Reds 2021

[liquor box]

Player agents are like iPhones.

20 years ago no one really needed them. These days if you don’t have one you’ll feel left behind. They don’t really do a lot except every few years they offer you a shiny new upgrade and in exchange they take more of your money. Eventually one day you realise that you’ve been brainwashed to listen to the same company for years but by then they’ve been part of your life for so long it’s too much effort to walk away.

There are a couple of NFL players who now negotiate for themselves, Bobby Wagner from the seahawks negotiated a three year $54m contract with a guaranteed $40m.

He talks about it on a podcast called "the Mina Kimes show, featuring Lenny" where he was a guest a couple of months ago.

Maybe Rugby players could do their own negotiating?

 

[dru]

I hate him for what has happened, but if I was a player or my three year old son was about to sign with the Reds, I would want him in my corner.

He seems to be concerned for the player above the team and this is what he gets paid to do. He could honestly say he is there for the player, not to make the Reds job easier. He is dealing with professionals who are one injury away from having no future, so attempting to set them up for life as soon as possible is not a bad idea for a manager to do.

That being said, I wish he would not deal with Reds players!

It's not what I see. It is really hard to avoid a conclusion that there is intentional malice at work. The players are not getting solutions that are best to their long term interests. Only the manager is winning here.

 

[PhilClinton]

There are a couple of NFL players who now negotiate for themselves, Bobby Wagner from the seahawks negotiated a three year $54m contract with a guaranteed $40m.

He talks about it on a podcast called "the Mina Kimes show, featuring Lenny" where he was a guest a couple of months ago.

Maybe Rugby players could do their own negotiating?

I think senior players do a lot themselves.

Most of the issues we are seeing in Australia are involving guys under 23 years of age, mostly negotiating their first big contract (after their rookie deals) and they’ve been signed on since high school with these guys.

Considering we have players as young as 14 being courted by teams across all codes, I can see the merit in having someone there to assist them. But only if done the right way.

 

[Bobby Sands]

I think there’s a duty of care to Australian rugby, when acting as an agent in Australia. This bloke is doing all he can to agitate and disrupt an environment that is crying out for cohesion. Too many more Picone’s and the players won’t have a professional environment at all.

 

[PhilClinton]

The business model is itself quite simple and lucrative that I’m surprised many more aren’t in the game.

Sign as many junior rep players straight outta high school each year, promise them stardom and that you won’t take commission on their first professional contract (probably 30k-80k per season for a standard player) and then sit back and wait for a handful to have good seasons and make your commission on that next big 4 year contract.

I know they’re all doing the same thing over in the pacific islands as well.

 

[Rugby King]

and amazing goal kicking skills right?

He and Hunter are a great pairing.

I heard he is playing well in ACT and got even stronger.

 

[hammertimethere]

Our recruitment priorities for next year seem fairly obvious,
1. Locks - We need at least one, probably 2 if there is a desire for LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) to have some time at 6 in the future. Normally I like with the policy of promoting young ones to cheaper deals and backing the coaching system to get them ready but in this case I think there is a good argument to grab a more experienced player rather than promote both Ryan Smith AND Tualima (who are both ok, but have never done what Hockings did in QPR for example). Maybe Stolberg from Sunwolves/Rebels or try to get back an Aussie from overseas? Then let the young guys compete for the other available contract.

2. Fullback/Utility back, ideally goalkicker. Someone who could compete with Campbell for 15, back up O'Connor as a playmaker and goalkicker. Hegarty does this role at the moment, but it's been a while since we've seen his best (either off the tee or in general play). Hodge would be perfect, but I think he's long term comitted in Melbourne.

3. Halfback maybe, depends whether Malolua is allowed to stay on now that he's committed to Samoa. Tate is class, Sorovi has yet to be realised potential (major issues with consistent pass accuracy).

4. A 10 who has potential to be a Super standard player in 1-2 years if we've lost Gordon

 

[Sully]

Our recruitment priorities for next year seem fairly obvious,
1. Locks - We need at least one, probably 2 if there is a desire for LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) to have some time at 6 in the future. Normally I like with the policy of promoting young ones to cheaper deals and backing the coaching system to get them ready but in this case I think there is a good argument to grab a more experienced player rather than promote both Ryan Smith AND Tualima (who are both ok, but have never done what Hockings did in QPR for example). Maybe Stolberg from Sunwolves/Rebels or try to get back an Aussie from overseas? Then let the young guys compete for the other available contract.

2. Fullback/Utility back, ideally goalkicker. Someone who could compete with Campbell for 15, back up O'Connor as a playmaker and goalkicker. Hegarty does this role at the moment, but it's been a while since we've seen his best (either off the tee or in general play). Hodge would be perfect, but I think he's long term comitted in Melbourne.

3. Halfback maybe, depends whether Malolua is allowed to stay on now that he's committed to Samoa. Tate is class, Sorovi has yet to be realised potential (major issues with consistent pass accuracy).

4. A 10 who has potential to be a Super standard player in 1-2 years if we've lost Gordon

5. A hooker who can throw straight.

6. A lineout coach.

 

[ForemanFlank]

I think the biggest thing the reds need are:

1. A quality hooker and a line out coach (agreed Sully)
2. A quality second play maker at 12 or 15 who can kick both in play and for the posts


Not sure where the hooker can come from, but the brumbies have stocks in good young playmakers and utility backs that are being trained up with the top squad (plus about 4 9s who are in my opinion better than all bar Mcdermott at the reds).

