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NSW Schools - Trial Games and Selections 2015

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Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Schoolboy footy is cyclical.

ISA have had a fairly purple patch of late, but over time they are consistently inconsistent. In previous years (4+ years back and earlier) when Augies and Oakhill have had champion teams, ISA have really struggled to translate individual school form and dominance into the ISA representative team. It would be nice for them to get another trial game, but there are some fairly serious logistics challenges coordinating players from Orange, Bathurst, Campbelltown, Castle Hill, Northern Beaches and Strathfield plus the occasional player from Bowral, or the Central Coast to be in the one place compared to those which CAS and AAGPS face.

CAS this year have been very poor compared to previous years CAS teams. This may be an anomaly and I wouldn't write them off and dismiss them to the schoolboy scrap heap just yet. Things change from year to year.

The main purpose of the trials are to select players into the NSW All Schools teams. School Association bragging rights is a byproduct.
Notwithstanding, it would be better if all the Associations had a more balanced build up as ISA, AICES, and AAGPS only play two formal trial fixtures, CAS and CCC play 3 and CHS play 4 games. The problem is where are the AICES, ISA and AAGPS Associations going to fit the extra games on the already crowded sporting calendar?

Who's in the NSW All Schools teams?
AAGPS, 26
CAS, 2
CCC, 2
CHS 6
ISA, 10

Seems about right.
 
Inside Shoulder

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Gps will revert to Athletics in September next year so that they may be able to play an additional game: not sure the schools would want that.
I think CAS will be better next year based on the 2016 year 12 cohort.


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Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Bingham said:
<snip>
Also can someone explain to a novice like myself why players are chosen for teams on previous years play and reputation alone.
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There were 15 players who played in NSW All Schools Trials this year that were at National Championships last year, either in the NSW 1st XV, NSW 2nd XV or Combined States Squads. For simplicity I refer to these as the "Incumbents", and "pencil" these into the draft squads for this year to kick off the selection debate, even though there is no guarantee that they will retain their spot.

How it works in reality?
14 of the 15 "incumbents" were selected in the 46 players nominated for either the 2015 NSW 1st XV or 2nd XV. These 14 were selected on their basis of their form in the trials this year. The fact that one "incumbent" player was not selected this year, and that another has lost their place in the NSW 1st XV confirms that the players start each season on a level playing field with all others at the trials. Last year was last year, and nothing is guaranteed this year.
 
Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
George Grant said:
When is Combined States announced, anyone aware?
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Gets asked every year. Answer doesn't change.

The Combined States team is a sweep up of all the lads who deserve a go at Nationals but may be stuck in the queue behind 3 top notch lads in their position in their State but despite not getting a gig for their State squads they could still be the 4th best in the country, or they missed out due to bad trial form (injury related or a ball hog inside them etc), or the old politics chestnut.

The CS team couldn't be announced until QLD and the other states announce theirs. The reality is that the ACT, VIC, and WA usually do not get too many in Combined States because they do not have the depth that NSW and QLD have.

The NSW and QLD teams are announced on Friday night/Saturday. Screening Medicals are held on Sunday for the NSW and QLD players, already done for ACT, VIC and WA.

The Combined States selectors (mainly Manu Sutherland but I'd imagine Paul Curroza and others in the ARU Scouting network would be consulted) would be discussing their teams over the weekend (probably phone conferences) and finalise them late Sunday. In both Qld and NSW some of the Shadow players will be getting called up to State 2's due to failed medicals from the weekend - There are always 1 or 2. This rules them out of Combined States consideration.


I'd imagine that Manu or the Coach be ringing the chosen/lucky ones on Monday morning (a lot easier to track boys down on a Monday as opposed a Sunday), with the Combined States list to be formally released mid afternoon Monday.
 
Inside Shoulder

Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
And huge can you remind us all about game time rules?
Also if the 1 incumbent is who I think you mean he has moved up a step from bench in 1s to,start in 2s - correct?


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Wood Rat

Wood Rat

Alfred Walker (16)
"The fact that one "incumbent" player was not selected this year, and that another has lost their place in the NSW 1st XV confirms that the players start each season on a level playing field with all others at the trials." Hugh Jarse

"Also if the 1 incumbent is who I think you mean he has moved up a step from bench in 1s to,start in 2s - correct?" Inside Shoulder

Lough has gone from run on 1s to run on 2s in the same position
McRae has gone from reserve in 1s to run on in 2s, up two spots on the charts and leapfrogged by Chapman. McRae had one of his most ordinary games (in general play) in a long time yesterday, though I think his scrum work held up. I usually avoid commenting on him .... but what the hey at least he gets first crack at Qlds best!
 
