QLD Premier Rugby 2011

[tigerland12]

I won't be suprised if it's a Uni vs Sunnybank final. The Bank were very good on the weekend ( as you'd expect from a side with Gill and Kingi on the bench), and i think they'll go past GPS relatively easily.

 

[spectator]

Seven Reds in each side (Uni and Bank):

Uni - Hansen, McDuling, Sheperdson, Prior, Lance, Morahan, Davies
Also - Kuridrani, Cox (Brumbies).

Bank - Holmes, Anae, Wallace-Harrison, Schatz, Gill, Lucas, Tapuai.
Also - Kingi (Rebels)

Have I missed anyone?

 

[tigerland12]

You can add in Matt Lucas ( Reds Academy) and Nigel Ah Wong (who just went on tour with Rebels) for Sunnybank. These rep players make such a difference, as been said before, Ben Lucas and Holmes were brilliant for the Bank on the weekend, and a few weeks ago Rod Davies and Morahan destroyed Easts.

 

[Pauly]

Are the finals being played at Ballymore on Sunday, anyone?

Minor semi is Sunday at 3pm, followed by the major semi at 5:30pm

I think the Wallabies v Italy clash starts at 1:30pm Sunday

A great afternoon of rugby!

 

[Matt]

Watched Bros V Easts dvd on Friday night, was worst match I have seen in ages. No wonder bank flogged them Saturday. Easts front row was rubbish and kept folding with Sunnybank being penalised for it. Easts verry lucky with ref at the scrum. Apparently one of Easts front row signed to Brumbies as well? Don't know why if this is true. Yeah the reds helped, however there were even less reds in easts first round loss to bank. 'Injuries' yes I know would be the argument, however we all know that it takes much more than 15 Premier players, even 22 at that. Realistically about 30 to 35 across a Premier season. Would be interesting to see how many players Uni and the bank have used in Premier. Even uni last year too. The Premier clubs with solid depth ie: 1st and 2nd grade, are the ones which tend to shine at finals time, teams on shaky grounds usually don't have the depth to handle injuries, tours, call ups etc.

It takes overall rugby program development to move forward. One year 'flash in pan' teams do not last. Look at Sunnycoast. Brilliance to backdoor. Even in NRL, roosters are prime here too. I know i will have arguments here, but it happens all the time- Brilliant coach, good lookin team that do well and then disappear. Team does ok but not win title, board not happy, knee jerk sack that years coach. New coach in, team does brilliant, might even win, then fall away. Training systems in place sometimes take 12 months to find fruition for efforts and to become ingrained with players to execute correctly. Can easts build on this season? Hope so, but depth will surely need to improve.
Finals will be interesting. Uni are the guns to watch out for. Even without Reds. Look up the scores they posted on teams without their reds hotshots. Very similar all season.

 

[tigerland12]

There is a reason Uni and Sunnybank have depth, which ties in with the reason why they have so many Reds players.....
You can't expect the clubs who aren't as financially well off in compairson to the likes of Sunnybank and University to be able to build their playing squad.

 

[spectator]

Watched Bros V Easts dvd on Friday night, was worst match I have seen in ages. No wonder bank flogged them Saturday. Easts front row was rubbish and kept folding with Sunnybank being penalised for it. Easts verry lucky with ref at the scrum. Apparently one of Easts front row signed to Brumbies as well? Don't know why if this is true. Yeah the reds helped, however there were even less reds in easts first round loss to bank. 'Injuries' yes I know would be the argument, however we all know that it takes much more than 15 Premier players, even 22 at that. Realistically about 30 to 35 across a Premier season. Would be interesting to see how many players Uni and the bank have used in Premier. Even uni last year too. The Premier clubs with solid depth ie: 1st and 2nd grade, are the ones which tend to shine at finals time, teams on shaky grounds usually don't have the depth to handle injuries, tours, call ups etc.

It takes overall rugby program development to move forward. One year 'flash in pan' teams do not last. Look at Sunnycoast. Brilliance to backdoor. Even in NRL, roosters are prime here too. I know i will have arguments here, but it happens all the time- Brilliant coach, good lookin team that do well and then disappear. Team does ok but not win title, board not happy, knee jerk sack that years coach. New coach in, team does brilliant, might even win, then fall away. Training systems in place sometimes take 12 months to find fruition for efforts and to become ingrained with players to execute correctly. Can easts build on this season? Hope so, but depth will surely need to improve.
Finals will be interesting. Uni are the guns to watch out for. Even without Reds. Look up the scores they posted on teams without their reds hotshots. Very similar all season.

I'm not quite sure of the pointof your post Matt, but a few points of rebuttal if I may:

1. About five or six games from the end of the season Easts ran on their 44th player. There might have even been a few more 'new players in subsequent games. That kind of injury level would affect even the strongest clubs.
2. Murphy has apparently been signed for the Brumbies although I read there is nothing on the Brumbies website to confirm as yet. The pack that he started in bore no resemblance to the one you saw, and if Easts were getting mullered in the scrum one prop aint going to make too much difference. He has been a very handy player in the games I've seen him play.
3.Easts are no one season wonders if that's your inference. The nucleus of this bunch has been around since 2008 when they unexpectedly lifted the trophy, and they have been one of the most consistent clubs in recent years. They are still a relatively young side so there's no reason why they won't be competitive next season.
4. I looked up the scores as you suggested and noticed that Easts beat Uni in Round one 36-27, not sure which of the hotshots played or not.

