Reds 2013

[Jets]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...or-ewen-mckenzie/story-e6frg7o6-1226375575483

Poaching ideas, not players, on menu for Ewen McKenzie

• BY:BRENT READ
• From:The Australian
• May 31, 2012 12:00AM

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• Michael Maguire and Even McKen...​
• Can NSW dare to dream yet?​

South Sydney coach Michael Maguire meets with QLD Reds coach Ewen McKenzie at Redfern Oval. Picture: Gregg PorteousSource: The Daily Telegraph​

EWEN McKenzie believes the days of rugby union poaching high-profile league players are over. Ideas, however, are still fair game.
So, over lunch at Redfern Oval yesterday, the Queensland Reds coach and his South Sydney counterpart Michael Maguire exchanged thoughts on their respective clubs, codes and cultures.
For both, it maintained a long tradition of thinking laterally in search of improvement. In Maguire's case, he counts Manchester United's Alex Ferguson among the brains he picked during his time as coach of Wigan in the English Super League.
Even now, he trades text messages with the world's most famous football coach. McKenzie may not boast Ferguson's profile, but he shares a history of churning out successful sporting teams.
"That's what you do when you are in the coaching business," McKenzie said.

Maguire added: "I got introduced to him through a mutual friend, and obviously it's great to have a coach of his calibre willing to share a few moments with what he's done over his career and how he's developed Queensland rugby union."The team culture is in common. You can talk to other coaches about how you influence that."
"I'm always open to those great coaches. I was lucky overseas to have a chat with Alex Ferguson. I think you can always learn lessons from everyone who has done it in front of you.
"As a young coach, I'm willing to listen and learn and take some good things out of those coaches."
All that listening and learning is paying dividends for Souths. The Rabbitohs have won their past four games and will travel to ANZ Stadium for Saturday night's game against Canterbury in fourth place.
"It's an important game and a big game," Maguire said.
"The Dogs are going along really well at the moment.
"We need to make sure we're right on our game because every time you play the Dogs, it's always tough."
McKenzie likes what he sees. It's hard not to. As he sat in the Redfern Oval cafe, a stream of rugby league talent walked in and out, among them Greg Inglis and Dave Taylor.
McKenzie was involved in the last great raid on rugby league, when Wendell Sailor and Lote Tuqiri crossed the divide.
"We haven't been concentrating on that space at all in the last period of time, and I'm not concentrating on that space," he said.
"There's a lot more players these days that play both codes at school. You have to be relevant, you've got to have a team, you've got to have a program and a pathway, and the kids will make decisions. I think the days of signing 28- or 29-year-old converts, those days are probably over."
As for Souths' chances of ending a premiership drought of more than 40 years, McKenzie confessed to being no expert on the game of rugby league.
But even he could sense something special brewing - and he wasn't referring to the coffee.
"They have a lot of good players here and I know one thing - you can't win a comp unless you have enough good players," he said.
"I have seen a lot of good players walk around.
"You can tell how people relate to each other and you can see they have good harmony."​

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[emuarse]

Perhaps Links is signing up Michael McGuire as an assistant coach under Graham.
(I get these brilliant insights at times)

 

[TOCC]

Dave Taylor, via his manager Col Davis, approached the Reds about 4 or 5 years ago when Phil Mooney was coach about making the switch. He wasn't getting picked regularly for the Bronco's and thought there was an opportunity to keep living in Brisbane and playing football. Apparently Mooney questioned his ability to make the switch from league player to rugby prop. Normally I would agree but Taylor is a beast of a guy and I think he has the determination and work ethic to be worth the risk. After the Reds said they weren't interested he signed with Souths and has done pretty well for himself.

determination and work ethic??

the reason he wasn't getting picked regularly for the Broncos was because his weight and skin folds were above where they wanted it to be for him.. His manager/father approached the Reds cause they believed that his size(i.e. weight) would be more conducive with the requirements of a Rugby number 8.

At this point in his career he had displayed nothing apart from sheer size, It was only following all this that he actually picked up his game a bit, made several strong performances for the Broncos which boosted his asking price and was subsequently signed by the rabbitohs.

 

[Jets]

I don't think Mooney did the wrong thing TOCC. At best they could have offered him an Academy spot on about a quarter of what he was on at the Bronco's so it was never going to work.
If it was at number 8 then he was dreaming.

 

[TOCC]

I don't think Mooney did the wrong thing TOCC. At best they could have offered him an Academy spot on about a quarter of what he was on at the Bronco's so it was never going to work.
If it was at number 8 then he was dreaming.

Im not saying Mooney did anything wrong either, i actually support the decision. At the time Dave Taylor was a underwhelming player with potential who didn't have the discipline or self control to keep his weight under control. It was only following all this that he actually put in some hard work and made a name for himself.

I remember the article, they said they pitched him as a number 8, which realistically would have been his best suited position.. but it never happened and doesn't really matter now anyway

 

[en_force_er]

Im not saying Mooney did anything wrong either, i actually support the decision. At the time Dave Taylor was a underwhelming player with potential who didn't have the discipline or self control to keep his weight under control. It was only following all this that he actually put in some hard work and made a name for himself.

I remember the article, they said they pitched him as a number 8, which realistically would have been his best suited position.. but it never happened and doesn't really matter now anyway

For every Dave Taylor there's 20 of the same situation of blokes that didn't ammount to anything.

Unless it's due to a deficientcy that wouldn't really matter in union (like maybe too much of a tall beanpole for league) it'd be bad to pick a player like this up. Odd are if he's failed to sucseed at league, he'd fail at union.

On a side note, if we got our hands on 2012 Dave Taylor that would be awesome.

