sounds like that may be a good idea although having a sydney rep/club side does allow boys a chance of selection who may not have been at the schools nsw schools comp and hence would never get a look in??
National U/16 Championships 2013
- Thread starter Hugh Jarse
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sounds like that may be a good idea although having a sydney rep/club side does allow boys a chance of selection who may not have been at the schools nsw schools comp and hence would never get a look in??
The Spectator
Herbert Moran (7)
Every boy goes to school hence is eligible for schools as this takes in GPS, ISA, CHS, CAS etc; not every boy plays club as is the anomaly in Under 16s. In my view this opens the debate on selections with Sydney Juniors having one choice, then Schools having next dibs. Its like picking teams for bloody captain ball.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
Concur with the push for a NSW I and NSW II team.
Consider promoting National Indigenous to Div 1 at the expense of NSW Country Juniors, or even have a National Indigenous All Stars with some "combined states" types added to the Lloydies to make them more competitive in Div 1.
Disagree with the issue of rationalising NSW teams to prevent QLD dominance though
The White team this year performed below expectations. The Reds were an exeptional team.
Whites and Reds last year were very close in many respects.
Schools and Juniors both performed very well against the Reds last year with both games rather close on the scoreboard.
A good tournament with some outstanding footy played at a great venue. Well done to the ARU and Riverview College,
It would be remiss if no mention was made of the halftime entertainment in the finals today and yesterday.
Long time Riverview Rugby Tragic, Matty Shields is usually seen "sneaking" on to the main oval to practice his place kicking between games and at half time.
Today he was on the oval in an official capacity to take 3 goal kick attempts.
Usually Matty is attired in full Wallaby Strip. Today ominously he had been dressed by the QLD Reds camp.
Attempt 1. Brave attempt. Hit the cross bar.
Attempt 2. Sliced well to the right. He seemed to rush this kick and lifted his head at the point of impact. Focus!
Attempt 3. Success. Right over the black dot. Never looked like missing.
Yesterdays entertaiment in the rain and cold was the elegantly dressed gentleman photographer that appeared to have left his wet weather equipment at home. Out of the boot of the car, it would appear that about 3 beach towels were found and these were variously wrapped around or stuffed into his clothing for protection from the bracing southerly wind.
The Spectator
Herbert Moran (7)
If you had NSW 1 and 2 isn't that in fact "rationalising" such that you have the best two teams on the paddock with 1 the better team? Or is this not how it is done in Schoolboys?
Good job by Matty - may need a new kicking tee and definitely a new strip!
Good job by Matty - may need a new kicking tee and definitely a new strip!
sarcophilus
Charlie Fox (21)
Maybe if this comp was graded properly and not to the advantage of the NSW team Tuesdays Reds v Sydney game would have been the correct final.
it was interesting that the pool that Qld Sydney Victoria and ACT were in won the bulk of their cross matches comfortably
it was interesting that the pool that Qld Sydney Victoria and ACT were in won the bulk of their cross matches comfortably
The Spectator
Herbert Moran (7)
Agree entirely - soft draw for schools and it showed today under pressure. I personally thought Syd vs Reds was more of a contest. Interesting to see from a Reds player perspective who they thought was the harder team.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
In defence of the ARU organisers, it is hard to grade Juniors and NSW Schools abilities particularly when the faceless masonic selectors at schools and Juniors chop and change and horse trade players during the complicated selection processes. One year Juniors seem to be the stronger team, next year it is Schools, and then the following year they are relatively equal.
The ARU Competition director must get as annoyed as we mere punters get over the silly WIIFM games played by Juniors and Schools administrators. NSWI and NSW II selected by independent selectors is the only way to go to get rid of the silliness.
NSW I is then put in a pool on the opposite side of the Draw to Qld I (Reds). Not Rocket Surgery, yet the galoots running the associations can not seem to manage reach this conclusion.
Lord Lardy
Frank Row (1)
VIC had a decent tournament. Against REDS held them at 40-24 with 10 mins to go. Beat ACT comfortably. Came close to beating SYD JUN with final score at 20-15, SYD down to 14 in last minute and SYD didn't score in 2nd half. Beat WA comfortably.
Congrats to REDS well deserved winners - their back line was much better than any other team.
Congrats to REDS well deserved winners - their back line was much better than any other team.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
The Vic's continue to improve and impress at Nationals in both U16 and U18's.
The day is not long off when they could make it to a final.
The day is not long off when they could make it to a final.
George Smith
Ted Thorn (20)
then we can have NSW Country as a 3rd XV or are you suggesting we assist ARU and reduce their costs by cutting a team out?
