Rebels 2017

[Mr Wobbly]

I've been pretty much ambivalent about TT, preferring to give him the benefit of the doubt, up until this year. Now I'm firmly in the #sacktony camp.

I really feel that changes need to be made and be seen to be made or we are going to really struggle to retain members and fans. Three of our five games this season have been rubbish with two gritty performances. I expect that we will struggle to get 8,000 to the Brumbies game and that is awful.

The players do seem to have stopped responding. Our game plan is either non-existent, the players aren't following it or, aren't capable of following it. In any case, these are all coaching issues.

The players are being beaten up every week. By their opponents, in the media and, apparently, at training. We have a great group of talented young players but we need them to be kept together and developed and they need strong leadership, on and off the field.

I reckon Tony has given the job the best he has and is probably feeling these loses as much as anyone but, I'm not sure if his headmaster style approach is working. Time for a new voice and some fresh ideas. I don't want to see more of the same for the remaining games. Even though a new or stand in coach is pretty unlikely to come in perform any miracles.

What I would like to see happen this week is Morgan Turinui (or someone) made stand in coach. McMahon offered the captaincy and a 100 year contract (with an option for another 50). Stirzacker benched and Colby made stand in captain.

I don't expect that these changes will make a massive difference to our performance but it will at least look like something is being done and that there is a plan going forward. Continuing along the same path we've been on is getting us nowhere.

 

[amirite]

I've been pretty much ambivalent about TT, preferring to give him the benefit of the doubt, up until this year. Now I'm firmly in the #sacktony camp.

I really feel that changes need to be made and be seen to be made or we are going to really struggle to retain members and fans. Three of our five games this season have been rubbish with two gritty performances. I expect that we will struggle to get 8,000 to the Brumbies game and that is awful.

The players do seem to have stopped responding. Our game plan is either non-existent, the players aren't following it or, aren't capable of following it. In any case, these are all coaching issues.

The players are being beaten up every week. By their opponents, in the media and, apparently, at training. We have a great group of talented young players but we need them to be kept together and developed and they need strong leadership, on and off the field.

I reckon Tony has given the job the best he has and is probably feeling these loses as much as anyone but, I'm not sure if his headmaster style approach is working. Time for a new voice and some fresh ideas. I don't want to see more of the same for the remaining games. Even though a new or stand in coach is pretty unlikely to come in perform any miracles.

What I would like to see happen this week is Morgan Turinui (or someone) made stand in coach. McMahon offered the captaincy and a 100 year contract (with an option for another 50). Stirzacker benched and Colby made stand in captain.

I don't expect that these changes will make a massive difference to our performance but it will at least look like something is being done and that there is a plan going forward. Continuing along the same path we've been on is getting us nowhere.

Good post. I'm not part of the sack TT camp, though I do agree we need big changes and it is one example of a big change.

I'd have to see the extremely promising careers of Hilton or Turinui stilted by stifled by taking over a side mid-season.

 

[swingpass]

so Amirite what big changes do you suggest ?

the point of my earlier post was that something has to be done NOW, before further damage is done to the players, the club and Rugby in Victoria as a whole.

the Dewar Shield is as strong (in terms of playing ability) as its ever been, the underage rep teams are doing well, the JGC teams are also successful, the Schoolboys are very competitive in Division 1, the U20's had a good year again and the Rising perhaps not as successful as they should be - in summary rugby in Victoria is in pretty good shape except for the flagship which is listing badly if not already mortally wounded (to mix my naval and other metaphors).

things simply cant go on as they are, the only expedient option in the short term as a circuit breaker is to change the head coach. it may only be symbolic but as Mr W says the team cant go on as is.

you don't think he is a bad coach, well he's certainly not a good one. a good coach would improve the individual and collective skill sets of his cattle, or fashion a game plan to their limited abilities, win ugly if necessary, take responsibility and be accountable. his CV is not that impressive, he was at Munster during one of their infrequent poor periods, cant recall if he made much impact at the Wallabies but was moved on asap, and as i said 35% win/loss at the Rebels and they have won only two of their last twelve games, both against Australian teams, the Reds and the Force. In what other professional sport would a head coach keep his job with these results ? i don't know for sure but i assume TT sets the agenda for the Rebels training and game plans, not the assistants, lays out the masterplan and the weekly schedules, so its disingenuous for you to suggest he's not the responsible entity for the continued poor skills and execution.

