Round 7 Reds v Brumbies, Suncorp Stadium 2/4 @ 6:45pm AEST

[Cancelled Account]

I was happy to see Daugunu get a try on his 50th cap. He looked like he had a hop in his step last night. Good to see he’s back on track.
How in the hell have the Brumbies got more Wallabies in the squad than the Reds????? I’m not saying this because we won, more so because our players edge in front on all counts.

 

[Wilson]

Yet to re-watch the game for a detailed view, but very happy with that performance from the stadium. McDermott offers so much out there, our locks were excellent again and it was great to see Daugunu get a try in his 50th. Petaia had a great 60 minutes at full back after an early error. He fell off a bit after that, but he also held up better for the 80 then he has recently and I think he may just need to get used to playing the full match out.

On the cards I thought they were all correct at the time and the players and most likely the coaches only have themselves to blame. They need to be spending real time during the week working on getting tackle heights down and improving technique, because what they're doing at the moment isn't working. I do have a bit of sympathy for Cam Clarke, I think we've got the balance wrong on the intentional knock down rule that it basically starts at a yellow but that's the way it's refereed, so the call was pretty consistent.

Also I noticed Jim Tucker stated that the crowd was booing the Valetini crowd because they didn't think it was a card:

4 VALETINI...UNLUCKY

It’s broken record stuff now but they're so often seems a mitigating circumstance on yellow and red cards.

It was hard to see what Brumbies backrower Rob Valetini had done that was so evil.

By the very nature of being elusive, his target (Tate McDermott) was twisting, turning, stepping and dropping his body height.

Valetini went in hard and seemed to catch the lowering McDermott high on the inside of his beefy bicep with a wrapping arm.

There were 13,257 Queensland fans in the stands and even they booed at that yellow card call.

He's got this one wrong in my opinion. Where I sit in the members section there was a lot of booing as he went off, but most of it was partisan reds fans baying for blood - they wanted a red card.

 

[wamberal]

Whether you measure it from passes, possession etc, Reds are simply doing a lot more with the ball they get. They didn't get any more than the Brumbies but simply did stuff will they had the chance.

The Reds wanted to win; the Reds believed that they could win.

 

[Froggy]

Great win for the Reds. Tate was outstanding, the guy was real threat constantly, as he was last week against the Tahs, would be my test 9 any day ahead of White. Reds pack got over the more highly decorated Brumby pack, and without Lolesio the Brumby backs just couldn't get going.
I agree with a lot of what's being said about the cards, although there certainly was mitigation in the Valetini one, as Tate dropped about a foot into the tackle. There was head contact, and yellow was the right outcome.
I know it was technically correct, but Cam Clarke's yellow demonstrates that is a rule that needs revisiting. We have nearly reached a point where any contact with the ball by a defender is a yellow unless he catches it clean. It was designed to penalise the cynical knock-down, and there is no way that describes Clarke's contact.

 

[TSR]

Yeah - I’ve never liked the intentional knock down rule.

I believe the refs got the ruling right, but would rather it was just a penalty.

 

[fish59]

I’m still not convinced Tuialima even needed to enter the ruck?I thought the ball was available.

I was listening to the referee commentary at the time and he said they had won the turnover but lost because of that clean out.

 

[kiap]

So what if half a dozen players get cards!

That's actually a good question - for a couple of reasons.

First, as you say, it's about moving the onus back on to players and coaches to change their ways to avoid cards (more so suspensions ... and even moreso - increasing instances of head trauma).

Then you can also put the question to fans of the game: "What does it matter?" And the reality is that a card doesn't mean as much in the scheme of a match as it may have in the past.

Even a RC rarely kills a game if there's a replacement after 20 minutes. Sure, a wrong call is hard to take ... but it's usually a cumulative effect of multiple events on the day that's more damaging to the result (player's mistakes, lopsided penalty count, opposition too good).

Reds have incurred a few cards of late. Leaving the machinations to the mid week but getting on with the game at hand, is the way to go.

 

[TSR]

Kiap - it is an excellent point you make. One of the big criticisms of cards is that they ruin the game. But do they? Teams adapt these days. Sure, it has an impact, but not to the extent it is sometimes made out to.
The caveat to that is it is still frustrating the time taken to review incidents and the interruption to game flow. We do need either a streamlined method of decision making or, need to deal with far more of these issues post game and reduce incidents like deliberate knock downs to a straight penalty except in the most blatant cases which would fall under ‘professional foul/cynical play’.

 

[wamberal]

Yeah - I’ve never liked the intentional knock down rule.

I believe the refs got the ruling right, but would rather it was just a penalty.

What about a situation where your team has a three to one overlap 10 metres from the line, and the sole defender manages to slap the final pass down. Are you happy to lose a match winning try like this?

 

[HJ Nelson]

Photos from last night

Reds & Yellows as Queensland Tame Brumbies

What better way for Filipo Daugunu to celebrate his 50th Super Rugby game, than to score the match winning try. The Queensland Reds defeated the Brumbies 21 - 7 at Suncorp Stadium in a top of the table clash.A total of 4 cards, 1 Red & 3 Yellow (Tuaina Taii Tualima - Red 33rd Min, Rob Valetini...

www.tremainfocused.com

 

[dru]

What about a situation where your team has a three to one overlap 10 metres from the line, and the sole defender manages to slap the final pass down. Are you happy to lose a match winning try like this?

Wam, this is not the circumstance we are actually discussing. But if there is an knock on that is cynical play in defence of a very likely try - professional foul, RC and penalty try.

