Rebels 2012

[Lee Grant]

I pray to christ that Slipper never stops bending bananas.

Gold.

As for the game: it just goes to show that talking about rugby teams' backs in the ratio of about 80/20 should be the other way around. It was always so - but after the Super season is over we'll be talking about the backs again.

The observation of Bowside is spot on. Oz rugby is desperately short of the type of players he mentioned: hard headed, pig dog bastards - always has been. You can't coach it but you can select squads a touch better by taking a punt on one or two real hard heads who will shift people. They may not have the technical expertise, all the skills or the ideal physical measurements, but their opponents will know that they've been in a game.

Apart from individuals there is also a team pack hard headedness lacking in Oz rugby. The Tahs have a bit of it but not enough of our teams do; or not often enough. It sounded like if one Chief hard head was out of action another would take his place, or they would swarm sometimes. It's all guesswork, but you get this a lot with Kiwi teams even though some of the individuals will never be All Blacks.

This does not seem to be in Oz coaching manuals and is probably not in Kiwi ones either - just a part of how they were brought up in the game.

PS - Thanks for the great report HKT.

 

[HKTiger]

....... How did the Rebs go in the intelligence department?

Good at times. They did marshall the defence very well for certain periods. It was a trial and they did play lots of players. I beleive it was with AJ Gilbert on (and Delve off) that the defense was well organised and coordinated early in the 3rd. Gilbert took a cheap high shot late in the third and had to be helped off and replaced.

The Rebels appeared to play more players and had a 17 year old on at fly half in the 4th quarter.

My gut feeling is they really missed Mortlock and as Bowside highlighted they need a real forward general. TBH I think of Moore when I see what they lack.

 

[stoff]

Over 5000 in attendance.

Which seemed to catch them by surprise. Me and a mate caught the train down from Melbourne. It was delayed so we got there about ten minutes after kick-off and there were (at my estimate) about 1000 people stuck outside queuing for tickets. Also seemed like they underestimated the amount of bar staff they needed (and is is just bloody cruel to have Fat Yak advertised on the price boards and taps if you are only serving Carlton Draught and Pure Blonde). On the other hand there were next to no cues for food, so maybe they are just used to Geelong AFL supporters (who I can only deduce would appear to eat much and drink little). From a spectator perspective it was smaller than the only other ovals I have watched rugby at before, so the ability to see what was going on was good. There were a few big tackles which would have given those unfamiliar with the game some good talking points. Was also nice to have a stadium completely painted in our colours.

Does anyone know who the massive hooker for the Chiefs was? He was wearing 40, but they could have fit 4440 across his back comfortably if they had wanted to.

 

[RugbyReg]

when does John Muggleton start his role? He must be arriving soon?

 

[Slim 293]

Unfortunately I don't think this result is much of a surprise.

Two star backline players aren't going to lift a team too far off the bottom of the ladder. Particularly when the pack is not up to par.

 

[Lee Grant]

Does anyone know who the massive hooker for the Chiefs was? He was wearing 40, but they could have fit 4440 across his back comfortably if they had wanted to.

The Chiefs hookers were Hika Elliot and Marcel Cumming-Toone. Schwalger didn't play. Elliot is an All Black; so you probably know him, and MCT is not that big. Perhaps you are thinking of young prop Ben Tameifuna - maybe he threw to the lineout a few times, who knows? He's only 6ft tall for 134kgs; so he can stretch a jersey alright.

 

[HKTiger]

The 40 definitely hooked, but "wide boy" does not do him justice. He looked shorter than 6 foot.

 

[HKTiger]

Which seemed to catch them by surprise. Me and a mate caught the train down from Melbourne. It was delayed so we got there about ten minutes after kick-off and there were (at my estimate) about 1000 people stuck outside queuing for tickets. Also seemed like they underestimated the amount of bar staff they needed (and is is just bloody cruel to have Fat Yak advertised on the price boards and taps if you are only serving Carlton Draught and Pure Blonde). On the other hand there were next to no cues for food, so maybe they are just used to Geelong AFL supporters (who I can only deduce would appear to eat much and drink little). From a spectator perspective it was smaller than the only other ovals I have watched rugby at before, so the ability to see what was going on was good. There were a few big tackles which would have given those unfamiliar with the game some good talking points. Was also nice to have a stadium completely painted in our colours.

Does anyone know who the massive hooker for the Chiefs was? He was wearing 40, but they could have fit 4440 across his back comfortably if they had wanted to.

Seriously the ticket staff must have shared one brain cell between them. All it would have taken was for one staff member to print off 100 tickets at a time and sell them. But no each order was processed one at a time. Totally brain dead. The parking staff were marginally better.

 

[Forcefield]

Ben Afeaki? He is a whopper.

 

[Lee Grant]

He's a big boy but also a prop. Like hooker Schwalger, he is injured and didn't play in the trial. It was probably prop Tameifuna, who did play, and was probably deemed to be 3rd hooker of the night to see how he went.

The 40 definitely hooked, but "wide boy" does not do him justice. He looked shorter than 6 foot.

At 6ft and 134kgs you can look shorter. MCT is a short arse at 179 cms. but only 105kgs - could the player you are thinking of been that light HKT? A darkish fellow HKT - or not?

Elliot, the All Black, is over 6ft and "only" 115kgs; so he probably doesn't look that wide.