 

[PhilClinton]

I don’t think Mafi and BPA are bad players - but this lineout has become laughable. In terms of development, they are only 24 and 25 respectively this year. Australian rugby hasn’t had standout/strong hookers in the last couple of years so I would be giving these two an off-season to get it right.

The good thing about lineout throwing is that you can genuinely improve with plenty of practice. If the guys are willing to put the work in, it should show.

Any new hookers coming in you would imagine will be from development pathways and not ready to be thrown into the deep end off the bat.

 

[qwerty51]

Easy to blame the hookers, and yes they're at fault for not straights but often the people responsible for overthrows are the lifters and/or jumpers.

Generally, apart from the first pod, the rest of the pods' triggers are the thrower.

 

[ForemanFlank]

Easy to blame the hookers, and yes they're at fault for not straights but often the people responsible for overthrows are the lifters and/or jumpers.

Generally, apart from the first pod, the rest of the pods' triggers are the thrower.

I think the line out coaching is more important than trying to find a replacement hooker right now. Nobody wants to kick players to the curb when they have the potential and it's clear that coaching is sub par.

 

[dru]

Easy to blame the hookers, and yes they're at fault for not straights but often the people responsible for overthrows are the lifters and/or jumpers.

Generally, apart from the first pod, the rest of the pods' triggers are the thrower.

Yeah, look no.

I know it's not as simple as this, but if our throws were on target then our success rate would be much higher. In the line out start with the weakest point, and build from there. This means basic throw skills from the hookers. THEN we can work on details.

Get the throw right first.

2 or 3 three throws go to the chest, the next is over the top. It's not the lifter/jumper. At least not in the first instance.

Get the throw right first.

 

[Braveheart81]

Yeah, look no.

I know it's not as simple as this, but if our throws were on target then our success rate would be much higher. In the line out start with the weakest point, and build from there. This means basic throw skills from the hookers. THEN we can work on details.

Get the throw right first.

2 or 3 three throws go to the chest, the next is over the top. It's not the lifter/jumper. At least not in the first instance.

Get the throw right first.

BPA had several overthrows last weekend but how many of them were actually his fault?

It would be interesting to try and determine whether the jumper would have caught them if they were at the peak of their lift when the ball went past.

Obviously if the throws were too high regardless of whether the jumper got their timing right then it is the hooker's fault. If the jumper isn't at their peak when the ball arrives then surely it's the jumper and lifters faults.

 

[Cancelled Account]

Any word on the 2020 Off-Contract players who have been resigned.
Scott Maloula
Moses Sorovi
JP Smith
Sean Farrell
Tom Kibble
Josh Nasser
Michael Wood
David Feao
Tuaina Taii Tualima
Jack Hardy
Chris Feauai-Sautia

Wider squad:
Josh Flook
Dane Zander
Zane Nongorr
JoJo Fafita
Wilson Blyth

Gone:
Carter Gordon - Rebels

 

[Cancelled Account]

I think the biggest thing the reds need are:

1. A quality hooker and a line out coach (agreed Sully)
2. A quality second play maker at 12 or 15 who can kick both in play and for the posts


Not sure where the hooker can come from, but the brumbies have stocks in good young playmakers and utility backs that are being trained up with the top squad (plus about 4 9s who are in my opinion better than all bar Mcdermott at the reds).

Why are you on here as a Brumbies supporter wanting to offload your good stock? Motive?

 

[dru]

BPA had several overthrows last weekend but how many of them were actually his fault?

It would be interesting to try and determine whether the jumper would have caught them if they were at the peak of their lift when the ball went past.

Obviously if the throws were too high regardless of whether the jumper got their timing right then it is the hooker's fault. If the jumper isn't at their peak when the ball arrives then surely it's the jumper and lifters faults.

Both of them throwing poorly. When a throw is at chest height on the #2 jumper there is an issue, I think. Everything else can be worked up, but you have nothing to work with if you dont have an average throw. Once or twice the jumper may not have been high enough but on the whole I think the throw is the start of the issue.

 

[The Phoenix]

5. A hooker who can throw straight.



6. A lineout coach.

I asked this on another forum with no responses, but does anyone know how Will Dearden is coming along. 21, 1.99 metres tall and on Reds' books.

 

[Getwithme]

Not on the Reds books anymore from what I know but a promising lock who was part of the Force academy and then the Reds in 2018. Played a year of premier grade and this season is his 2nd. A strong lineout operator and growing into his frame. Honestly if he could physically but 5-10kg of muscle he would be right in the from to be a Super Rugby player. Really rate him.

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

Not on the Reds books anymore from what I know but a promising lock who was part of the Force academy and then the Reds in 2018. Played a year of premier grade and this season is his 2nd. A strong lineout operator and growing into his frame. Honestly if he could physically but 5-10kg of muscle he would be right in the from to be a Super Rugby player. Really rate him.

His lineout work wasn't too flash on Saturday.

Easts played a very basic (but effective) two pod defensive formation. Front pod anchored with aggressive jumper to disrupt two ball and a mobile back pod (with Ben Mowen jumping). It pressures the hooker to throw over two which even at a professional level hookers can struggle.

People try and make lineouts to difficult. If you are losing the lineout just change the dynamic. The best tactic is to just throw it in before the defensive team is ready.