You are right on one thing..Uni are the guns to watch out for...but beware Sunnybank.

 

[triplet]

There is a reason Uni and Sunnybank have depth, which ties in with the reason why they have so many Reds players.....
You can't expect the clubs who aren't as financially well off in compairson to the likes of Sunnybank and University to be able to build their playing squad.

As I understand it when the Western Force first set up camp the players from outside Perth were evenly split up between all the clubs. Apart from clubs that nurture their own juniors why can't this be done by the QRU with Reds players particularly Academy players and particularly if they are from interstate. If the huge disparity between the top five and the rest of the competition continues perhaps some sort of system should be adopted.

 

[Jets]

I think if the clubs that are crying poor ran themselves more like a business with a goal of making some money that could be invested in development structures then they would be better off. All the stories I hear of clubs that are broke or close to it paying money to players are just crazy. If money is the only reason a player is interested in the club he isn't the type of guy the club should want. Players should go to the club that provides them with the best opportunity on and off the field.

 

[Saders07]

I think if the clubs that are crying poor ran themselves more like a business with a goal of making some money that could be invested in development structures then they would be better off. All the stories I hear of clubs that are broke or close to it paying money to players are just crazy. If money is the only reason a player is interested in the club he isn't the type of guy the club should want. Players should go to the club that provides them with the best opportunity on and off the field.

Jets - you're comments are very much on the mark and it is absolutely development opportunity as well as playing opportunity that should (and generally is) be the key decision making component in a players club choice. However, where there is choice for a player and the development opportunity is similar or equal then it can be the material gain that can sway the final decision. Is it material and should there be oversight from the governing body - for me yes and maybe?

Anyway - past this, my club's season has finished on a positive note with the victory over Brothers on the weekend. An end to a another very tough year where like Easts 40+ players were used in premier grade predominantly because of injury and illness. Better than last year but not up to expectation! I am looking forward to some strongly contested rugby in the next 3-weeks, predicting (like most) the final will be played out between Uni and Sunnybank with Uni celebrating their centenary with the Hospitals Cup.

 

[Red Heavy]

Uni has used 47 players this year. I would assume most clubs to be in a similar boat.
Murphy from Easts is a very good player with a one year deal down at the brumbies who I hope gets a chance at the next level.
I would also say that with Easts putting 2nd and 4th grade into the finals they have very good depth as a club.

 

[leakytap]

Uni has used 47 players this year. I would assume most clubs to be in a similar boat.
Murphy from Easts is a very good player with a one year deal down at the brumbies who I hope gets a chance at the next level.
I would also say that with Easts putting 2nd and 4th grade into the finals they have very good depth as a club.

Correct - S/bank have used 42 players. Injuries are a fact of life when playing a contact sport.

 

[tigerland12]

Much easier for Sunnybank and Uni to use that many players when they have so many Reds players. As seen by the strength of their 2nd grade sides, most of these players can easily slot into premier grade when needed. Most of these second grade players will play half the season in premier grade, then once the representative players come back, they slip back to second grade. It's much easier to have this depth when players are paid.

This is an approximate number of representative players (Super Rugby/Academy) that would of played at some point this year for their clubs. I've probably missed a few, or unaware of some, but you get the picture.
University: 13
Sunnybank: 14
Brothers: 4
Easts: 4
Souths: 2
Wests: 0
Norths: 0
GPS: 3
Gold Coast: 3
Sunshine Coast: 0

I wouldn't say that all these representative players went to those clubs for the money, but I definatly would of influenced some of them. And this depth can be seen through Premier, Second and Third Grade, along with Premier Colts, where Sunnybank and University are in the top 3.

I'm not having a bitch and moan cause my club has got knocked out ect. But it's fact that the money does influence the depth in these sides. Most University and Sunnybank second grade or premier colts players would be playing premier grade for the likes of Wests, Sunshine Coast, Norths and probably Souths and Gold Coast.

Once again I'm not having a bitch and moan, just a statement of how things are.

 

[twenty seven]

Financials aren't just about money and clubs crying poor. It's also the assistence from the Government that some clubs are able to apply for and others can't or it is not as substantial. . AND YES there are deals made under the table Re financial assistance whether it be help with courses (studying), housing etc, AND YES it definitely happens. Not all clubs can help in these matters.
. Also Easts began their decline of players from pre 1st round with their hooker suffering a work accident. By the time Sunnybanks game came around in the 1st round Easts had alreday lost quite a few players.

 

[twenty seven]

Sunny coast have 2 academy players in their team. Plus they have seen a few repersentative players from the past come and go this season.

