jack andrews
Peter Burge (5)
There is no further U18 Waratahs v U18 Queensland this year, unlike previous years where they play at the end of the season.
NSW AAGPS 2024
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BananaMan
Allen Oxlade (6)
Thanks for confirming, that statement was really trying to ascertain whether there would be a 'training' academy, ie, games aside, if there isn't an U18 Gen Blue this year to improve their skills and reward players in some way does this mean they're expected to go from playing school/clubs straight to PONI. That's a huge ask.
Cauliflower Ear
Frank Nicholson (4)
Does anyone have statistics on how many PONI players are from outside NSW? You would think this would be a predominantly NSW-based initiative as the player retention rate is higher for union in QLD.
Seems like a very confusing system and a knee-jerk/rushed solution, but I believe this is just the foundation for a pathway to retaining players who have grown up playing union. There is no doubt the PONI system will undergo changes and tweaks to better suit the development of PONI and non-PONI players.
Remember, if the Waratahs and Wallabies weren't so sh*t, players would have a lot more pride to be selected into these academies/teams. It starts at the top, schoolboy rugby union has never had so much talent.
Seems like a very confusing system and a knee-jerk/rushed solution, but I believe this is just the foundation for a pathway to retaining players who have grown up playing union. There is no doubt the PONI system will undergo changes and tweaks to better suit the development of PONI and non-PONI players.
Remember, if the Waratahs and Wallabies weren't so sh*t, players would have a lot more pride to be selected into these academies/teams. It starts at the top, schoolboy rugby union has never had so much talent.
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sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Players of national interest is national mate - of the current 25, nsw are between 7-12. Gut feel is that the final 40 will be around 40-50% nsw, 30-40% from qld. 10-15% from act and rest from vic, wa typically. Keep in mind, this list will also come from players outside of school programs also…such as club land etc. however, don’t confuse this with the best players in the country ;-)
FastNFurious
Alfred Walker (16)
If you are protected from competition then there is a bias towards you. Players that might challenge you for your spot don’t get that opportunity in a rep format. Unless players are dropped from PONI then there isn’t an argument to say there is no bias to them.
Interesting, considering all these stat's looking in the challenge would/then is selectors/selection process? Strategy, what kind of player you need and game plan. PONI is no different to League clubs signing kids at Matts and contracts void once they turn 17
sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Very true - selectors/selection process sounds so easy ;-). There is never a situation where everyone is happy. However, the real challenge with Junior sport is development and identifying future potential v current capability. If the match is played right now, then current capability is the obvious barometer i.e. current form. However, in junior sport (especially contact sports) future potential is very challenging...and the PONI concept, and academies must have with an eye on the future, surely?
The bottom line is - I don't have faith that the current selectors and selection process is about identifying future potential and return. I believe it has become a process that is a boggy swamp of nepotism, old school tie, bias and 'thats the way we always do it'...sprinkled on top with some luck and experience...where everyone stands around 3 months later and comments 'they were a damn good side, they just got unlucky and lost by a converted try"
And respectfully, I do believe the volunteers in the role do a pretty bloody good job, given the resources they have and the environment they operate in.
The bottom line is - I don't have faith that the current selectors and selection process is about identifying future potential and return. I believe it has become a process that is a boggy swamp of nepotism, old school tie, bias and 'thats the way we always do it'...sprinkled on top with some luck and experience...where everyone stands around 3 months later and comments 'they were a damn good side, they just got unlucky and lost by a converted try"
And respectfully, I do believe the volunteers in the role do a pretty bloody good job, given the resources they have and the environment they operate in.
Hankspank
Larry Dwyer (12)
That is a perfect breakdown of how it works Jack so well done. The doors don't close and always remain open. Telling a 17/18 year old to think about the job / career opportunities rugby can offer is antiquated. I'm speaking with bias but my son made the academies & junior Australian reps, didn't go to a GPS/CAS school and played representative League. League wanted him to stay, he wanted to stay with union. If you love it, stick with it
Hankspank
Larry Dwyer (12)
Australian U/18s Joker. Combined of Schoolboy players and Colts players from around the country.
sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Thats' not bias at all - its a great story, and credit to your young man and your family. Sadly, this is a very rare story that will potentially become even less common without a rethink and some changes.
Test them
Make the coaches/selectors accountable put out what they're looking for
1. Set player minimum standards, bench, squat, deadline, catch/pass, tackle/contact, bronco
2. XFactor a player brings is then discussed prior to selection as this is subjective.
sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Kinda - I like your thunking. Talent identification and realisation is a little more complex than that these days - and very well understood across many sporting codes around the world. There are already a set of physical tests conducted for the Academy lads, including strength, speed, flexibility etc - but the bigger determinant is actually the mental component. Character identification and development is where the opportunity is (think - AFL Draft). However for this to be really effective, the club, state and national COE's and organisations need to have a very clear picture of what they want and need. The AB's nailed this off the back of their review around 2003-2007. They knew precisely what mindset and character traits they needed and how to develop them from a young age.
Yes more complex, but thats the actual issue, everyones talking about how complex it is but working away from solutions
Not the Academy lads more for those who are going into all school trials etc similar to US combine.
Mental toughness and IQ also needs to be measured.
With club/school/state/national that is exactly the problem - disconnection.
Not the Academy lads more for those who are going into all school trials etc similar to US combine.
Mental toughness and IQ also needs to be measured.
With club/school/state/national that is exactly the problem - disconnection.
sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Sweet - I think you and I are pretty much aligned!
FastNFurious
Alfred Walker (16)
If PONI really had an eye on the future it would’t select the best players from last season. ….. and the selectors for PONI aren’t volunteers.
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TriggerBall
Herbert Moran (7)
I second the motion
Here for the advice
Peter Burge (5)
Many years ago touring squads for the wallabies were picked that way with each state able to nominate player hence some random tourists from Victoria and other states and also country representatives and many NSW v QLd quotas - none official but very much adhered too. (Much like the governance of the Rugby Australia).
sundayeightpm
Herbert Moran (7)
Agree, mostly. And mate, anyone who lives in a capital city on the Eastern seaboard who earns < $150k p.a. is a volunteer ;-)
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