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
^^Therein lies the problem.
Eight teams in two pools, playing 3 pool and 1 finals day game is such a simple formula.
The National Indigenous Team (AKA LLoyd McDermott) would probably be competitive at Div 1 level.
A Combined States team could be competitive, and would mop up those NSW and QLD boys considered unlucky to miss out for their state, plus any really talented lads from SA, NT or Tas.
Assuming the best of the Country kids would be in NSW I and/or NSW II, NSW country would be less competitive than they are currently. Country already lose their best to NSW Schools team. Perhaps a combined NSW/QLD Country team like that raised for the B&I Lions?
ACT already take Southern Inland NSW country lads, why not have ACT Country combined. That would put some extra starch in that team, but training would be a logistics challenge.
Eight teams in two pools, playing 3 pool and 1 finals day game is such a simple formula.
The National Indigenous Team (AKA LLoyd McDermott) would probably be competitive at Div 1 level.
A Combined States team could be competitive, and would mop up those NSW and QLD boys considered unlucky to miss out for their state, plus any really talented lads from SA, NT or Tas.
Assuming the best of the Country kids would be in NSW I and/or NSW II, NSW country would be less competitive than they are currently. Country already lose their best to NSW Schools team. Perhaps a combined NSW/QLD Country team like that raised for the B&I Lions?
ACT already take Southern Inland NSW country lads, why not have ACT Country combined. That would put some extra starch in that team, but training would be a logistics challenge.
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
3rd/4th Play off Match
Sydney Juniors vs Queensland White
Oval 2, 10 am kickoff.
The Bronze Medal match kicked off on field 2 in vastly different conditions to the previous day. It was a pleasant and sunny 17 degrees temperature with a light breeze from the South that favoured the Sydney Juniors in the first half.
While playing on field 2 on the final day can disappoint, Sydney showed that they were there to mean business as they quickly ran in unconverted tries in the first quarter of the match, scored by #15 C Hurley, #11 L Hughes,TBA, and #12 J Hawkins. Look away at the wrong time on field and there is no ground announcer to help you to record correct details!
Despite being behind 15 - 0 on the scoreboard, Queensland seemed to dominate much of the first half, and while the possession stats will be in their favour they just seemed to lack the knock out punch to break open the Juniors tight defence.
The Juniors were playing like the Wallabies and surviving on scraps of possession, but they did look sharp when they had the pill with some hard straight running. Following another Wallabies pattern of play, both sides were guilty of inaccurate work at the breakdowns which resulted in lots of turnovers and penalties from the tackle contest.
The Queensland team were held up across the Juniors line several times with desperate defence, and in a sign of the physical toll of the week, the big Qld piggies seemed to run out of puff and oranges couldn’t come soon enough for them.
Half time: Sydney Juniors lead 15 (3 Tries) – 0.
Suitably refreshed by the half time oranges, Queensland kicked off from the South with the breeze behind them, and they were quickly rattled after Juniors #8 C King bullocked over for a fine piggies try in the 3rd minute of the second stanza. #10 J Hawkins added the extra points to make it 22 – 0 to Sydney.
This roused the Queenslanders into action and once again they dominated the possession stakes for most of the rest of the half but were unable to get any reward, although they were held up across the line on several occasions and it was only the resolute defence of the Sydney lads that kept them from scoring. After a succession of repeated breakdown penalties in their red zone, the Juniors could count themselves lucky that the referee did not reach for the cards in his pocket. 6 minutes later the Juniors luck ran out and on a Assistant Referee report, they lost a player to the Sin Bin for a dangerous tackle.
As sometimes happens, losing a player seemed to lift the Juniors efforts and, in the 20th minute after some sustained pressure and good breakdown work, their #21 J Veru danced through about 4 would be tacklers for what proved to be the last score for the local team. With 10 minutes to go, it was 27 – 0 to Sydney as the conversion attempt failed to add the extra points.
The last 10 minutes were all Queensland and they threw everything at the Sydney boys, again going very close to scoring on several occasions. Inevitably under the weight of pressure and possession, nippy half back for the Whites #21 J Lenac looked up from a ruck 1 metre out and seeing space, like all halfbacks do, he cheekily darted through the thinnest of gaps to get the first try for his team in the 28th minute 5 metres to the right of the posts. #10 J Carroll added the extras with a simple conversion to make the score 27 - 7.
Full time: Sydney Juniors 27 (5 Tries, 1 Con) defeated Queensland White 7 (1 Try, 1 Con)
(Half time: Sydney Juniors lead 15 (3 Tries) – 0.)
