NSW AAGPS 2022

[propsarespeedy]

Lets wait to hear the full story. Sounds terrible. Maybe locks on change rooms will help. I know some schools have a staff member on watch outside the visitors rooms just in case. All it takes is a couple of rotten kids to ruin a relationship. Stannies will be making enquiries.

The full story is that a large majority of Scots firsts and seconds players had their bags stolen. Whether by a student or adult we most likely won't know but the odd thing is, how did no
one see this when it was happening? And surely they can put some cameras out side the change room or lock the door? Hopefully the person gets caught. One positive thing is the Scots insurance will cover most of the money from everything that was taken from the boys so most players will get close to all of their items value back in money hopefully. Really hope this never happens again, no space for that type of stuff in rugby.

 

[Short side]

No such mystery about the joeys boys who stole belongings from the Waverley change rooms.
The names and photos of those that stole them were reported directly to joeys who have taken no action whatsoever. Even letting them play in some of their high level rugby teams for the last three weeks.

This is the first I’ve heard of this where did you get this information and what teams are these boys playing in

 

[propsarespeedy]

No such mystery about the joeys boys who stole belongings from the Waverley change rooms.
The names and photos of those that stole them were reported directly to joeys who have taken no action whatsoever. Even letting them play in some of their high level rugby teams for the last three weeks.

What was stolen?

 

[AroundTheAnkles]

No such mystery about the joeys boys who stole belongings from the Waverley change rooms.
The names and photos of those that stole them were reported directly to joeys who have taken no action whatsoever. Even letting them play in some of their high level rugby teams for the last three

Seems like a curious story, in my experience Joeys doesn’t normally provide cover for anyone, regardless of who they are or what team they play in.

 

[ItsNotPink]

I will be able to confirm all matches later this week.
These inter association matches strive to match teams up of equal ability.
This does not always work when a schools' A team is way better than another schools C/D or E team.
This is all hit and miss,.
Not many schools can match all grades with one another.

You are spot on, Joker and the new AAGPS web site does not help at all. Both the fixtures and results pages are shown without individual team grades (even though you can filter by overall grade/division).
For example, in the 3rd XV Results for last week it has Joeys 14 lost to High 22. Correct score, but no mention that it was Joeys 7th XV defeated by High 1st XV! It does change the perspective on many of the results when the grade is taken into account.

 

[Ace Ventura]

Seems like a curious story, in my experience Joeys doesn’t normally provide cover for anyone, regardless of who they are or what team they play in.

Joeys hasn't played Waverley since 2019 (May 19th to be exact - 3 years ago), so when was this supposed to have happened?
Sounds like your typical unfounded rumour ...

 

[WLF3]

Joeys hasn't played Waverley since 2019 (May 19th to be exact - 3 years ago), so when was this supposed to have happened?
Sounds like your typical unfounded rumour ...

Agree Ace, and I am a Waverley parent on the supporters committee so I am sure I would have heard about it, if it happened, for sure! Sounds very dubious to me.
I was at that game at QP and my memory of the 1sts game was a cracker 49-47 to Joeys, 1 conversion goal missed out from 14 tries, and it hit the posts! Shame we don't play every year, not sure why other than match-ups but that is the same every week for joeys and we did play in 2017 and 2019, similar running rugby styles ensures some terrific schoolboy tries.

 

[SkyBlue]

i believe its fair to say Scots are frontrunners at the moment...

Their second trial against barker was a cracker of a game to watch. Barker were the favourites leading up to the game however Scots seemed to have the upper hand for the majority of the game....

Let me know any of your thoughts!

Hello Dave,

At this current moment in time, I would put Joeys over Scots. Keep in mind during the Barker vs Scots game there were 8 out of the 15 regular 1stXV players not playing (injury/illness). It really wasn't the same Barker calibre team that Joey's had to face. Joey's impressed me vs a much healthier Barker team (especially if those flu rumours are true). Really fit tight-five. A great scrummaging team despite a smaller pack. Also, having the second-best NSW schoolboys player in my opinion at fullback gives them some strike power, having the ability to make something out of nothing. Also well-drilled as always. I believe the score was something like 30-12 but that doesn't really reflect how good of a team Joeys are. Some uncharacteristic mistakes kept Joeys out of the game, and Barker's defence both in the middle and on the edge was incredible. Could have gone Joeys way on a different day.

I'm yet to see Shore play however, obviously heard great things. I hope they are as good as what I've heard. Schoolboy footy is best with as many teams competing as possible. Perhaps my opinion will change after I've seen them.

I think TKS could pull out some surprising results, they were quite good vs Joeys, especially in the second half where they were quite dominant, but Joeys scrambling defence and heart were too good, and their set-peice defence was great. Overall I think don't think this is our year. Not to worry though, some very exciting and young prospects.

