Melbourne Rebels 2024

[JRugby2]

Is it? Super 12 did just fine without Melbourne. AFL owns that city, end of

Super 12 last existed 20 years ago, worlds changed a bit since then.

It's a fair argument to make that having a presence in a densely populated area is a reasonable move to make to scale up any business honestly.

 

[oztimmay]

OK, how are the Rebels funding this?

This is a big dog legal stoush, these cases pay for holiday houses and private school fees for years to come

MRRU directors calling in a lot of favours. Think the KC is doing this pro-bono.
RA - probably from the money we pay them to run the game.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Super 12 last existed 20 years ago, worlds changed a bit since then.

It's a fair argument to make that having a presence in a densely populated area is a reasonable move to make to scale up any business honestly.

It is, but only if you see genuine gains to the business. The player development has been fantastic and really the only positive but the cost of said development probably outweighs it when Rugby don't have the capacity to absorb the hit like the AFL can with GWS...

 

[Rebel man]

RA aren't the corporate regulator. I'm not sure what proving RA knew about the Rebels financial state would really achieve aside from indicating that perhaps RA should have led the charge to get the Rebels wound up?!?

I also don't see how the Rebels directors can really run this argument. Making an admission of criminal guilt (trading while insolvent) as your opening salvo doesn't seem like a good position to take.

By proving they had knowledge of what was going on. If they were indeed pushing them to keep the lights on saying that they will bail them out with the PE money they are complicit

 

[Rebel man]

I’ve said a number of times that I really sympathise with guys like Rebel Man who clearly have a deep love for the Rebels. But the reality is no matter the outcome of this court case:

- the Rebels aren’t coming back to super rugby
- the Rebels directors just want some $$$ to offset their debts
- rugby fans get caught in more bullshit that ends up hurting our bottom line and engagement

RA as an organisation, particularly the previous administration, were pretty crap. But this court case doesn’t solve anything about the future of rugby.

If the allegations are true RA has to be held to account. If it hurts the game in Sydney who cares?

 

[PhilClinton]

By proving they had knowledge of what was going on. If they were indeed pushing them to keep the lights on saying that they will bail them out with the PE money they are complicit

RA are a lot of things, but I’m not sure even they would go around telling one of their franchises to continue trading whilst insolvent for several years in the hope of a bail out.

If that is somehow proven, it’s essentially cause to wind up the entire organisation.

 

[Rebel man]

Super 12 last existed 20 years ago, worlds changed a bit since then.

It's a fair argument to make that having a presence in a densely populated area is a reasonable move to make to scale up any business honestly.

They started out with 20k crowds each week. But unlike the Suns or Giants we were not given any support from the governing body. Where the AFL helped the Suns land Gary Ablett the rebels were banned from recruiting out of NSW or Queensland initially. There were always road blocks to stop us from challenging the traditional states.

 

[Rebel man]

RA are a lot of things, but I’m not sure even they would go around telling one of their franchises to continue trading whilst insolvent for several years in the hope of a bail out.

If that is somehow proven, it’s essentially cause to wind up the entire organisation.

Well it is the belief of the directors that there is direct evidence to the contrary

 

[PhilClinton]

Well it is the belief of the directors that there is direct evidence to the contrary

Yep, the same directors who ran the team illegally for years and now have big debts to pay.

I think I am done commenting on this subject. I appreciate you are upset but if you can’t see the truth behind this entire case and what the real outcome is, you have some blinkers on.

There is no outcome here for rebels fans that will help the game in Victoria. Those directors are looking for a pay day and you will never hear from them again.

 

[Alex Sharpe]

If the allegations are true RA has to be held to account. If it hurts the game in Sydney who cares?

It will hurt the game across the whole country, and a lot of people will care.

This lawsuit will mean less money for rugby marketing. Less money for infrastructure that gets kids playing rugby. Less money to keep gun schoolboys in rugby union.

If we want to talk about accountability, the execs in Melbourne should probably have a look in the mirror and realise that the Rebels failings were largely self inflicted. If they had achieved anything on the field or attracted people to go to some games, then RA isn't as big a part of the conversation.

Initiating a lawsuit of this nature seems to me to be basic pettiness from some suits who don't care about rugby union and probably want to see the game collapse out of spite.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

They started out with 20k crowds each week. But unlike the Suns or Giants we were not given any support from the governing body. Where the AFL helped the Suns land Gary Ablett the rebels were banned from recruiting out of NSW or Queensland initially. There were always road blocks to stop us from challenging the traditional states.

?

 

[Rebel man]

Yep, the same directors who ran the team illegally for years and now have big debts to pay.