The Game. Queensland White dominated most of the game, and had enough ball and created opportunities to win several games. In the face of dogged defence from the Sydney lads, they were just unable to finish most of their opportunities off, particularly when they had a numerical advantage for 10 minutes while a Sydney boy sat in the naughty boy’s chair.
We saw parallels to the current Wallaby execution in that far too often the Queensland forward runners were taking the ball flat footed and consequently knocked over behind the advantage line by the aggressive Sydney defence. Both sides were also undone with inaccurate work at the breakdowns, and cut out passes that simply allowed the defence to easily drift to follow the ball.
On the back of their stoic defence, and their ability to score from the half chances they created, Sydney Juniors deserved their comfortable victory in the Bronze Medal Match.
Significant Contributing Players:
Sydney Juniors: #12 J Hawkins, #5 E Faatui, #8 C King, #3 W McRae
Queensland Whites: #8 C McKenzie, #21 J Lenac, #13 D Riley
*******************************
Tournament Comments:
Once again the local folk are left wondering if Schools or Juniors were the “better” team. To borrow from a Brian Westlake anecdote on the Scholarship thread, I overheard two Rugby Mums debriefing their sons on their teams performance today.
The Sydney Juniors Mum said “Don’t worry son, even though you didn’t make the final, you got closer to the Reds than the Schools were, and you flogged the Whites, so Juniors are the best team”.
Elsewhere, the NSW Schools Mum was overheard saying “We made it to the final and beat the White team by more that the Juniors did, and we didn’t have {names omitted}, so you guys are the best NSW team.”
We will never know.
It felt like 2012 deja vue all again as Reds ran up their tally against the schools, but the deja vue Fairy didn't give us the second half turn around that we saw last year.
The Reds were a very complete and very physical team, and were on a level above the Juniors, Whites, and Schools. If anything I was disappointed with the quality of the Whites this year.
The last 2 years there has been little between Juniors and Schools, and last year there was not all that marked a gap between Red and White. This year Whites were clearly a level below Juniors and Schools, with Pool B being the pool of Death.
Change is definately in the air.
Sydney Juniors vs Queensland White
Oval 2, 10 am kickoff.
The Bronze Medal match kicked off on field 2 in vastly different conditions to the previous day. It was a pleasant and sunny 17 degrees temperature with a light breeze from the South that favoured the Sydney Juniors in the first half.
While playing on field 2 on the final day can disappoint, Sydney showed that they were there to mean business as they quickly ran in unconverted tries in the first quarter of the match, scored by #15 C Hurley, #11 L Hughes,
Despite being behind 15 - 0 on the scoreboard, Queensland seemed to dominate much of the first half, and while the possession stats will be in their favour they just seemed to lack the knock out punch to break open the Juniors tight defence.
The Juniors were playing like the Wallabies and surviving on scraps of possession, but they did look sharp when they had the pill with some hard straight running. Following another Wallabies pattern of play, both sides were guilty of inaccurate work at the breakdowns which resulted in lots of turnovers and penalties from the tackle contest.
The Queensland team were held up across the Juniors line several times with desperate defence, and in a sign of the physical toll of the week, the big Qld piggies seemed to run out of puff and oranges couldn’t come soon enough for them.
Half time: Sydney Juniors lead 15 (3 Tries) – 0.
Suitably refreshed by the half time oranges, Queensland kicked off from the South with the breeze behind them, and they were quickly rattled after Juniors #8 C King bullocked over for a fine piggies try in the 3rd minute of the second stanza. #10 J Hawkins added the extra points to make it 22 – 0 to Sydney.
This roused the Queenslanders into action and once again they dominated the possession stakes for most of the rest of the half but were unable to get any reward, although they were held up across the line on several occasions and it was only the resolute defence of the Sydney lads that kept them from scoring. After a succession of repeated breakdown penalties in their red zone, the Juniors could count themselves lucky that the referee did not reach for the cards in his pocket. 6 minutes later the Juniors luck ran out and on a Assistant Referee report, they lost a player to the Sin Bin for a dangerous tackle.
As sometimes happens, losing a player seemed to lift the Juniors efforts and, in the 20th minute after some sustained pressure and good breakdown work, their #21 J Veru danced through about 4 would be tacklers for what proved to be the last score for the local team. With 10 minutes to go, it was 27 – 0 to Sydney as the conversion attempt failed to add the extra points.
