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Richard Graham to quit the Force and join the Reds

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Riptide

Dave Cowper (27)
Have we calmed down yet?

How about another viewpoint:

One of the things Rugby (and most) organisations are shit at is meaningful succession planning. Rather than getting our knickers in a knot when Link "walks out on QLD" in a few years time, this sets up a possible transition - where the future coach has had time to fully understand and take on board the culture and systems in place, be involved in recruitment decisions etc. Keep momentum going (assuming it builds again...)

Link's been there and done that at provincial level now, he seems a rightly ambitious bloke to me. So he gives himself the best chance of pulling in the Wobbs job next time round, which maybe he sees as his last shot before taking another career line - senior sports management maybe? Politics?

This new structure makes that possible, and assuming they've had that chat at the top of the Reds, they are forward thinking to do it. It also might just be part of a grander plan that recognises rugby at a broader level needs to be healthy if the QLD dynasty is not to collapse again.

As for RG as the understudy, I guess this comes back to which side of the RG coaching capabilities thread you fell on. But it would seem that the Reds brains trust have sided on the "smart and committed individual handcuffed in an organisation with problems".

Has anyone faulted the need for succession planning or Link's ambition to advance his career (by either coaching he Wallabies, sports management, or becoming another right wing politician)?

Why was this leaked in the middle of the season? What possible good does this announcement accomplish for Australian rugby, for Western Force franchise or even Queensland for that matter?
 

kiap

Steve Williams (59)
Why was this leaked in the middle of the season? What possible good does this announcement accomplish for Australian rugby, for Western Force franchise or even Queensland for that matter?
It was not leaked, it was released via press conference. Are you suggesting they should have kept quiet on the deal and covered it up? RG recruiting players for the Force when he has secretly signed for the Reds?

It's naive to think that participants in professional sports only negotiate deals in the off-season. It happens when it happens, and no contract has been broken in this case. Far better to be out in the open with it.

While this season has not been ideal for the Force, this move could be a blessing in disguise for them. I'd suggest they were seriously looking at cutting RG in two months time anyway. The European season is coming to an end, and coaches there (from both NH and SH - Cheika, Smith, et al.) are likely looking for new contracts. In a couple of months, a guy like Penney could have been secured by Munster, and out of the market. TBH, the Force have probably been in touch with some of these coaches weeks ago.

The pain is exaggerated and the Force fans seem quite sanguine. Dogs may bark but the caravan moves on.
 

waratahjesus

Greg Davis (50)
Reading the articles and watching interviews on this overnight, it makes me wonder if the force will ever get there act together.

One thing that seems particularly strange is the notion put forth that David Pocock knew Graham was going for a few weeks and has been promised input in the choosing of a new coach and recruitment of players (even though he isn't signed for next year) this just seems like bad management, if other players are in fact finding out today and your captain has known for a couple of weeks and is choosing who is coming while waiting to decide if he stays or not, I would find it particularly hard to play for them.
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
As a Force fan I see this as encouraging news. Only the other day I posted on a thread on TWF wondering where the Force would be if we had done a proper international search for a coach when Mitchell left.
What made me say this at the time was seeing how well Jake White has transformed the Brumbies and of course how well Link had done at the Reds.
We were looking at another 2 full seasons under RG and we had not seen much to inspire us as fans. We have not been able to string two wins together and 4 try bonus points are few and far between.
Can someone explain to me why the Reds head-hunted RG? As last seasons premiers they would have been able to attract any number of world-class coaches. They must have seen something in him that they like.
Anyway, I'm quite happy with these developments, 2012 season is a write off but it gives me more hope now for 2013.


The reds needed someone prepared to work under link: no one with a track record would accept that situation.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

The Red Baron

Chilla Wilson (44)
The reds needed someone prepared to work under link: no one with a track record would accept that situation.

And further to that, the Reds needed someone Link could develop.

A person doesn't automatically become a great coach. Much like a talented player, they will only develop as far as their coaching setup permits. RG has never really been shown the ropes by a top class coach. Link has the opportunity here to really shape RG into exactly what he wants as a coach. I think (hope) that under Links guidance, RG will actually develop into a fine coach.

