RWC Pool C - Australia v Wales - 5AM 25 Sep AEST

[Braveheart81]

Yeah I think Fiji put to bed the idea that you can just select a player based on kicking alone or one or two other qualities. What we gained in goal kicking was not equal to what we lost in decision making, overall skills, or defence.

Kellaway is one of the only players that actually has experience as well as half way decent form.

Does that flip Gordon to the bench or out of the 23 entirely?

It's hard to see Donaldson getting dropped given Gordon got dragged after 50 minutes.

 

[Sword of Justice]

Does that flip Gordon to the bench or out of the 23 entirely?

It's hard to see Donaldson getting dropped given Gordon got dragged after 50 minutes.

Hopefully we get one of my guys QC (Quade Cooper) or JOC (James O'Connor). You no doubt recall how I thought QC (Quade Cooper) should have been our 10 months prior to the squad being formed.

In all seriousness I don't think we can change course now. It would literally be miracle chasing if we replaced Gordon who was the form 10 all year with a guy who was struggling for form at Fullback.

 

[Slim 293]

13 or 15 or at least bloody 23. Don't know how Eddie is so comfortable ignoring one of our few good decision making players.

Between Kellaway and Ikitau, we're missing a lot of smarts in the backline...

 

[Braveheart81]

Hopefully we get one of my guys QC (Quade Cooper) (Quade Cooper) or JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor). You no doubt recall how I thought QC (Quade Cooper) (Quade Cooper) should have been our 10 months prior to the squad being formed.

In all seriousness I don't think we can change course now. It would literally be miracle chasing if we replaced Gordon who was the form 10 all year with a guy who was struggling for form at Fullback.

We're clearly not getting anyone new now. If an injury change to the squad was to be made so they could play in the Wales game it would have surely happened within a day of the Fiji game.

It seems to me that if we're going to see Kellaway in the 23 it's as a replacement for Gordon or Vunivalu. I agree that Gordon at 10 and Donaldson at 15 is probably the most likely.

 

[Sword of Justice]

We're clearly not getting anyone new now. If an injury change to the squad was to be made so they could play in the Wales game it would have surely happened within a day of the Fiji game.

It seems to me that if we're going to see Kellaway in the 23 it's as a replacement for Gordon or Vunivalu. I agree that Gordon at 10 and Donaldson at 15 is probably the most likely.

I think Vunivalu is a luxury we can't afford right now. He'd be world player of the year for a top team but we need more fundamentals.

I think Donaldson is better suited to 23 to cover 10 and 15 with Kellaway on the bench. With Kellaway as cover for 13, both wings and starting at Fullback I think it's likely they would all 3 play significant minutes.

 

[fatprop]

Jones was a mistake. We may have been struggling under Rennie but he had a recognisable direction and game plan. He had a nucleus of senior players to take us through this RWC. Would we have won? Extremely unlikely but we would most likely have performed to a reasonable standard considering our limitations and resources. At least a quarter final and possibly a semi.
We have absolutely bottomed out after a few short months with Jones and he will not be given the opportunity to turn it around, an unlikely scenario in any case. He is fast tracking our decline.

I think the only difference between Jones and Rennie is where we would lose, stay with the elders? - it wasn't going to be a recipe for success, we would have just lost differently

 

[duckbill]

You sure as hell don’t implement a game plan that is beyond your players. The nucleus of this team under Dave Rennie would have got through this pool undefeated most likely. They were good at most of those things a year ago.
The easiest draw in our RWC history……..

Good article from the Roar. Right on the money

COMMENT: Eddie must be axed if he can't beat Wales - or the game will be in deep trouble in Australia

When you find yourself in a deep hole digging, stop digging. How do you mitigate the original error of hiring Eddie Jones too late…

www.theroar.com.au

Not sure if this has been posted already, but there's some great info on Rennie.

Kerevi really comes across well

 

[eastman]

No we weren't good at those things last year ffs

9 losses last year, 2 of which were to Eddie Jones. Close score lines like a 48-17 loss & a 40-14 loss

And, no, it's not a good article. It's just another vitriolic article that provides zero solutions, which is unsurprising considering who wrote it

You’re the only guy supporting EJ (Eddie Jones) at the moment, and I’m still not sure what it’s based on? We have objectively and subjectively gone backwards.

 

[eastman]

I think the only difference between Jones and Rennie is where we would lose, stay with the elders? - it wasn't going to be a recipe for success, we would have just lost differently

A full strength team under Rennie? We comfortably win our pool and make the semi-finals (which we lose).

 

[noscrumnolife]

You sure as hell don’t implement a game plan that is beyond your players. The nucleus of this team under Dave Rennie would have got through this pool undefeated most likely. They were good at most of those things a year ago.
The easiest draw in our RWC history……..

Good article from the Roar. Right on the money

COMMENT: Eddie must be axed if he can't beat Wales - or the game will be in deep trouble in Australia

When you find yourself in a deep hole digging, stop digging. How do you mitigate the original error of hiring Eddie Jones too late…

www.theroar.com.au

Sorry, don't put much stock into some random saffa's opinion on rugby. Harry Jones seems like a nice guy but have no idea why he is called an "expert" by The Roar. Comes across as another bloke in the press with an axe to grind because Eddie calls them out on the absolute rubbish they make a living off putting out. Might as well call you or I an expert, the content is no different to what you could read on this forum.