The last 10 minutes were all Queensland and they threw everything at the Sydney boys, again going very close to scoring on several occasions. Inevitably under the weight of pressure and possession, nippy half back for the Whites #21 J Lenac looked up from a ruck 1 metre out and seeing space, like all halfbacks do, he cheekily darted through the thinnest of gaps to get the first try for his team in the 28th minute 5 metres to the right of the posts. #10 J Carroll added the extras with a simple conversion to make the score 27 - 7.
Full time: Sydney Juniors 27 (5 Tries, 1 Con) defeated Queensland White 7 (1 Try, 1 Con)
(Half time: Sydney Juniors lead 15 (3 Tries) – 0.)
The Game. Queensland White dominated most of the game, and had enough ball and created opportunities to win several games. In the face of dogged defence from the Sydney lads, they were just unable to finish most of their opportunities off, particularly when they had a numerical advantage for 10 minutes while a Sydney boy sat in the naughty boy’s chair.
We saw parallels to the current Wallaby execution in that far too often the Queensland forward runners were taking the ball flat footed and consequently knocked over behind the advantage line by the aggressive Sydney defence. Both sides were also undone with inaccurate work at the breakdowns, and cut out passes that simply allowed the defence to easily drift to follow the ball.
On the back of their stoic defence, and their ability to score from the half chances they created, Sydney Juniors deserved their comfortable victory in the Bronze Medal Match.
Significant Contributing Players:
Sydney Juniors: #12 J Hawkins, #5 E Faatui, #8 C King, #3 W McRae
Queensland Whites: #8 C McKenzie, #21 J Lenac, #13 D Riley
*******************************
Tournament Comments:
Once again the local folk are left wondering if Schools or Juniors were the “better” team. To borrow from a Brian Westlake anecdote on the Scholarship thread, I overheard two Rugby Mums debriefing their sons on their teams performance today.
The Sydney Juniors Mum said “Don’t worry son, even though you didn’t make the final, you got closer to the Reds than the Schools were, and you flogged the Whites, so Juniors are the best team”.
Elsewhere, the NSW Schools Mum was overheard saying “We made it to the final and beat the White team by more that the Juniors did, and we didn’t have {names omitted}, so you guys are the best NSW team.”
We will never know.
It felt like 2012 deja vue all again as Reds ran up their tally against the schools, but the deja vue Fairy didn't give us the second half turn around that we saw last year.
The Reds were a very complete and very physical team, and were on a level above the Juniors, Whites, and Schools. If anything I was disappointed with the quality of the Whites this year.
The last 2 years there has been little between Juniors and Schools, and last year there was not all that marked a gap between Red and White. This year Whites were clearly a level below Juniors and Schools, with Pool B being the pool of Death.
Change is definately in the air.
Tahspark
Ted Thorn (20)
Thanks Huge for the match report. Sydney's 2nd try scorer was #11 L. Hughes after #15 Hurley attracted a number of defenders & then off loaded.
A repeat of yesterday's resolute defence and composure by Sydney on Tuesday might've seen them push the Qld Reds further. However, on their showing in yesterday's final there is an impression that the Reds were capable of finding another gear.
A repeat of yesterday's resolute defence and composure by Sydney on Tuesday might've seen them push the Qld Reds further. However, on their showing in yesterday's final there is an impression that the Reds were capable of finding another gear.
Wood Rat
Alfred Walker (16)
Extrapolating that one team would have found another gear after Tuesday's game and not the other?
players lost up to 5 an six litres on the Tuesday, no-one is going to be performing at their peak in those circumstances.
Hinge factors and butterfly wings all feed back into 'what ifs'
throw in some magic thinking and karma the possibilities are endless
what was notable in the Tuesday game was the changes in body language of the teams as the flow of the game changed and opportunities missed by Sydney started to weigh on that team. Conversely the reds were running on confidence building on itself and right options working and found more energy.
Qld Red won because the won the two finals: Tuesday's dour struggle against a strong forwards driven team (that didn't take their opportunities) to win the stronger pool
and Friday's Cup match that I will politely refrain from commenting on any further
players lost up to 5 an six litres on the Tuesday, no-one is going to be performing at their peak in those circumstances.
Hinge factors and butterfly wings all feed back into 'what ifs'
throw in some magic thinking and karma the possibilities are endless
what was notable in the Tuesday game was the changes in body language of the teams as the flow of the game changed and opportunities missed by Sydney started to weigh on that team. Conversely the reds were running on confidence building on itself and right options working and found more energy.
Qld Red won because the won the two finals: Tuesday's dour struggle against a strong forwards driven team (that didn't take their opportunities) to win the stronger pool
and Friday's Cup match that I will politely refrain from commenting on any further
The Spectator
Herbert Moran (7)
Agree with Mr Wood Rat entirely. Having watched both games, the Sydney forwards contained Reds in the first half something the Schools pack didn't do in either half. Problem resolved if a 1 team was selected. Will have to wait to 2014/2015.