 

[Bowside]

Gold.

As for the game: it just goes to show that talking about rugby teams' backs in the ratio of about 80/20 should be the other way around. It was always so - but after the Super season is over we'll be talking about the backs again.

The observation of Bowside is spot on. Oz rugby is desperately short of the type of players he mentioned: hard headed, pig dog bastards - always has been. You can't coach it but you can select squads a touch better by taking a punt on one or two real hard heads who will shift people. They may not have the technical expertise, all the skills or the ideal physical measurements, but their opponents will know that they've been in a game.

Apart from individuals there is also a team pack hard headedness lacking in Oz rugby. The Tahs have a bit of it but not enough of our teams do; or not often enough. It sounded like if one Chief hard head was out of action another would take his place, or they would swarm sometimes. It's all guesswork, but you get this a lot with Kiwi teams even though some of the individuals will never be All Blacks.

This does not seem to be in Oz coaching manuals and is probably not in Kiwi ones either - just a part of how they were brought up in the game.

PS - Thanks for the great report HKT.

I think australia is able to produce this type of player, but most of them end up playing league. You make a good point about out lack of quality non-wallaby forwards. Ideally the rebels would need about 2 guys not quite at wallaby level but who are enforcers and regularly produce. David Croft types.

I know 2012 hasnt even started yet - but it will be interesting to see who the rebels target for next year. They'll need to sign about 3 backrowers as well as a hooker. I think the brumbies, reds and force will be readying themselves for a poaching raid.

 

[suckerforred]

HKT - Great report. Just picking up on your decision comment. Who was the ref? So can we expect that the SANZAR review didn't quite get to the listen to the touchies (sorry assistants) stage. One of the things that really pieve me.

 

[FiveStarStu]

I wrote up a review here: http://www.rebel-army.com/archives/2309

It wasn't all bad for the Rebels. Main thing to notice is that they played 4 distinct line-ups during the game, whereas the Chiefs played a more settled team for the duration.

Attack, when they got the ball, was a lot more calculated. You could tell some players have really done their homework in the off-season, Cooper Vuna especially. The forward pack did well, but three tries came off attacks from the Chiefs' rolling maul, which the team had not prepared for.

The ref was, to put it kindly, appallingly shit. Whatever penalties the Rebs got within kicking range, they chose to go for the lines to practice their lineouts (which, I would agree with HKT, need a tonne of work). If they went for goal it could have been 36-12.

There are definitely things that need work. Their one-on-one defence has improved, but as a line, they are still far too slow getting back when they turn over the ball. Every turn over got the Chiefs a guaranteed 10-15m because the Rebs weren't prepared. That, and I got that feeling that they'll still struggle to convert all of their attacking chances. They didn't play with the confidence to score (and in truth, maybe they weren't really trying to in this game) and if that lingers around then we are in strife.

In all, it's a trial. A disappointing result but hopefully Hill and co are smart enough to know what needs to happen against the Blues. I'll reserve judgement until I have a better idea of who the starting XV will be.

 

[Torn Hammy]

I've heard nothing of Inman. Did he trial? Where will he be playing?

He is too good to be playing 3rd reserve centre.

 

[HKTiger]

HKT - Great report. Just picking up on your decision comment. Who was the ref? So can we expect that the SANZAR review didn't quite get to the listen to the touchies (sorry assistants) stage. One of the things that really pieve me.

They announced the ref before the game but as I was still queueing via the 'one ticket at time, select, print and process appraoch" I missed his name. A fairly slight mousy blond guy who looked young and out of his depth. The tall dark haired assistant ref/touchie was trying to correct his calls all night. Ref and touchie were not happy with one another.

 

[HKTiger]

He's a big boy but also a prop. Like hooker Schwalger, he is injured and didn't play in the trial. It was probably prop Tameifuna, who did play, and was probably deemed to be 3rd hooker of the night to see how he went.

At 6ft and 134kgs you can look shorter. MCT is a short arse at 179 cms. but only 105kgs - could the player you are thinking of been that light HKT? A darkish fellow HKT - or not?

Elliot, the All Black, is over 6ft and "only" 115kgs; so he probably doesn't look that wide.

Sorry poor humour. Muxt have been Tameifuna. He probably is 6 foot. He just doesn't look it. He is seriously as wide as he is tall. Moved well for his build.

 

[HKTiger]

....... The forward pack did well, but three tries came off attacks from the Chiefs' rolling maul, which the team had not prepared for.

.......

But a rolling maul must move forward and should not get 4 goes at moving forward. After 2 it is "use it or lose it". when the defence hold the maul up pushes it backwards and then the Chiefs are still allowed to play their own ball then what more is the defense to do. Oh go and question the ref ...

And the maul in the 3rd quarter was split by the defence and Chiefs re-joined from in front of the ball and a penalty was given for collapsing the maul.

I said I wouldn't pass much comment, but your description of the ref is too polite.

 

[HKTiger]

I've heard nothing of Inman. Did he trial? Where will he be playing?

He is too good to be playing 3rd reserve centre.

According to the interview with Hill in the paper Inman didn't play.

 

[RugbyReg]

How was Cooper V's defence? Improved at all?

 

[HKTiger]

They targeted Vuna for the second half and made yards. I didn't see Vuna last year. They didn't bust through to score but they did target that wing. JOC (James O'Connor) provided some very good cover.