Not defending EJ (Eddie Jones), although I'm more positive than most. Certainly disagree with a few (but not all) recent selection decisions, but I'd much prefer to see us try something new than trot out Jed Holloway and the like and sit around wondering where it all went wrong after a quarters exit...

 

[eastman]

You also retain a lot of goodwill in the sport; ditching an absolute legend in Michael Hooper, and a good servant in Quade; for this outcome?

What was the fucking point?

 

[Tomthumb]

You’re the only guy supporting EJ (Eddie Jones) (Eddie Jones) at the moment, and I’m still not sure what it’s based on? We have objectively and subjectively gone backwards.

How am I supporting him? How
Many times do I have to say he deserves all the blame for the Fiji loss

but I don’t think we really have gone backwards. We had a close loss to Argentina, a team that beat us 48-17 last year, a close loss and a not so close loss to NZ which is exactly the same as last year. Add in a bad loss to South Africa that we also had last year and it all feels pretty similar to me

 

[Tomthumb]

A full strength team under Rennie? We comfortably win our pool and make the semi-finals (which we lose).

1. We wouldn’t have a full strength team, we would be at least 17 injuries deep by now
2. No win was ever comfortable under Rennie

 

[fatprop]

A full strength team under Rennie? We comfortably win our pool and make the semi-finals (which we lose).

I would suggest the same for Jones, but we don't have a full strength team, we have two of our best pigs injured

We rarely have a fully fit side and the back ups aren't just up to it - yet

and most of our elders have been all either injured or coming back from major injury (and still looking for form)

we are in a lose/lose position

 

[dusk]

A full strength team under Rennie? We comfortably win our pool and make the semi-finals (which we lose).

I'm sure Eddie could have picked a full-strength squad and made it to the semi-finals as well?

 

[Derpus]

I'm sure Eddie could have picked a full-strength squad and made it to the semi-finals as well?

Dreaming.

 

[DropGoal]

 

[Rugby King]

Gordon deserves to be dropped

Not even Cooper would have made ground with our hopeless forwards.

 

[Rugby King]

BH, my impression of the game was that Donaldson didn't take any of the high balls, at least none of the contestable ones. The game plan seemed to have Gordon, Petaia and Koroibete (of all players) back for the high balls. It simply looked to me that it was intentional to keep BD away from any high kicks.

It is clear to me that we have little chance of beating Wales and therefore progressing with the backline we've been playing. The forwards were outstanding against Georgia and more than serviceable against Fiji. They will hold their own and need minimal change, injuries aside.

The backline is just about the worst functioning I've seen in a Wallabies side. Nic White is not doing the others any favours by overusing the box kick, even though we do seem to win back a fair number of them when Nawaqanitawase chases. Carter Gordon is standing way too deep and is not bringing his game management skills to bear. Both, I'm sure are working to direct instructions from Jones. Kerevi is a mere shadow of his best from a couple of years ago, but even at his best he is a very limited player, Jordan Petaia is so far outclassed in the 13 jersey it isn't funny. His only spot where he seems to make test grade is on the wing. His decision making at 13 when the team is on attack is abysmal. And there must be big questions about his ability to defend the 13 spot too. Today's game it looked like Kerevi had the job of shutting down the Fiji captain, and also seemed to take the lead in directing others in the defensive line. Vunivalu just should not be there. He doesn't offer adequate cover off the bench and we have better wingers in the squad. Ben Donaldson is there for his kicking game, that's all. Tom Wright would have done Tom Wright things, but I'm confident he, and Andrew Kellaway too had he been given a chance, would have set up more than a few attacking raids against Fiji where Donaldson's inclination is to kick it back. His goal kicking however probably keeps him in the 15 jersey for Wales.

I hope Pone is fit Wales. If so, I think he should start and be given instruction to run as hard as he can for as long as he can. James Slipper actually got the better of his opposite LHP this game but should revert to the LH side to back up Bell. Philip contested good in the lineout when he came on and I think ought to replace Arnold in the starting side. Kemeny has to be in the squad for Wales. He should either start at 7 or come off the bench but in any case give McReight a rest from this game to see if a bigger body can do the job.

Going for more attack in the backline, I'd start Fines-Leleiwasa at 9 and Tate, if fit, on the bench. IFL unleashed by Eddie has more attacking nous that Tate imo and certainly a better pass and kicking game when needed. Gordon must be retained at 10 but told to play in the line like he does at the Rebels. We need to attack at every opportunity and BD doesn't give us that option. I think Kerevi has been a disappointment but he's the best we've got at 12. Someone has to leave early this week to allow Len Ikitau to take his rightful spot at 13. Failing that, bring Kellaway into 13, but get Petaia out of there.

So, I'd like to see:

Bell, Porecki, Pone, Frost, Philip, Hooper, Kemeny, Valetini, IFL, Gordon, Koroibete, Kerevi, Ikitau (Kellaway), Nawaqanitawase, Donaldson.

Reserves : Faessler, Slipper, Nonggorr, Arnold, Gleeson, Tate, Kellaway (Petaia), Jorgenson.

Where is Lenny Ikatau? Best 13 !!
Where is O’Connor?
surely BD isn’t the best 15 in Oz!!!!

If BD was at the Reds, he wouldn’t be there.

 

[Dctarget]

Poor Carter Gordon, big fan of him but he should be benched at least at the moment.

Despite clearly designing a gameplan to wreck him, Simon Raiwalui has tweeted that Carter's a great young talent with a big future in front of him and that he'll be the wallabies fly half for a long time to come.
Probably could've apologised for sending Tuisova to absolutely ruin him aha.