I'm still yet to get my popcorn though.
 

TheBigDog

Nev Cottrell (35)
I believe I read an article last week about the Reds just getting out of their debt to the ARU two years earlier than expected or something. I guess they have some more money to play with now and decided to use it to bring in another level of coaching/leadership, at least thats what it looks like to me to some extent. I don't have a problem with this as long as Link guides RG into the position well and is still pulling some strings from his watchtower.
 

Ignoto

Peter Sullivan (51)
How about another viewpoint:

I commend the QRU board for being proactive and wanting to ensure the development and continued success of the Reds by sorting this out in advance, however, I question whether Richard is the coach for us.

  1. What can Richard point coaching wise that suggests he's the best candidate for the Reds? Looking at his time in Australian rugby I'd call it a flop.
  2. What assurances can he give that he wont leave mid-way through this contract. I'm not a fan of coaches (and players) leaving before they've finished a job and it speaks to the character of a person giving up before completing a promise.
This whole setup of Link going up to a higher level should mean we promote internally (and I guess that's exactly why Matt Taylor left) so that the old coach can help guide a newer coach into the role. I'd much prefer a guy whos' been there through the hard yard given a go over a guy who's all talk.
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Does anyone think that this is good for Australian rugby - as it presently stands (i.e. leaving out the possibility that it clears the way for the early departure of Dingo)?
 

tigerland12

John Thornett (49)
The only positive about this for me is the chance of signing Pocock. I have no idea why they think Richard Graham is the right man for the position, I can understand the process of Link moving to the Director of Coaching, that's fine by me, but Graham, really?
 

brokendown

Bill McLean (32)
Reading the articles and watching interviews on this overnight, it makes me wonder if the force will ever get there act together.

One thing that seems particularly strange is the notion put forth that David Pocock knew Graham was going for a few weeks and has been promised input in the choosing of a new coach and recruitment of players (even though he isn't signed for next year) this just seems like bad management, if other players are in fact finding out today and your captain has known for a couple of weeks and is choosing who is coming while waiting to decide if he stays or not, I would find it particularly hard to play for them.


I suspect all of the team knew of the decision,but were told to keep quiet until the announcement
 

GaffaCHinO

Peter Sullivan (51)
The only positive about this for me is the chance of signing Pocock. I have no idea why they think Richard Graham is the right man for the position, I can understand the process of Link moving to the Director of Coaching, that's fine by me, but Graham, really?

I am going to say it now There is NO chance David Pocock with leave the Force! The only people it will affect are the Reds and i hope their fans like to kick the ball away and to see their players skill levels decrease.
 

tigerland12

John Thornett (49)
I am going to say it now There is NO chance David Pocock with leave the Force! The only people it will affect are the Reds and i hope their fans like to kick the ball away and to see their players skill levels decrease.
Is that just wishful thinking Gaffa? :p
 

the sabanator

Ron Walden (29)
As I mentioned "When the Franchise Started!" Forced Lured QLD and other player with money and big deals. Watching great potential future QLD rugby player leave and seeing them play for other team made me bitter.
So this is nice for me. Next Pocock will be locking down back QLD.
I have mixed feelings with bringing Pocock to QLD. If he comes here the progress of Liam Gill will be slowed right down, and considering he has the raw talent to compete with Pocock in 2 or so years and possibly overtake him in 4 or so - when Gill will only be 23. I think Gill is our best long term option at 7 for both Queensland and Australia.
 

Bruce Ross

Ken Catchpole (46)
I've come very late to this party but that's not because I haven't been following the thread. I've been looking for an angle to write about but the last 24 hours have reinforced the realisation that Australian rugby is satire and absurdity made manifest leaving little opportunity for embellishment. So regrettably, I'll have to stick to serious commentary.