Overall, I think this will be an interesting year in GPS footy.

 

[AroundTheAnkles]

Hello Dave,

At this current moment in time, I would put Joeys over Scots. Keep in mind during the Barker vs Scots game there were 8 out of the 15 regular 1stXV players not playing (injury/illness). It really wasn't the same Barker calibre team that Joey's had to face. Joey's impressed me vs a much healthier Barker team (especially if those flu rumours are true). Really fit tight-five. A great scrummaging team despite a smaller pack. Also, having the second-best NSW schoolboys player in my opinion at fullback gives them some strike power, having the ability to make something out of nothing. Also well-drilled as always. I believe the score was something like 30-12 but that doesn't really reflect how good of a team Joeys are. Some uncharacteristic mistakes kept Joeys out of the game, and Barker's defence both in the middle and on the edge was incredible. Could have gone Joeys way on a different day.

I'm yet to see Shore play however, obviously heard great things. I hope they are as good as what I've heard. Schoolboy footy is best with as many teams competing as possible. Perhaps my opinion will change after I've seen them.

I think TKS could pull out some surprising results, they were quite good vs Joeys, especially in the second half where they were quite dominant, but Joeys scrambling defence and heart were too good, and their set-peice defence was great. Overall I think don't think this is our year. Not to worry though, some very exciting and young prospects.

Overall, I think this will be an interesting year in GPS footy.

I think it is going to be an extremely tight GPS race this year, great summary @SkyBlue .

If the Joeys 15 is your second best who is the best?

 

[SkyBlue]

I think it is going to be an extremely tight GPS race this year, great summary @SkyBlue .

If the Joeys 15 is your second best who is the best?

Agreed. Tight indeed.

That Joey's 15 is a special player. Extremely elusive, and makes defenders look silly, and I've seen him on multiple occasions create a try from absolutely nothing. A kid that is talented is rare. For me though, whilst I think it's extremely close, Isaiya Katoa is a freak. He controls his team around the paddock as very few schoolboys can. His kicking game is great, has the ball on a string. Finds grass, and gets his team out of trouble with some excellent nudges. He leads the red wall with his line speed (although he's surrounded by some excellent defenders who do the same). Has an intimidating frame, especially as a 10, and he knows how to use it. He's a special playmaker. Has excellent footwork, and a great fend. He's also a great leader off the field and captained his first game in year 11. There is not a single thing this kid doesn't have.

I'm a fan (clearly).

I just think the fact that he has it all separates him from most. Quite literally one of the best schoolboy footy players I have ever seen. Rugby League stole another one.

 

[AroundTheAnkles]

Agreed. Tight indeed.

That Joey's 15 is a special player. Extremely elusive, and makes defenders look silly, and I've seen him on multiple occasions create a try from absolutely nothing. A kid that is talented is rare. For me though, whilst I think it's extremely close, Isaiya Katoa is a freak. He controls his team around the paddock as very few schoolboys can. His kicking game is great, has the ball on a string. Finds grass, and gets his team out of trouble with some excellent nudges. He leads the red wall with his line speed (although he's surrounded by some excellent defenders who do the same). Has an intimidating frame, especially as a 10, and he knows how to use it. He's a special playmaker. Has excellent footwork, and a great fend. He's also a great leader off the field and captained his first game in year 11. There is not a single thing this kid doesn't have.

I'm a fan (clearly).

I just think the fact that he has it all separates him from most. Quite literally one of the best schoolboy footy players I have ever seen. Rugby League stole another one.

hard to argue, he must be the biggest fly half in rugby, boys or men. I found it strange that he stood at fullback during defensive play on the weekend but perhaps that was just to better utilise his kicking skills. The 13 for barker has similar characteristics minus the kicking.

It is a shame that IK will go back to league but it does shine a light on a serious issue for rugby to contend with. My (probably controversial) view is that anyone aligned to league should not be registered to play 1st or 2nd XV or be granted the privilege of higher rep selections in rugby. Why? 2 main reasons;
1) put simply, certain schools abandon any pretense of developing any rugby players in junior years and then bring in some guns on various arrangements in the final years to arggandise the school (a bit sad and very poor for culture). If it is really about developing players and providing educational opportunities rather than the headmasters ego stroking themselves and other shallow groups then that should be OK.
2) Why should RA provide rep experience opportunities often on an international basis to kids that will never be available to the senior game? It is simply crazy, it is akin to making high risk venture capital investments knowing that the payoff has already been assigned to a different investor (completely irrational). It is time that rugby properly valued what it has to offer and refuse to give it away cheaply anymore.