 

[League Legend]

I think a lot has been said on here about the injuries of clubs throughout the season and a good point was made that it is a fact of life in a contact sport. At Easts the one example that is consisitent accross most positions is that they finished the season with the're 4th choice hooker, which is all i will say about that so as not to sound like a whinger. i think the key to consistently good performance of premier grade clubs over a few years is dependant on a quality reserve grade team which can put pressure on the clubs top players to perform and fill holes through the season when needed. Brothers and GPS are the best example of this as they always put a strong and physical reserve side on the park each week which is why they are amongst finals footy most years.

As for players being paid by clubs a few questions can be posed and i'd be interested to hear other peoples comments and thoughts:
- is it financially respopnsible of a club to pay a super rugby player to play for theire club considering the limited time they will play in the premier season (even more next season with super rugby going into August i believe) and the value they add to the club and the clubs responsiblilties in fostering development of the game and players at junior and grassroots level.
-Are the players being greedy, considering they are paid a years wage by the QRU to play rugby as a profession
- How does it affect the culture of the club with players coming in and out of the team and players losing spots in the team to players coming back
- Is it healthy for the competition.

One last point: Easts won 14 games out of 18- the same number that minor premier uni won yet wont be around for the last 3 weeks of the season. Considering Rugby and finals rugby are all about beating teams, are bonus point good or bad. None the less the tigers gave their all this year and should be proud of themselves. good luck to uni in what has been an emotional year for them. My tip Uni to beat sunnybank in the GF in what should be a classic game.

 

[tigerland12]

Sunny coast have 2 academy players in their team. Plus they have seen a few repersentative players from the past come and go this season.

My bad, was trying to think through who'd they be, Shon Siemonik is one.

 

[Red Heavy]

Much easier for Sunnybank and Uni to use that many players when they have so many Reds players. As seen by the strength of their 2nd grade sides, most of these players can easily slot into premier grade when needed. Most of these second grade players will play half the season in premier grade, then once the representative players come back, they slip back to second grade. It's much easier to have this depth when players are paid.

This is an approximate number of representative players (Super Rugby/Academy) that would of played at some point this year for their clubs. I've probably missed a few, or unaware of some, but you get the picture.
University: 13
Sunnybank: 14
Brothers: 4
Easts: 4
Souths: 2
Wests: 0
Norths: 0
GPS: 3
Gold Coast: 3
Sunshine Coast: 0

I wouldn't say that all these representative players went to those clubs for the money, but I definatly would of influenced some of them. And this depth can be seen through Premier, Second and Third Grade, along with Premier Colts, where Sunnybank and University are in the top 3.

I'm not having a bitch and moan cause my club has got knocked out ect. But it's fact that the money does influence the depth in these sides. Most University and Sunnybank second grade or premier colts players would be playing premier grade for the likes of Wests, Sunshine Coast, Norths and probably Souths and Gold Coast.

Once again I'm not having a bitch and moan, just a statement of how things are.

Are you saying that the teams with rep players pay their players?
Uni does not pay its players. There are scholarships for UQ students who play rugby at the club but off the top of my head i dont think any of the boys who got them this year are in premier grade.
I dont like how people who are not in the know hop on these kind of forums and say so matter of factly that clubs pay players. Of course its up to each club how they spend the small amount of revenue they get every year so if clubs do pay players all the power to them its not for me to judge.

 

[Heather]

Absolutely agree with you. Have been reading this ongoing discussion with interest, now with growing disgust. People keeps moaning about Uni and the number of Reds players that we have, and have named them. Here is a little perspective:
James Hanson - came through Uni Colts
Ian Prior - came through Uni Colts
Jono Lance - came through Uni Colts
Luke Morahan - came through Uni Colts
Tevita - rocked up to Uni preseason a few years ago. No one had heard of him, no one chased him

I could keep going, but hopefully the point has been made.


The first round this year Uni Prems lost two games. Without having the benefit of the team sheets in front of me the 'stars' that played most of those games were Dave McDuling, Shep played a few, yet we still won 7 out of 10 with guys who are not 'stars' but put in their blood, sweat and tears for every game they play. Tom Cox wouldn't be on the discussion board except for the fact he has had the opportunity to play excellent rugby this year and came to the attention of Brumbies. The ones that we didn't have because they had playing higher honours HAVE MOSTLY BEEN UNI BOYS FOR YEARS. There are multiple other reasons why the Reds boys chose to play for us - and I haven't seen any evidence of someone actually asking them why they chose their particular brisbane club.

Only a few years ago Uni were the 'easybeats' of the comp from Premier grade right down to fourth grade. I still remember having a clean sweep against us at Wests - I believe only 1 or 2 tries were scored that day by Uni. The club has worked hard on and off field since then to build it into what we are today and I think it is a slap in the face to put our success across the whole club down to Reds boys who have come through our ranks, or chose to come for their own particular reasons.

 

[twenty seven]

Tigerland, the other is Blake Enever - he started the season and played up until he went to Aus U20's then joined the queue for shoulder surgery.

Don't have a problem with those coming through colts and Juniors. People moing into new towns have a right to join a club. The unfortunate situation is that it is rather lopsided with Reds and, not forgetting, Academy players at the moment.
Would be great for clubs and their Juniors to have a few 'stars' to help bring in the crowds, and the money.