Melbourne Rebels 2024

[WorkingClassRugger]

Because they were given the annual participation grant. The only point they state where the debt level was at was that it was 18m in 2022. Also 35m over that time span hardly even covers the salary cap then there are all the other expenses.

Which means the mismanagement has been present for a long damn time. And how have the other franchises managed to not run up similar debts? They have the same funding and would also have operational costs. Yet even the Tahs with who many tried to use as an example of a club having similar debts (which as it turned out they didn't) being bailed at the expense of the Rebels have not?

The more I see these posts the more it reminds me of people I've known who were in abusive/codependent relationships. It's never the abuser fault. It's everyone else.

 

[Rebel man]

We know they have been trading insolvent since 2018

No they administrators said they were likely insolvent from 31/012/2018. So while it is probable it’s not known as fact when they became insolvent

 

[Rebel man]

Which means the mismanagement has been present for a long damn time. And how have the other franchises managed to not run up similar debts? They have the same funding and would also have operational costs. Yet even the Tahs with who many tried to use as an example of a club having similar debts (which as it turned out they didn't) being bailed at the expense of the Rebels have not?

The more I see these posts the more it reminds me of people I've known who were in abusive/codependent relationships. It's never the abuser fault. It's everyone else.

So two clubs were forced to leave their home state and relocate to Sydney for months on end to keep the game afloat. While we know Twiggy covered the cost for the Force where did the money come from for the rebels?

Would you feel it is right or just if the club was left to foot that bill? BTW I am just seeking clarity on what the cost was and who paid it.

 

[Rebel man]

If Super Rugby is dead, it's because the Rebels killed it LOL

Yeah the rebels are why the stadiums in NZ are empty in games that the Rebels are not a part of. Makes sense

 

[Dctarget]

Which means the mismanagement has been present for a long damn time. And how have the other franchises managed to not run up similar debts? They have the same funding and would also have operational costs.

Like, the Rebels admin are fuckwits but we know they don't have the same funding. 'Tahs, Brumbies and Reds all have had better sponsorship deals and ticket sales.

 

[Tomthumb]

Like, the Rebels admin are fuckwits but we know they don't have the same funding. 'Tahs, Brumbies and Reds all have had better sponsorship deals and ticket sales.

That’s completely on the Rebels

 

[fatprop]

I would love to know how you accumulate an $11,000,000 debt to the tax office without hell being unleashed by them

 

[Dctarget]

That’s completely on the Rebels

Yeah no shit. I'm not saying it isn't. I'm not even trying to defend these guys. They should've wrapped it up years ago and not traded insolvent, they're idiots.

Melbourne, with RA's and Super's available funding, is not a viable place for a professional rugby team.

 

[Wallaby Man]

Which means the mismanagement has been present for a long damn time. And how have the other franchises managed to not run up similar debts? They have the same funding and would also have operational costs. Yet even the Tahs with who many tried to use as an example of a club having similar debts (which as it turned out they didn't) being bailed at the expense of the Rebels have not?

The more I see these posts the more it reminds me of people I've known who were in abusive/codependent relationships. It's never the abuser fault. It's everyone else.

This is the part I think people should be pointing the finger at RA and saying that’s just not good enough. Where is the good due diligence and checks and balances of the entities that they fund or participate in a competition they help run. In France every team has to show they are debt free every season otherwise they are relegated. Rugby Victoria is an affiliate sub agency of Rugby Australia. They had control of the Rebels license. I think this is where RA might find some pain and potentially could be liable to some level. Financial mismanagement via having poor financial checks and balances. This is going to be very ugly.

Rebels board members should be cooked because they still spent money not there, despite RAs ineptitude to control the entities they fund.

 

[SouthernX]

So two clubs were forced to leave their home state and relocate to Sydney for months on end to keep the game afloat. While we know Twiggy covered the cost for the Force where did the money come from for the rebels?

Would you feel it is right or just if the club was left to foot that bill? BTW I am just seeking clarity on what the cost was and who paid it.

did the rebels claim the scomo covid jobseeker payments out of curiosity.

I’m sure it would of helped but covid messed up a lot of businesses and it does truely suck if RA wasn’t there to assist with this spanner in works

 

[Dctarget]

This is the part I think people should be pointing the finger at RA and saying that’s just not good enough. Where is the good due diligence and checks and balances of the entities that they fund or participate in a competition they help run. In France every team has to show they are debt free every season otherwise they are relegated. Rugby Victoria is an affiliate sub agency of Rugby Australia. They had control of the Rebels license. I think this is where RA might find some pain and potentially could be liable to some level. Financial mismanagement via having poor financial checks and balances. This is going to be very ugly.