 

[Tex]

The Rebels cattle aren't world beating but they're not mugs either. What I saw last night was abject rubbish. The number of handling errors was unheard of for professional athletes. Just staggering how often we coughed up easy possession.

I know the players have the basic skills but they look flat as fuck and borderline disinterested. That tells me, a genius on his couch who's never worked in professional sport, that the coaching and player management isn't working and blokes are disengaged.

Tony came in with a rep as a hard man head kicker. That's all well and good, but the angry man act is like the ace up the sleeve. Once you've played that hand you've got little else to do.

The question for me isn't so much whether or not we should go to market (assuming we have a team next year!), but when and how to do it while minimising the fallout.

 

[Highlander35]

I think something needs to be done about the enthusiasm levels.

There are clearly a number playing injured, and another handful with other issues.

Sa'aga has been one of the few bright lights this season: the recruitment of Moloney after the 2015 NRC had made me worry that the coaching squad didn't rate him, but he's brought a lot of energy to the squad, with a few nice runs and good defensive work all round.

I think a short term solution is to use the youngsters and Snowden.

Drop Stirzaker to the bench, drop Garden Bachop entirely, let Jordy rest whatever injury he clearly has.

If we got no players back, but Cummo is fit after the bye, I'd play this:

Volavola, English, Inman, Hodge, Koroibete, Debreczini, Snowden, Sa'aga, Hanson, Weeks, Day, Cummins, Timani, Fainga'a, Mafi

Res: Uelese, Moloney, Lomax, Retallick, Tupai, Stirzaker, McGregor, Tuipulotu

It's not working right now, but we don't have the required players to make too many changes to the starting line up. But we CAN change the halves, with Timani back, we CAN rest Jordy and still start three full time pros, and we CAN use the enthusiasm of locals and youngsters to improve the impact of the bench which is currently limited by its use.

 

[Tex]

Fair points and realistically we can only do so much viz major change at this stage of the season.

 

[NTT]

Same problem through all our teams at the moment, our mental approach needs a major adjustment against the kiwis. We have to just rip into them and take a stand against being bullied by them. Rebels need Timani out there just smashing blokes, hes big enough, hes ugly enough same with Retallick and Day just get out there and bash them.

 

[lou75]

Negative 162 point differential is our second worst performance ever, behind 2011 with pd of negative 289. Our best pd, was 2015, with neg 35 when we seemed to be on track for bigger and better things. Even Sunwolves have a better pd atm.

 

[Ulrich]

I really think the cattle want someone with sly ideas and not honest ideas.

Remember they are called the Rebels. Remember also that they are in some instances rejects from other regions. They need to be cunning in their endeavours as Australian teams are meant to be or else they will fail.

Australia cannot play a direct game all the time and be successful. SA cannot play better Kiwi-style rugby than the Kiwis and be consistently successful. It's imperative that we keep to our strengths and the Australian sides seem to be extremely confused as to how they want to go about their business.

From the outside it looks as if though the players want to play a certain way but they are limited as to how they 'may' play. Read Springboks 2016.

For now though, to restore some balance, the Rebels should go look themselves in the mirror and tell themselves they are not as good as they can be. Let them be honest with themselves and then come up with typical sly Australian ideas on how to win despite having a puff pack. That's how we know Australia.

 

[oztimmay]

So, the public campaign to keep Mad Dog in Melbourne has begun.

A little surprised he didn't mention TGIF as one of his favourite restaurants.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Mr Wobbly]

I really think the cattle want someone with sly ideas and not honest ideas.

Remember they are called the Rebels. Remember also that they are in some instances rejects from other regions. They need to be cunning in their endeavours as Australian teams are meant to be or else they will fail.

Australia cannot play a direct game all the time and be successful. SA cannot play better Kiwi-style rugby than the Kiwis and be consistently successful. It's imperative that we keep to our strengths and the Australian sides seem to be extremely confused as to how they want to go about their business.

From the outside it looks as if though the players want to play a certain way but they are limited as to how they 'may' play. Read Springboks 2016.

For now though, to restore some balance, the Rebels should go look themselves in the mirror and tell themselves they are not as good as they can be. Let them be honest with themselves and then come up with typical sly Australian ideas on how to win despite having a puff pack. That's how we know Australia.

