'll see how Skelton goes this year, I have hopes that his set pieces can be worked on.

I don't rate O'Donoghue at all, plus he's really getting on - 32 or 33?

I don't think you can say anything about Lousi in his first year as a league convert in a specialist rugby position. I'd take Kotze, but you wouldn't want to rely too much on either.

Chapman I don't rate overly highly now either, but he's useful as a lineout lock. Lock is easily the Tahs weakest position, there's Skelton who needs to fix his shortcomings, then some makeshift locks in Dennis, Chapman, Potgeiter, Holloway and Lousi. They are great around the park as extra blindsides, but set pieces are not too great. It works for the Tahs, though, as we saw last year, as their dominance around the park covered up for their averageness in the set piece.

I'd take McDuling over any of the locks you mentioned, though. He's actually a lock and was fantastic in the NRC, both in the set piece and around the park. If he ever stays fit. Which I am begging to doubt.

Openside: Hooper is well ahead of Gill now and as I said, Beau Robinson might be marginally ahead of Pat McCutcheon and Dempsey and Gunn are probably a toss up.

Beau is streets ahead of Cutch I think, but not that it matters.

Blindside: I'd have Potgieter, Hoiles and Gray ahead of Thomson, Browning and Quirk.

I'd wait to see how Thomson goes, at his peak he was easily better than Hoiles and Gray. Although a different player to Potgieter, but boy Thomson was influential for the Clan. My worry for Thomson is his age. Agree on the rest.

I had high hopes for Browning, but he hasn't lived up to them. Browning was disappointing in the NRC for me, and hasn't shown the physicality I thought he'd bring.

No8: Palu is well ahead of Schatz. Holloway is also ahead of Lolo Fakaosilea.

Agree.

I just don't get where you're coming from here saying that the Reds have a better pack on paper. Maybe the skill sets of each position (at least at Super Rugby level) are outdated. The Reds have been excellent at scrum and lineout and belted around the park in just about every game.

I agree that they have more talent than the results are reflecting but their problems are fairly profound.

Who are all these amazing Reds forwards who are just not being coached well particularly when we're discussing depth?

I think you overrate the Tahs depth, but not their starting pack.

Reds do have more depth, particularly in the set piece. Starting, the Tahs pack is better in just about any position other loosehead and a lock (two if Horwill ever regains any form, which looks nigh on impossible).

However, the Reds coaching for the ruck looks like a rabble. Stiles is a good set piece coach, but his ruck work leaves a lot to be desired. It doesn't help that the Reds apparently have a game plan that is impossible to follow.

 

[Ash]

Just saw the request for no more Tahs comments. Sorry!

Back on topic: Reds were a steaming pile of poo. Criticism of Horwill is warranted, what he did was brainless and worse than his behaviour when he was captain. It looked like he just didn't care.

 

[Sully]

Any off topic comments will be deleted from now on. In any match thread.

 

[A mutterer]

If you were a past Reds/Queensland or ex-Super player, then you would be qualified to make the uncomplimentary remarks that appear here.
But I seriously doubt that any of those players would stoop to the low levels seen here.

matt bourke?

 

[Wilson]

Still absolutely filthy about that reds performance, looked like a different team to the one who turned out against the crusaders, particularly in the pack. It'll take a huge turn around to be in it next week against a force side who are very good at the breakdown.

On a positive note the brumbies came out looking well drilled, especially for the first round, really makes me want to see larkham in the wallabies set-up.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Gotta agree wholeheartedly with Bairdy re White, thought it was one of best halfback performances by an aussie for a while, I know he was behind a dominant pack, but he did something not often seen over here , played heads up rugby, he almost looked like a player who didn't spend all his young years at an academy being coached systems, but played what was in front of him.

Wholeheartedly agree with you Dan about Nic White. Have been saying for some time that he has the best all-round half back game of any No 9s in Australia, and I think it really showed in this game. Looking for his options and putting them away rather than just passing by rote to one side or the other. His short run, long pass to Coleman for Tomane's try was a good example of his vision.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Wholeheartedly agree with you Dan about Nic White. Have been saying for some time that he has the best all-round half back game of any No 9s in Australia, and I think it really showed in this game. Looking for his options and putting them away rather than just passing by rote to one side or the other. His short run, long pass to Coleman for Tomane's try was a good example of his vision.

Match losing box kick @ Suncorp notwithstanding?

 

[liquor box]

Gotta agree wholeheartedly with Bairdy re White, thought it was one of best halfback performances by an aussie for a while, I know he was behind a dominant pack, but he did something not often seen over here , played heads up rugby, he almost looked like a player who didn't spend all his young years at an academy being coached systems, but played what was in front of him.

I realised he was having a blinder when I decided he was my new most despised player, this by the way is a compliment.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Match losing box kick @ Suncorp notwithstanding?

Been done to death.

But since you mention it, there was a certain No 10 who missed a critical tackle to let the winning try in minutes later. That had more impact than the kick which had to be made under a lot of pressure and no support.

 

[mst]

Match losing box kick @ Suncorp notwithstanding?

Rinse & repeat.......So, what about the unwavering support of the fans? Well maybe a piece of the puzzle is the brain fucking we, the fans do to some of the Wallabies. So the forwards bleed on the field and give it their all, maybe they aren't the world’s best, but good or bad they are going to get bagged regardless of the results – that’s a sure thing nowadays, (again read a forum).


Do the maths on the elements and we may see indicators why some players are walking, and why the supporter base is dwindling.


http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/co...k-for-the-wallabies.15066/page-19#post-709320

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Been done to death.

But since you mention it, there was a certain No 10 who missed a critical tackle to let the winning try in minutes later. That had more impact than the kick which had to be made under a lot of pressure and no support.

The argument concerns the "had to be made" claim.
Never mind.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Brums flogged us, The Brums were very very good and we were very nvery poor,

The Force were good and the Tahs not so good.

The Brums played better than the Force and the Tahs better than us.

The weekend was full of disappointing surprises (well to me anyway)

 

[Ruggo]

I think the vindictiveness against Horwill is just a bit overboard.
Sure, the guy had a bad night on the paddock. But some of the comments I'm reading here about him make me wonder if I shouldn't move away from this forum.
He did bad, sure. But what will be the comments from the mud slingers when he comes out and has a big game, and it will happen.
If you were a past Reds/Queensland or ex-Super player, then you would be qualified to make the uncomplimentary remarks that appear here.
But I seriously doubt that any of those players would stoop to the low levels seen here.
But Big Kev is a great servant of Reds/ Wallabies rugby, and I wish him luck for the rest of the season.

I think you are seeing it from the wrong angle. The most staunch supporters of his on these pages even took their pound of flesh from him. I think that speaks volumes about his performance.

We need him and I hope he bounces back.