The key to interpreting what has transpired is recognition that McKenzie has been the puppet master but with a qualification. He is pulling the strings in Brisbane but crucially not at St Leonards, although he is certainly trying to. He would not have been happy about the appointment of Totality Tony McGahan as backstop to Robbie Deans because the logical inference is that it is an attempt to shore up Deans's position. That appointment seems inconsistent with speculation that McKenzie is being positioned by the ARU to take over from Deans. (JO'N doesn't exactly work in lock step with his franchises anyway.) Rather it can be seen as McKenzie positioning himself so that he is further entrenched as heir apparent if the Deans-McGahan experiment fails to deliver world supremacy, which must be accepted as a logical possibility.

Should the national Head Coach position not fall into his lap McKenzie has secured himself a nice cosy future which is next best option to going back to live in his beloved Randwick. Next year he is to be the Reds Director of Coaching with an offsider as Head Coach who is no threat (of which more later). Then in 2014 he becomes "Queensland Rugby's inaugural Director of Rugby" where, we are told, "some of [his] objectives will be to drive growth and development in the community game which includes over 200 clubs, the redevelopment of Ballymore into an elite and community sporting precinct while maintaining a high level role in setting the direction of the Reds, particularly around talent pathways and recruitment and retention strategies."

Somehow I can't see McKenzie clocking up tens of thousands of kilometres driving up to Cloncurry and Mt Isa so this looks very much like a head office desk job where he will sit uneasily between the CEO and the Reds Head Coach. But it's a nice cushy job which should allow plenty of time for relaxation and flying back to Sydney. Not quite semi-retirement but a good lead in.

I note that "In 2013, McKenzie will ensure Graham’s transition into Queensland Rugby next year by facilitating the new coach’s knowledge and understanding of the unique sporting landscape in Queensland ..." Given that Richard Graham was born in Charleville and represented Queensland between 1998 and 2002, it might be more a case of the pupil instructing the teacher about "the unique sporting landscape in Queensland".

So what of Richard Graham, shoe-horned into the head coaching role by McKenzie? Between 2002 and 2006 he was an assistant coach at Bath under Michael Foley, then under ex-Wallabies coach John Connolly, and finally under ex-England coach Brian Ashton. He then moved on to Saracens as assistant to ex-Wallabies coach Eddie Jones, followed by a short stint as head coach. In June 2009 he came back to Australia as skills coach under current Wallabies coach Robbie Deans. Simultaneously he was assistant at the Western Force to ex-All Blacks coach John Mitchell, before taking the head role in September 2010.

Richard Graham has been under so many national coaches he must be the ultimate rugby groupie.

And what now for the Force? At the time they appointed Graham they passed over the best rugby brain and developer of talent in Australia. They may now have an opportunity to rectify that mistake by immediately appointing Todd Louden.
.
 

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Australian rugby is satire and absurdity made manifest leaving little opportunity for embellishment. So regrettably, I'll have to stick to serious commentary.

Rather it can be seen as McKenzie positioning himself so that he is further entrenched as heir apparent if the Deans-McGahan experiment fails to deliver world supremacy, which must be accepted as a logical possibility.
.


so in the absence of embellishment you opted for gross understatement, Bruce?
 

ChargerWA

Mark Loane (55)
What the Force needs is a coach who is willing to get down and dirty and develop West Australian youngsters.

I have come to the realisation that the only hope for long term regular success is to have a strong base of local players to compliment the stars that you can attract with cash.

The Force 2012 can only be described as a few well paid stars, a few ring in club players who no one else has seen fit to take a chance on and a core group of tourist journeymen players who would attract little interest from other clubs on the open market.

We need to get a guy who is willing to turn up to club trainings, be involoved in youth development programs and generally become emotionally invested in West Australian Rugby.

All the credentials under the sun are worthless if we get the best uncontracted coach in the world, only for him to realise in 18 months time the Force don't have the local depth to draw on and he loses faith and breaks contract. Ideally for me the next Force coach should be contracted for 5 years and purchase a house in Perth and move his family here. No more of this pussy footing around, I want commitment to the cause.
 

MrTimms

Ken Catchpole (46)
for what it's worth, the Presser Link held this morning to talk about the changes.


There is a break about a minute from the end, I was filming on my phone and some idiot rang me.
 
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