 

[TheBigDog]

Just thought i'd put this out there as there has been chat about 2nd rower stocks recently with Horwill getting injured.

I'm not sure of his plans for next season but does anyone else reckon Brad Thorn would be a good addition to the Reds? He has a connection with Brisbane and QLD from his League days (still owns a house near Bronco's Leagues Club) and could be signed to a 1 or 2 year deal as marquee player. I know he's old but the professionalism he has conducted himself with at every club is evident and he has really achieved everything in two codes of the game. I just think with the Reds having a fairly young forward pack next season he would be good not only as a player but also a leader. Im sure Horwill would gain a lot from him as well.

Of course I can't see this really happening and i'm not sure about what his contracts are for next season and beyond. I heard a rumour he may be headed back to NZ for the Blues but haven't seen anything official.

 

[liquor box]

Just thought i'd put this out there as there has been chat about 2nd rower stocks recently with Horwill getting injured.

I'm not sure of his plans for next season but does anyone else reckon Brad Thorn would be a good addition to the Reds? He has a connection with Brisbane and QLD from his League days (still owns a house near Bronco's Leagues Club) and could be signed to a 1 or 2 year deal as marquee player. I know he's old but the professionalism he has conducted himself with at every club is evident and he has really achieved everything in two codes of the game. I just think with the Reds having a fairly young forward pack next season he would be good not only as a player but also a leader. Im sure Horwill would gain a lot from him as well.

Of course I can't see this really happening and i'm not sure about what his contracts are for next season and beyond. I heard a rumour he may be headed back to NZ for the Blues but haven't seen anything official.

sounds like a good idea to me, but if both Simmons and Horwill are fit then would you want him starting?

 

[TheBigDog]

sounds like a good idea to me, but if both Simmons and Horwill are fit then would you want him starting?

I was thinking him on the bench. Having a player of his quality would mean we could give Simmons and Horwill longer rests and maybe even rotate through on occasions. He is obviously getting older with every year so probably wouldn't be an 80min player for much longer...

 

[Godfrey]

I think next year we'll be ok for locks. Horwill and Simmons are both very good, then you have AWH and (possibly) Van H and then you've got McDuling - who I think would've made some big strides this year and will hopefully make them next year. Thorn would either be taking a Wallaby's spot in the starting lineup or getting in the way of McDuling's development. I just don't think it's a weak enough spot for us.

 

[tigerland12]

I think bringing a younger player into the EPS spot and developing them would be an effective solution. Although there aren't many locks good enough running around in the Premier Competition as it is. The two Easts locks Stollberg and Enever are there, as is Tim Buchanan from University. Possibly Enever, as he has been in the Reds system before, and in the Under 20's side, he could be developed further.

 

[TheBigDog]

I think there still needs to be a balance of bringing talent through, which is obviously essential for player development and also having some older heads there to guide the way. I don't think Van will be back next year and most people are under the assumption that Radike will be gone as well. Thats two veterans gone. And personally i'd rather have Thorn in the side than AWH.

As I said I don't think it will happen but if he's available I think the Reds should at least be testing the water with Thorn.

 

[Penguin]

Again......McMeniman! He could cover Higgers place at six & double up as lock cover... ala AWH

 

[Bowside]

He really is the perfect signing at this point in time.

If they got him over now he could go through an extended off season and really sort out his injuries.

 

[liquor box]

Does he like Brisbane? Does his family like it here?

I wonder if 2years off the bench helping develop players and then a move into a 3 year assistant coaching gig specialising in toughening up the training of our forwards and making them hard bastards would be an option.

If you could get him to settle down in Brisbane for 5 years it may sway his family to make the long term move here.

I think he would be a great resource as an assistant coach, does anyone know if he is interested in coaching when he retires from playing?

 

[Jets]

While he has been a great player in both union and league I really wouldn't be interested in him. Like others have said he would stop the development of an up and coming player. Also I think AWH is currently the perfect bench player for the Reds. He plays in a calm controlled manner and is the master of stealing line outs.
Also I am not a fan of guys who go straight from playing to coaching, especially at Super level.

 

[TOCC]

I don't think the Reds need him.. He is in the twilight of his career, i doubt he would want to sign with a club to only be used off the bench, i can't imagine he needs the $150'000 at best the Reds could afford to pay him.

As for mentoring younger players, well with the Wallaby captain and older players like AWH i don't think thats a massive necessity either.

Do what QLD have been doing best the past 3 years, put fait and money into developing younger local talent that will be here for the long term.

 

[liquor box]

I don't think the Reds need him.. He is in the twilight of his career, i doubt he would want to sign with a club to only be used off the bench, i can't imagine he needs the $150'000 at best the Reds could afford to pay him.

As for mentoring younger players, well with the Wallaby captain and older players like AWH i don't think thats a massive necessity either.

Do what QLD have been doing best the past 3 years, put fait and money into developing younger local talent that will be here for the long term.

I still think that Kev is young enough to need mentoring, just like all aspects of life once you realise you dont know as much as you thought you did, you start to learn.

I hope Kev is not at a point where his learning has stopped.

 

[TOCC]

You don't need to be a player to pass on mentoring tips to a younger generation.. Coaches and opposition also fulfil this role.
If they are so inclined if Brad Thorn moves back to Brisbane they could bring him in on a consultancy basis.

Brad Thorn isn't the type of player to be content to sit on the bench, on top of the that the Reds would have to pay quite a bit for him to come to the Reds, it would be a waste of money just to add some depth to the bench. Spend the money wisely by developing a local junior.......

 

[maxdacat]

Guess the Reds are looking slight more likely as a wildcard prospect after the way the points have fallen on the ladder this week