I think I am done commenting on this subject. I appreciate you are upset but if you can’t see the truth behind this entire case and what the real outcome is, you have some blinkers on.

There is no outcome here for rebels fans that will help the game in Victoria. Those directors are looking for a pay day and you will never hear from them again.

You have made up your mind fine RA is sending the game broke in every state yet their governance is fine.

 

[Rebel man]

?

When they were launched there were restrictions in place about where they could recruit from.

Whereas the AFL gave the new clubs priority access to the best young talent and facilitated them being able to sign the biggest names in the game.

 

[JRugby2]

It is, but only if you see genuine gains to the business. The player development has been fantastic and really the only positive but the cost of said development probably outweighs it when Rugby don't have the capacity to absorb the hit like the AFL can with GWS...

I would suspect that most sporting organisations would look at an area that has a global reputation for being sports mad and be able to make the claim that there would be a half decent business case - even if there is saturation by the AFL.

Point I'm trying to make is arguing that the Super 12 was good without Melbourne and the others between 1996-2005 and the city loves AFL, therefore Melbourne isn't an important market for Rugby is deeply flawed and ignores a lot of additional realities (eg: the city makes up nearly 20% of the total population of the country, has a higher percentages of disposable income vs other areas of the country, people can support multiple teams across different codes, etc etc).

Run the business well and it's a good place to be.

 

[Mick The Munch]

Is it? Super 12 did just fine without Melbourne. AFL owns that city, end of

Could've said Union owns Sydney then AFL moved in

 

[Rebel man]

It will hurt the game across the whole country, and a lot of people will care.

This lawsuit will mean less money for rugby marketing. Less money for infrastructure that gets kids playing rugby. Less money to keep gun schoolboys in rugby union.

If we want to talk about accountability, the execs in Melbourne should probably have a look in the mirror and realise that the Rebels failings were largely self inflicted. If they had achieved anything on the field or attracted people to go to some games, then RA isn't as big a part of the conversation.

Initiating a lawsuit of this nature seems to me to be basic pettiness from some suits who don't care about rugby union and probably want to see the game collapse out of spite.

As the old saying goes if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear.

So the Rebels are wrong to challenge as you believe their issues were self inflicted and RA is in a mess because of their own? Yet the reason RA is in a mess is because of their own poor management. The issue needs to go to court so we can get some answers once and for all. It is easy to say “it’s just the rebels fault get rid of them and we will be fine” yet I feel the issues run a lot deeper

Also the game is going to die here anyway especially with this administration. No team can post a profit so if they all lose money year on year, how are they going to survive long term?

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

I would suspect that most sporting organisations would look at an area that has a global reputation for being sports mad and be able to make the claim that there would be a half decent business case - even if there is saturation by the AFL.

Point I'm trying to make is arguing that the Super 12 was good without Melbourne and the others between 1996-2005 and the city loves AFL, therefore Melbourne isn't an important market for Rugby is deeply flawed and ignores a lot of additional realities (eg: the city makes up nearly 20% of the total population of the country, has a higher percentages of disposable income vs other areas of the country, people can support multiple teams across different codes, etc etc).

Run the business well and it's a good place to be.

I agree with you and I think it comes down to your last sentence which would have impact on my first.

 

[Rebel man]

I would suspect that most sporting organisations would look at an area that has a global reputation for being sports mad and be able to make the claim that there would be a half decent business case - even if there is saturation by the AFL.

Point I'm trying to make is arguing that the Super 12 was good without Melbourne and the others between 1996-2005 and the city loves AFL, therefore Melbourne isn't an important market for Rugby is deeply flawed and ignores a lot of additional realities (eg: the city makes up nearly 20% of the total population of the country, has a higher percentages of disposable income vs other areas of the country, people can support multiple teams across different codes, etc etc).

Run the business well and it's a good place to be.

Also is home to plenty of islanders, kiwis and Saffers as a kid years back pre rebels I played both Aussie rules and rugby and all the islanders Kiwis and Saffers would jokingly hang shit on me for playing GAYFL.

Part of the issue with launching a new side in super rugby though most of the fans were Kiwi or South African and their teams still competed in Super Rugby

 

[Slim 293]

When they were launched there were restrictions in place about where they could recruit from.

Whereas the AFL gave the new clubs priority access to the best young talent and facilitated them being able to sign the biggest names in the game.

 

[hoggy]

The whole issue I have with this is the lack of reflection or learnings from the Rebels saga, as long as a villain is found and blamed then great we just move on and nothing changes.
The whole Rebels fiasco was like entering a mini in a formula one race and guess what losing. But then just year after year entering the same car.

There seems to be no desire to learn anything from this, so how does rugby moving forward when the game seems determined to just keep repeating the same mistakes.