Jim Belshaw
Bob Loudon (25)
May I ask for some help? I am interested in the national indigenous side because of the Northern NSW/TAS connection. Can anybody give me a short overview of their results (I have seen some very unbalanced scores)plus a link to the full results for all?
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
DIVISION 2
MATCH DAY 2 October 1st, 2013
National Indigenous 115 d Tasmania 3
South Australia 50 d Northern Territory 7
MATCH DAY 3 October 3rd, 2013
South Australia 65 d Tasmania 0
National Indigenous 62 d Northern Territory 0
MATCH DAY 4 October 4th, 2013
Northern Territory 38 d Tasmania 12
National Indigenous 33 d South Australia 14
@Jim Belshaw, If I can find the programme, I'll post the National Indigenous Team List in their jumper number order for you, if someone else doesn't beat me to it.
Link to official results here:http://myrugby.rugby.com.au/myrugby/competitions/external/drawresult.asp?comp=9963&OrgID=000001
MATCH DAY 2 October 1st, 2013
National Indigenous 115 d Tasmania 3
South Australia 50 d Northern Territory 7
MATCH DAY 3 October 3rd, 2013
South Australia 65 d Tasmania 0
National Indigenous 62 d Northern Territory 0
MATCH DAY 4 October 4th, 2013
Northern Territory 38 d Tasmania 12
National Indigenous 33 d South Australia 14
@Jim Belshaw, If I can find the programme, I'll post the National Indigenous Team List in their jumper number order for you, if someone else doesn't beat me to it.
Link to official results here:http://myrugby.rugby.com.au/myrugby/competitions/external/drawresult.asp?comp=9963&OrgID=000001
Jim Belshaw
Bob Loudon (25)
Hugh Jarse
Rocky Elsom (76)
NATIONAL INDIGENOUS U16 TEAM 2013
1. Etahn SCHOBER O'Loghlin Catholic College
2. Brandon LUTA Townsville State High
3. Cody WALKER Maclean High
4. Kurtis LANGDON Hunter River High
5. Rennurl DEMPSEY Abergowie
6. Trey BINGARAPE Smithfield State High
7. Dylan PIETSCH The Kings School
8. Liam KELLY-WYNN Jetty High Coffs Harbour
9. Dylan CHOWN Farrer Memorial High
10. Jakobi ROBINSON St Mary's Cassino
11. Matthew GIBUMA Bently Park
12. Kalab COVENTRY Kurwin High
13. Ngangarra BARKER Hunter River High
14. Keith DOI
15. Buddy MUMBULLA The Armidale School
16. Jayden HARRADINE The Armidale School
17. Jesse THOMPSON Kooringal High School
18. Jarrod MABO St Brennans College
19. Bayley FAULL St Ignatius Riverview
20. Tre MENUIER Thornlie Senior High
21. Kieran FORD Brewarrina Central School
22. Luke ROBERTS Maclean High
23. Jesse HOCKNEY Centralian Senior College
Coach Tony BISHOP
Asst Coach Anthony DONOVAN
Manager Derek KINCILLA
Physio Tim CROFT
1. Etahn SCHOBER O'Loghlin Catholic College
2. Brandon LUTA Townsville State High
3. Cody WALKER Maclean High
4. Kurtis LANGDON Hunter River High
5. Rennurl DEMPSEY Abergowie
6. Trey BINGARAPE Smithfield State High
7. Dylan PIETSCH The Kings School
8. Liam KELLY-WYNN Jetty High Coffs Harbour
9. Dylan CHOWN Farrer Memorial High
10. Jakobi ROBINSON St Mary's Cassino
11. Matthew GIBUMA Bently Park
12. Kalab COVENTRY Kurwin High
13. Ngangarra BARKER Hunter River High
14. Keith DOI
15. Buddy MUMBULLA The Armidale School
16. Jayden HARRADINE The Armidale School
17. Jesse THOMPSON Kooringal High School
18. Jarrod MABO St Brennans College
19. Bayley FAULL St Ignatius Riverview
20. Tre MENUIER Thornlie Senior High
21. Kieran FORD Brewarrina Central School
22. Luke ROBERTS Maclean High
23. Jesse HOCKNEY Centralian Senior College
Coach Tony BISHOP
Asst Coach Anthony DONOVAN
Manager Derek KINCILLA
Physio Tim CROFT
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