Hugh Jarse

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
The ISA fatties did very well yesterday at set piece, although their opposition was poor. Having an all ISA front row starting for the 2nd XV could be an indicator that the sum of the whole is greater then the sum of the individual contributions and the Selectors chose to keep them together.

Experienced cloudgazers will understand that the "run on" numbering means little in terms of who plays where and when at Nationals. As @Inside Shoulder has indicated, the ASRU mandate that all players (1-23) in each squad must have at least 1 run on start, and there is also a minimum amount of game time that they must receive as well. I can't recall the exact figure.

For the Heavyweights of NSW and QLD, the tournament fixtures get progressively more challenging with each match. Conversely for the Vics, WA and the Politicians from the ACT, the games get "easier" as the tournament goes on. Consequently most teams use Day 1 and sometimes Day 2 games to start their bench players and keep their powder dry for the later games. For NSW and QLD, they need all hands on deck on Thursday when their 1's take on their enemies 2's, and for the others it is usually a game that they need their best combos available for games that they fancy their chances in.

The whole irony in all of this is players get injured, even when they are only running off the bench in a cameo appearance on Day 1 and the Day 3 teams often are Darwinian Survivors of the Fittest inspired affairs with more than one highly fancied individual being in Team rehab. Bottom line, run on sides for Match 1 are almost never the strongest side for that squad. Injuries, and great tournament form from the 16-23's, sometimes mean that the teams never field a run on team of 1-15 as selected.
 
Quick Hands

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
Wood Rat said:
From watching the posts here for a while now Nettleton McRae and co. inc have only ever beaten poor opposition
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Which is probably why ISA 1 need to play GPS 1 next year. On the basis of this year, CAS 1 should play ISA 1 and CHS 1 in 2016 and GPS 1 should play ISA 1 and CHS 1.
 
Lee Grant

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
There is a blog on the NSW trials here:

http://goo.gl/rH4XcT

Sorry for the delay but the intrepid reporter of the main game lost his notes and an old codger had to step in at late notice.

Some photos are to be added.
.
 
Rugby Addict

Rugby Addict

Herbert Moran (7)
Quick Hands said:
Which is probably why ISA 1 need to play GPS 1 next year. On the basis of this year, CAS 1 should play ISA 1 and CHS 1 in 2016 and GPS 1 should play ISA 1 and CHS 1.
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I don't think the results this year have much bearing on next year. You need to remember that CAS won the 16's schools tournament last year so should be very competitive with CHS and GPS who they beat last year. This year CAS had a weak group of Year 12's as was expected after their results at the 16's tournament in 2013. Next year they have a strong group of Year 12's so given a reasonable run with injuries they will do well. 4 of the 7 boys who made NSW schools 16's last year were unavailable through injury for CAS this year which would have helped them be more competitive this year.
 
George Grant

George Grant

Ward Prentice (10)
Rugby Addict said:
I don't think the results this year have much bearing on next year. You need to remember that CAS won the 16's schools tournament last year so should be very competitive with CHS and GPS who they beat last year. This year CAS had a weak group of Year 12's as was expected after their results at the 16's tournament in 2013. Next year they have a strong group of Year 12's so given a reasonable run with injuries they will do well. 4 of the 7 boys who made NSW schools 16's last year were unavailable through injury for CAS this year which would have helped them be more competitive this year.
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Last year CAS really should not have won 16's. GPS up to tries before taking off starting players with 10 minutes left


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Quick Hands

Quick Hands

David Wilson (68)
Rugby Addict said:
I don't think the results this year have much bearing on next year. You need to remember that CAS won the 16's schools tournament last year so should be very competitive with CHS and GPS who they beat last year. This year CAS had a weak group of Year 12's as was expected after their results at the 16's tournament in 2013. Next year they have a strong group of Year 12's so given a reasonable run with injuries they will do well. 4 of the 7 boys who made NSW schools 16's last year were unavailable through injury for CAS this year which would have helped them be more competitive this year.
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Only fair way is the previous season's results. The only reason that CAS has the GPS fixture is because it's always been that way. Recent results just don't justify it.

Nice try though.:)
 
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