The rules could be implemented by the school associations, state and national bodies and put a stop to the developing arms race. It wouldn't stop schools so inclined offering opportunities to some individuals altogether and that would be OK, on the other hand it might encourage them to make a bit more effort in developing their own players.

 

[SkyBlue]

It is a shame that IK will go back to league but it does shine a light on a serious issue for rugby to contend with. My (probably controversial) view is that anyone aligned to league should not be registered to play 1st or 2nd XV or be granted the privilege of higher rep selections in rugby.

I agree to some extent. However, I think what these players do is advertise these school's rugby programs, which I think will lead to more talented players being channelled through some of these top schools. For example, I believe 9 news did a piece on Sua'ali'i and Penisini last week in the lead up to Roosters vs Eels. It was good advertisement for Kings rugby program in my opinion.

Also, if a player has paid his fees and has come through the schools rugby program, and he happens to sign with a league club, as frustrating as it is, I don't see an issue with it. I find it frustrating in for example, Sua'ali'i's case, where he was on scholarship, yet his league team didn't let him play schoolboy footy. That's frustrating.

 

[SkyBlue]

hard to argue, he must be the biggest fly half in rugby, boys or men. I found it strange that he stood at fullback during defensive play on the weekend but perhaps that was just to better utilise his kicking skills. The 13 for barker has similar characteristics minus the kicking.

As for why Isaiya Katoa stood at 15, the regular fullback has been out since Oakhill but is back soon, and the winger that they had playing 15 against Scots for the first 2 minutes got injured as well. He was pushed to play by the coaching staff due to a ridiculous amount of injuries already, but shouldn't have been playing. Had a strained quad I believe? Was stupid to make him play when he clearly couldn't. It was a trial game, not worth risking health over. Especially when that boy may now be injured for actual competition games which are far more important. And furthermore, you probably weren't going to beat a quality Scots side with more than half your regular 1stXV team injured as it was.

The point is, against Joeys, they didn't really have a fullback, so Katoa did that job.

 

[Homer]

I agree to some extent. However, I think what these players do is advertise these school's rugby programs, which I think will lead to more talented players being channelled through some of these top schools. For example, I believe 9 news did a piece on Sua'ali'i and Penisini last week in the lead up to Roosters vs Eels. It was good advertisement for Kings rugby program in my opinion.

Also, if a player has paid his fees and has come through the schools rugby program, and he happens to sign with a league club, as frustrating as it is, I don't see an issue with it. I find it frustrating in for example, Sua'ali'i's case, where he was on scholarship, yet his league team didn't let him play schoolboy footy. That's frustrating.

We are verging on dangerous territory here with this line of talk. But I disagree SB. It merely paints over the cracks in the programme. Barker have barely won a game in any grade this year, but the 1sts are favourites to win the comp. The rugby programmes aren't up to scratch and the success of some schools is misleading, especially with edited TV programmes that are there to hype up individuals.
We need more comprehensive programmes like Joeys and these take time to implement. Most schools just don't have the patience, but if they do, the depth will come and the standard of competition will rise.
As I said before, have a Junior, Middle and Senior premiership and force the schools to invest in all the teams.

 

[SkyBlue]

We are verging on dangerous territory here with this line of talk. But I disagree SB. It merely paints over the cracks in the programme. Barker have barely won a game in any grade this year, but the 1sts are favourites to win the comp. The rugby programmes aren't up to scratch and the success of some schools is misleading, especially with edited TV programmes that are there to hype up individuals.
We need more comprehensive programmes like Joeys and these take time to implement. Most schools just don't have the patience, but if they do, the depth will come and the standard of competition will rise.
As I said before, have a Junior, Middle and Senior premiership and force the schools to invest in all the teams.

Not every school has 400 boys in every grade, so you can't hold every school to the same standard as Joeys.

I have no problem with scholarships. These elite rugby schools are more than just rugby development nurseries. They educate. They develop character. They build men. If a boy has something to offer a school, I see no issue with that school giving him a scholarship. Great education shouldn't just be for the wealthy. Those exceptional boys who are dedicated, who are disciplined, and who work hard to develop their craft (whatever that may be) deserve great education too.

We are gifted enough to be given the opportunity to go to schools like these. We know all the great opportunities and experiences they have given us. Why not help those exceptional kids get the same opportunities we were so fortunate to have.

 

[AroundTheAnkles]

I agree to some extent. However, I think what these players do is advertise these school's rugby programs, which I think will lead to more talented players being channelled through some of these top schools. For example, I believe 9 news did a piece on Sua'ali'i and Penisini last week in the lead up to Roosters vs Eels. It was good advertisement for Kings rugby program in my opinion.