It seems to me that coaches generally come in one of two flavours. You have the Jake White types that believe that there is a best way to win a game of rugby and will select and drill players to play that way. Then there is the type that looks at the skill set of the players you have and tries to put together a strategy to best use those skills. Either type can be successful.

I think Eddie Jones probably started out as the first type but has mutated.

Robbie Deans has either proven that he is a brilliant coach when he has the best players or, that if you have the best players you can win with any coach.

When Damien Hill was around we played a lot like the Sunwolves do now. Lots of attacking flair and scoring plenty of points but with a defence that leaked like - something very, very leaky (I'm not good at analogies).

When TT came in his plan seemed to be to limit the damage and stop the bleeding. Fair enough. He got rid of a few skilful, attacking players and replaced them with bigger ones. A couple of others he tried to tighten up, like say Pyle and Higgers for example.

I really don't know what our game plan is now. It seems to change from week to week, we've lost the attacking flair but are leaking as many points now as we ever have.

So, yeah, I agree with you. Win ugly, win dirty, win sneaky but change things up, come up with a plan. We've won two of our last 12 games and crowd numbers have dropped about 40% over the last few years. Do something. Anything.

 

[Rebels3]

Australian rugby as a whole is lacking a clear identity on the field. The only side that does have some sort of identity is the Brumbies which probably explains where they are at compared to the others.

 

[Rock Lobster]

What continues to stagger me about the Rebels play is the failure to adapt and that has to come back to the coach. Their biggest issue at the moment is a lack of possession and yet they CONTINUALLY gift possession back to the opposition. Take their re-starts for example. EVERY kick off goes deep and right with no possible chance of contesting possession unless the receiver drops it. You'd think, after say your 3rd or 4th kick off you might try and mix it up with a short one to the left or center field to give yourself a chance of getting the ball back, perhaps. Same with their 22m re-starts. They bang it long every time and against kiwi sides who you KNOW will run it back at you this is just suicide. Surely when you are 20-30 points down you should be taking every chance you can to get your hands on the ball. Unfortunately this just illustrates the entire safety first mindset of the team and once again that has to come back to the coach.

Their lineout is still a mess after 4 years under McGahan & Hilton. They have WAY too much shuffling of positions before they throw it in, which only increases your margin for error, yet they keep doing this week after week, year after year.

They CONTINUALLY panic on the very rare occasions they venture into the opposition 22 and turn the ball over within a few phases. Once again this happens game after game and never seems to be addressed which has to come back on the coach. I could go on, with things like the amount of ball they kick back to the opposition but I think you get the picture.

There is PLENTY of talent in that squad and all fit and firing, with the right direction, they can win their share of games, unfortunately they are not getting that direction from McGahan and his staff.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

Is something afoot?

I got an email from Rebels YouTube account to "Melbourne Rebels Live Stream Test". I clicked on the link, just a desk and two empty chairs with a framed jersey on the wall in the background for about 10 seconds. The video was deleted a minute later.

Anyone know of any announcements?

 

[GoMelbRebels]

Whoops, I'm sure that wasn't meant to happen. I'd say a possible resignation?

 

[GoMelbRebels]

I too received 2 x emails from YouTube.

 

[oztimmay]

Either the unpaid intern has fucked up again, Rebels SM team having a laugh with us SM tragics, or potentially something exciting. Which could it be?

 

[GoMelbRebels]

Possibly all 3.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

Either the unpaid intern has fucked up again, Rebels SM team having a laugh with us SM tragics, or and potentially something exciting. Which could it be?

^^^
My guess is a double barrel shock announcement: Sean McMahon signs until 2037 and TT commits harakiri (metaphorically).

 

[lou75]

I think its a bit rich that TT declares that he "has the highest win percentage of any Head Coach in the Club’s short history" 7-15, which is not quite 50%, and seriously not something that is to be proud of IMO. Here's another stat: looking at the first five game point differential:
2011 -103
2012 -58
2013 -82
2014 -26
2015 -5
2016 -10
2017 -162
I accept that TT made some improvement in 2014,15 + 16, but as we do know, the Rebels seem to lose their momentum in the second half of the season, so watch out for a big fall from here.
And before you mention the draw, I'd like to remind you that we did defeat Crusaders at the start of 2015.