It's not the only situation where the card comes out for this issue, not at all. It's not black and white, and last night was so light-grey I'm calling it white. Play on surely if there is common sense.

Edit: more than this. No rugby fan should be happy with 80 mins of play interrupted by 4x cards and 22 penalties. Think about the impact to time actually playing rugby. No I don't think this is simply a reffing issue. Coaches and players have definite responsibility. But for the good of rugby, I'd like to see those numbers reducing.

 

[Ignoto]

I don't see the problem the Clarke yellow. He wasn't in a position to gather that ball and it could have resulted in try for the Reds.

It's fine to make those attempts to intercept but put both hands out.

 

[TSR]

What about a situation where your team has a three to one overlap 10 metres from the line, and the sole defender manages to slap the final pass down. Are you happy to lose a match winning try like this?

Firstly - I’ll accept whatever comes. If the situation above was within the rules, then of course I’d accept it. I might not be happy with my teams execution, but if they fuck up a 3 on 1 and the other team doesn’t break the rules, whose fault is that?

I’ve had the odd rant about refereeing on here but, by and large, I don’t think I have much form on complaining about the impact of ref mistakes on the outcome of games.

That said, to clarify my comments, I think cynical play - including deliberate knock downs - should remain a card. Reflex actions or unsuccessful attempts to intercept I think should be a penalty or scrum.

 

[Tomikin]

Firstly - I’ll accept whatever comes. If the situation above was within the rules, then of course I’d accept it. I might not be happy with my teams execution, but if they fuck up a 3 on 1 and the other team doesn’t break the rules, whose fault is that?

I’ve had the odd rant about refereeing on here but, by and large, I don’t think I have much form on complaining about the impact of ref mistakes on the outcome of games.

That said, to clarify my comments, I think cynical play - including deliberate knock downs - should remain a card. Reflex actions or unsuccessful attempts to intercept I think should be a penalty or scrum.

Yeah he was running backwards tipped it up trying to catch it.. not swot it down to stop.a try.. old mate shouldn't have thrown the ball so close to him..

 

[TSR]

Agree. From my perspective in a lot of these cases it is poor execution on both parts - but only one side gets penalised for it.

 

[wamberal]

Agree. From my perspective in a lot of these cases it is poor execution on both parts - but only one side gets penalised for it.

I suppose it is better to err on the side of the team in possession? BTW I thought a penalty would have been enough for Clarke's offense.

 

[SteveWA]

Yeah he was running backwards tipped it up trying to catch it.. not swot it down to stop.a try.. old mate shouldn't have thrown the ball so close to him..

The pass looked forward too. Still, thems the laws.

 

[fish59]

I was wondering if they were trying to get Filipo a try for his 50th. I was end on behind the tryline and thought a couple of passes that didn't come off seemed to be unnecessarily risky - I'm thinking particularly of the Clarke YC and and on another Reds attack Jordan P seemed a bit hesitant about whether the pass was for him and ended up dropping it near the try-line. It was only when they lobbed that pass for Filipo for his try that it occurred to me maybe that's what they were trying to do. I haven't had a chance to look back and see if he was a target or not as yet so I could be talking garbage

 

[Hawko]

I thought the game was a cracker and the card issue didn't detract from it at all. What interested me was some of the personal match-ups and the new pecking order it established. The Reds pack gave the Brumbies pack an absolute hammering despite the fact that some of the Brumbies played pretty well. In the backs the Brumbies were made to look absolutely pedestrian - I don't think one Brumby back could be said to come out of the game equal to his opponent.

Man to man:
The Brumby front row got owned. Worryingly that's the Australian first choice front row or was last season. Ala'alatoa should have done to his young opposite what Tupou did to Slipper you'd think, but he didn't. The four Brumby Wallaby hookers in one season clearly should be a thing of the past not to be repeated. There are better players in other franchises. I think Bell/Porecki/Tupou might start this year with Ala'alatoa under real pressure from HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) and Eloff. I'd have Kaitu'u on the bench at 16.
The second row battle was worth the admission price on its own and I thought a draw was a fair result, but the Reds far exceeded my expectations. Swain and Frost need to lift again if they want to establish their selection credentials.
McReight and Wilson were the best backrowers on the park by a handy margin. Over the season Valetini has been excellent but he was clearly behind last night.
Neither Brumby halfback will want to remember this game, they were both over-shadowed by Tate who is looking like the starting Wallaby 9.
JOC (James O'Connor) controlled the game beautifully, for me it was the best display from an Aussie 10 this year. One of the best five players on the park.
Stewart was good, and outpointed Simone. Paisami was my MOM and Ikitau got owned. For me, Wallaby 13 is a contest between Paisami and Perese; I might even think of pairing them up at 12/13.
Daugunu scored a try but none of the wingers stood out to me.
For the first 50 minutes, Petaia was sublime. His fitness cruelled his back end but even that is on the improve. In coming years as his body strengthens he will become a special player.

The best five players on the park I thought were all Reds players: Paisami, JOC (James O'Connor), Tate, McReight and Tupou. Wilson, Blythe and Smith couldn't make the top five despite their performances! The Brumbies have got a lot of work to do despite being top four.
For the uninitiated, I am a Waratahs supporter and have no skin in the game but I thought that was the best Super rugby game I have seen this season. I'll bet Dave Rennie thought so, too.

 

[TSR]

Can I just ask - do you mean that the 13 Wallabies role is between Paisami & Perese?

I otherwise agree with your post, but it was only one game.