Also, if a player has paid his fees and has come through the schools rugby program, and he happens to sign with a league club, as frustrating as it is, I don't see an issue with it. I find it frustrating in for example, Sua'ali'i's case, where he was on scholarship, yet his league team didn't let him play schoolboy footy. That's frustrating.

yes and no, a few counters (and a little bit of a rant

1) if that was the case (that media exposure would create momentum) then both Barker and Kings wouldn't have such miserable 13's 14's and 15's this year. Unmentionable arrangements have been in place for a very long time at both schools. Scots too would be much more consistent in age group teams and so would Knox. Any media doesn't so much advertise the Kings rugby program, it advertises 2 exceptional athletes that attended Kings a bit. Note that Sua'ali'i in particular hardly trained with Kings at all and didn't play any rugby in his final 2 years. Penisini on the other hand was more on board so perhaps give some credit for that.
2) there have been a number of boys at Joeys dabbling with league in the last few years although none this year that I am aware of. However, they have been fee paying and outside obligations cannot ever interfere with school commitments of any kind (including the occasional Sunday mass)
3) NRL clubs would stop sending in contracted players to schools and thus crowding out development opportunities for true rugby men.

If rugby in Australia wants to punch properly on a world scale then it can't allow itself to be regularly raided by mercenaries. We are the only country in the world that must compete with 2 other winter contact codes to attracting talent. Valued properly we have the game that offers the most compelling opportunities overall (remuneration, internationalism, connections etc etc) why give it away cheaply?

Blasphemy on this page (I know) however it could be time, perhaps part of the solution is to establish a senior XV schools competition that preserves the traditions but opens up the contest more widely. Rather than play so many trials play a GPS, CAS, and Other cross over tournament that still allows a GPS and CAS champion to be confirmed, an overall champion school and perhaps offer a second tier with promotion and relegation opportunities. It might also introduce the posibility of High, Grammar and TAS occasionally challenging for the GPS crown again instead of the permanent 3rd XV status.

I love the GPS tradition and would never want to abandon it but I think it needs to evolve for the good of the game.

 

[rod skellet]

Agreed. Tight indeed.

That Joey's 15 is a special player. Extremely elusive, and makes defenders look silly, and I've seen him on multiple occasions create a try from absolutely nothing. A kid that is talented is rare. For me though, whilst I think it's extremely close, Isaiya Katoa is a freak. He controls his team around the paddock as very few schoolboys can. His kicking game is great, has the ball on a string. Finds grass, and gets his team out of trouble with some excellent nudges. He leads the red wall with his line speed (although he's surrounded by some excellent defenders who do the same). Has an intimidating frame, especially as a 10, and he knows how to use it. He's a special playmaker. Has excellent footwork, and a great fend. He's also a great leader off the field and captained his first game in year 11. There is not a single thing this kid doesn't have.

I'm a fan (clearly).

I just think the fact that he has it all separates him from most. Quite literally one of the best schoolboy footy players I have ever seen. Rugby League stole another one.

I completely agree with you Skyblue. If there was a way that Rugby Australia could get this Isaiya back after his 3 years with the Redcliff Dolphins it would be worth it. He is 20% better than Donaldson, Edmed and Lolasio at the same age. He is the best schoolboy flyhalf I have seen ever. And that includes watching both Qld GPS, NSW AAGPS, CAS and NZ schoolboy rugby. He is a player that is worth more to Australian rugby than Sua'ali'i is worth to League.

His time away in League may well work, to Rugby Australia's advantage. Tom Wright (Joeys lad??) has thrived after several years of conditioning in League. Rugby world cup 2027 is the carrot. From my contacts inside Barker, he is loving his time playing union. I hope selectors encourage him by selecting him in the appropriate rep sides while still at school so we can keep the embers burning when the time comes for him to return to union.

 

[AroundTheAnkles]

Not every school has 400 boys in every grade, so you can't hold every school to the same standard as Joeys.

Joeys is probably the absolute smallest of all GPS schools at about 1100 students but anyway.

 

[SkyBlue]

Joeys is probably the absolute smallest of all GPS schools at about 1100 students but anyway.

Yes, I was more comparing Joeys to Barker, who has closer to 300 in each grade, almost half of which being girls.

 

[Cockatoo Run]

Not touching the 's'-word with a barge pole - Cyclopath sees and hears all...

Let’s face it, we’re not losing that many future Wallaby forwards to league, (and forward depth is our biggest challenge) it is predominantly backs who we always argue played league from primary school anyway.

Next month, between the GPS/CAS/CHS/ISA/CCC/City/Country etc – there will be over 100 talented schoolboy kids playing in the rep games. Maybe 3-4 end up at a Super Rugby franchise next year. It’s losing the next best 10 players that concerns me. Surely, they can’t all mysteriously end up at Sydney Uni colts in 2023 .