Yeah coupled with their verbal agreement for a million bucks with France last year doesn't paint these guys as the most financially astute.

 

[Rebel man]

did the rebels claim the scomo covid jobseeker payments out of curiosity.

I’m sure it would of helped but covid messed up a lot of businesses and it does truely suck if RA wasn’t there to assist with this spanner in works

They got jobseeker for the players and staff when the comp was suspended

 

[Bullrush]

Yeah the rebels are why the stadiums in NZ are empty in games that the Rebels are not a part of. Makes sense

The same way RA are why the Rebels couldn't put a winning team out for 14 years...LOL

 

[Strewthcobber]

Because they were given the annual participation grant. The only point they state where the debt level was at was that it was 18m in 2022. Also 35m over that time span hardly even covers the salary cap then there are all the other expenses.

Debt level was above $10m in 2020, and increased by $4m to $5m each year after that because the Rebels revenue was nowhere near their expenses. This is all in the administrators report

We have to do our own maths as to how the debt level got from $0 in 2018 to $10m in 2020

 

[Dan54]

Super Rugby is a dead concept

So why are Rebels trying to get license back? And why aren't Rebels supporters applauding getting out?

 

[Strewthcobber]

This is the part I think people should be pointing the finger at RA and saying that’s just not good enough. Where is the good due diligence and checks and balances of the entities that they fund or participate in a competition they help run. In France every team has to show they are debt free every season otherwise they are relegated. Rugby Victoria is an affiliate sub agency of Rugby Australia. They had control of the Rebels license. I think this is where RA might find some pain and potentially could be liable to some level. Financial mismanagement via having poor financial checks and balances. This is going to be very ugly.

Rebels board members should be cooked because they still spent money not there, despite RAs ineptitude to control the entities they fund.

This misunderstands the role VRU and MRRU have with RA. They are not-sub to them, it's the other way around. They were voting members of RA and get a say at AGMs and EGMs. They can vote to remove the RA board or chair - RA represents their members

RA has no say in how VRU or MRRU is run

 

[PhilClinton]

They had control of the Rebels license. I think this is where RA might find some pain and potentially could be liable to some level. Financial mismanagement via having poor financial checks and balances. This is going to be very ugly.

Rebels board members should be cooked because they still spent money not there, despite RAs ineptitude to control the entities they fund.

I could be wrong but didn't they only take control of the licence after the MRRU were officially insolvent?

Prior to that isn't the relationship more akin to a parent (RA) and their adult child? They can enquire about how they're going but there wasn't anything that specifically said they needed to be checking how much money was in the bank? And just like a parent they felt obligated to bail them out when they got into financial strife.

 

[Strewthcobber]

I could be wrong but didn't they only take control of the licence after the MRRU were officially insolvent?

Prior to that isn't the relationship more akin to a parent (RA) and their adult child? They can enquire about how they're going but there wasn't anything that specifically said they needed to be checking how much money was in the bank? And just like a parent they felt obligated to bail them out when they got into financial strife.

Once the license is granted it can't be taken back, unless the member gives it back (the Force did this in return for $$$ for their IP), or call in an administrator (which happened to Rebels)

As per above, VRU and MRRU were (are) voting members of RA. They have a say in how RA is run and the RA board is accountable to it's members, not the other way around

 

[Wallaby Man]

I could be wrong but didn't they only take control of the licence after the MRRU were officially insolvent?

Prior to that isn't the relationship more akin to a parent (RA) and their adult child? They can enquire about how they're going but there wasn't anything that specifically said they needed to be checking how much money was in the bank? And just like a parent they felt obligated to bail them out when they got into financial strife.

They are all entwined which makes it very grey. RA clearly hold the financial levers as they negotiate on behalf of their members for broadcast deals, they also dictate how much return is distributed to their stakeholders via these negotiations etc. if we remember back to Covid with twiggy trying to get rapid rugby up and running, he required RA sanctioning to do anything rugby related in the country. They are co-signees to all professional contracts, it’s why they can veto players for bad behavior etc. they have their hands over most decisions therefore could be held co responsible for decisions made.

The way the hole ecosystem is set up, they have kinda made themselves regulators for the game. This case is going to be damning on all sides and genuinely could change everything in how the game is run.

I’m not sure if they can completely wash their hands of this by just saying they were blissfully unaware and all parties work completely autonomously from their influence, despite it clearly not been the case as they control so much of what the states can and cannot do.

 

[Strewthcobber]

The way the hole ecosystem is set up, they have kinda made themselves regulators for the game.

If they are this, it's because their members have made them this (members include VRU and MRRU)