Refereeing decisions
- Thread starter boyo
- Start date
If there are two balls on the field (that influence play) then I think you have to stop play and award a scrum to the team in possession which is what happened here.
Dan54
David Wilson (68)
I don't think there is the words professional foul in the law book either mate, but comes under foul play, and referees have to take player out of equasion for foul play, whether it is written or not I have no idea. Don't see how it not PT, if he did control it into touch with his hand it is foul play, you cannot throw a ball into touch. By doing so he prevented the Scot's player from catching it, same as anytime a player knocks ball forward on purpose. Had he knocked it backwards there maybe an argument he wasn't trying to knock it into touch, but there were 2 acts of foul play, purposeful knockon AND knocking into touch off hand.
Wilson
Phil Kearns (64)
Yeah, I think it was probably the right call for the situation, though I wonder if the source of the second ball matters.
Dan54
David Wilson (68)
Yep that was how SBW's case was ruled, the player was a couple of metres away if I remember, he could easily of just put hand on top of ball but chose to bat it dead, was ruled a PT as he had committed a foul act to prevent a probable try.
"This was a press report;
Referee Angus Gardner reached into his pocket for a yellow card and the match officials confirmed a penalty try after watching video replays.
They ruled a Frenchman would have gathered Anthony Belleau's high kick and scored had Williams not got his big mitts in the way.
I thought Gardner was right there and (have never heard it argued as wrong ) and O'Keefe right in this case.
Pfitzy
Nathan Sharpe (72)
Yep. Usually it only happens at a stoppage so you can blow time off, but in live play if it will affect play, like passing it into the ref: scrum to attacking team.
Tomikin
David Codey (61)
Peter Breen on LinkedIn: Six Nations England v Scotland, 4Mins into extra time, 5th reset scrum in…
Six Nations England v Scotland, 4Mins into extra time, 5th reset scrum in a row, how would you handle the pressure as a referee? In this video International…
www.linkedin.com
Pretty good insight from Dr Ben
waiopehu oldboy
George Smith (75)
Thoughts on PGS hurdling ASmith?
Wonderfully athletic but surely dangerous or at least reckless.
Wonderfully athletic but surely dangerous or at least reckless.
Tomikin
David Codey (61)
waiopehu oldboy
George Smith (75)
The laws almost certainly need tightening up in this instance.
I agree that it is dangerous play but where does it end? If you just jump over and outstretched arm that is trying a grass cutter tackle or an ankle tap is that still dangerous play (it's not).
Likewise, we don't penalise an attempted high/dangerous tackle that misses (i.e. a player ducks under a tackle completely or a shoulder charge misses completely).
Maybe the law addition should be something like "it is illegal for the ball carrier to jump over the head or torso of a defender to avoid being tackled. - Sanction Penalty."
I agree that it is dangerous play but where does it end? If you just jump over and outstretched arm that is trying a grass cutter tackle or an ankle tap is that still dangerous play (it's not).
Likewise, we don't penalise an attempted high/dangerous tackle that misses (i.e. a player ducks under a tackle completely or a shoulder charge misses completely).
Maybe the law addition should be something like "it is illegal for the ball carrier to jump over the head or torso of a defender to avoid being tackled. - Sanction Penalty."
Wilson
Phil Kearns (64)
I think the real problem here is the nature of the jump - hurdling over like that with a leg kicking out out presents a danger to the tackler and leaves the ball carrier at risk of being tipped accidentally in the tackle, whereas a dive over the player to the line has much less chance of going wrong.
Brumby Runner
Jason Little (69)
I think there was a try scored by one of the Aussie teams where a player picked the ball up and dove over the ruck to score. Would that also constitute dangerous play?
waiopehu oldboy
George Smith (75)
PhilClinton
Mark Loane (55)
Interesting point - the post below yours says hurdling has been banned now, which makes sense. But they also use an example of a try scored by the English last year where a player dives over another player in the act of diving at the try line, and they say that play is legal.
The clarification I think that needs to be made is whether the act of diving means the attacking players knees/feet could impact the shoulders/head of the defenders. So in the case of a player diving from the base of a ruck, over the defenders, in a mostly horizontal motion, I don't see the same level of danger as a genuine hurdle, so it should be play on.
liquor box
Peter Sullivan (51)
Nothing on the WR (World Rugby) site yet but reportedly they've issued a Law clarification to the effect that a ball carrier can't leap over an attempted tackle. Sanction is a PK.
Stuff
www.stuff.co.nz
If a kick is contested in the air then there is a tackle about to be made, is this jumping into a tackle?
I don't have an issue with this part, but do find it odd that with a focus on player safety that you can allow a dangerous play as long as you are scoring a try.
waiopehu oldboy
George Smith (75)
No - there's no tackle for anyone to "jump into" until someone catches it.
Brumby Runner
Jason Little (69)
Tackled without the ball? Reckon I've seen that penalised many times in games. Or is that just another misnomer imported from League?
PhilClinton
Mark Loane (55)
I guess the thought process is the trajectory of the players body when in the motion of attempting to score a try won't be a dangerous position?