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Matt Giteau

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Train Without a Station

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Having seen most of those players in the Top 14 this year I can safely say that Gitaeu's play is light years better than any of them.

Who is Elsom playing for now? Last think I remember is he got injured in Toulon and came home?

More so I was referring to Rocky dominating in Ireland in HC and never replicating that form on return.

As noted below, Salvi is considered the best 7 in the premiership, yet was overtaken by Colby and Hooper within a matter of rounds at the brumbies.

"Career" best form in Europe needs to be taken with a grain of salt as it's fair to say there's more examples of players that have failed to replicate it on return, or show it before departure, than there are which have. Doesn't mean some players aren't performing well, just needs to be considered for what it is.
 

Blake

Ted Fahey (11)
I don't think the rule will change anytime soon and I don't think a player who left Australia because he wasn't good enough to make the wallabies will influence it much.
 

Sir Arthur Higgins

Dick Tooth (41)
Agree. I haven't watched a lot of French rugby as when I do watch it I find the game very slow and lacking flair / attacking intent. That said I can't help but recall how immensely useless and predictable giteau was in his last couple years here. He was like kurtle Beale on steroids when it came to crabbing.
I have a lot of respect for deans rugby brain and I think he was spot on. Gits was figured out at the top level.
And maybe he has changes and is playing better but I do agree with Spiro a bit.
Same with Mitchell. He was devastating until his ankle injuries and then he was not quite up to it but got into wallabies on rep and effort - certainly no longer on pace and power.
The policy will get a review if a player like genia goes and Aus rugby finds itself with no back up. When exposed and a key player is available but offshore then they will have a look
 
P

Paradox

Guest
Wow. Giteau must be the first player to leave Australia playing averagely and shine in Europe.

Name the others that have performed as well. I'll give Elsom as one (was in career best form when he left Oz). Please don't mention Maafu or Salvi etc as they just not in the same league.
 

Bardon

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Agree. I haven't watched a lot of French rugby as when I do watch it I find the game very slow and lacking flair / attacking intent. That said I can't help but recall how immensely useless and predictable giteau was in his last couple years here. He was like kurtle Beale on steroids when it came to crabbing.
I have a lot of respect for deans rugby brain and I think he was spot on. Gits was figured out at the top level.
And maybe he has changes and is playing better but I do agree with Spiro a bit.
Same with Mitchell. He was devastating until his ankle injuries and then he was not quite up to it but got into wallabies on rep and effort - certainly no longer on pace and power.
The policy will get a review if a player like genia goes and Aus rugby finds itself with no back up. When exposed and a key player is available but offshore then they will have a look

It's more likely that if Genia went that people would remember how inconsistent he's been in the past few seasons. I don't think it would matter if he moved, rediscovered his form and actually improved as a player in Europe.

There just aren't enough of the SH public/press that pay attention to European rugby for a player's form in Europe to sway opinion. That's something that's a problem in both hemispheres especially with Rugby pundits who you'd expect to be a little better informed than the bulk of us.

Unfortunately it's quite clear that most pundits watch hardly any rugby from the opposite hemisphere. Sky Sports aren't so bad as their pundits jump between covering Super Rugby, ITM, CC & European rugby.

But many pundits seem to think that time freezes between international windows and have no idea of players form coming into a test window. This is very obvious when a player "comes from no where" to impress on their debut tour even though they've been playing the same all season for their club.

I don't see that changing anytime soon.
 
P

Paradox

Guest
People keep saying French rugby is shit but Giteau and co just won the Heineken Cup (again). Are you really saying you think European rugby is shit?

Train at a station, your argument is completely hollow concerning Elsom (and generally). He crocked himself over there. He was simply outstanding at the highest level (see Heineken Cup final for a start). Someone like Edmonds was a solid operator - never in the Giteau/Elsom league here or over there. I suspect you are just anti-Giteau.
 
T

Train Without a Station

Guest
Name the others that have performed as well. I'll give Elsom as one (was in career best form when he left Oz). Please don't mention Maafu or Salvi etc as they just not in the same league.

Well of course I can't name anybody who has fucking performed if you tell me I can't mention the players that have.

Julian Salvi is the perfect example. He is considered the best 7 in the Aviva premiership. He was considered the 3rd best 7 at the brumbies in 2011.
 

Sir Arthur Higgins

Dick Tooth (41)
It's more likely that if Genia went that people would remember how inconsistent he's been in the past few seasons. I don't think it would matter if he moved, rediscovered his form and actually improved as a player in Europe.
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Definitely agree with all your boat but would add the timezone helps to prevent anyone watching. For the UK our games are broadly at 8am - noon so they can at least watch them live. For us, their games are at a god awful hour and one can wake up and read an excellent station of the game rather than watch it - and since the UK winter in particular leads to more wet and often slower games (general I know) it's often a better use of your time to read the article. So I don't think time difference should be discounted but I agree with your point in general.
I don't watch euro rugby often and maybe it's just bad luck but every time I do the game is slower and there is less action and a lot more errors than the top 8-10 teams in super rugby. Granted you can watch a rebels game and see mistakes like that
 

Pfitzy

Nathan Sharpe (72)
Funnily enough, today on FTA they played ENG v AUS from the EOYT 2009. Giteau was crabby, but the Pommy commentators were blowing a load over it. Then again, compared to the no-names in white, he looked like a super star.

Always a better 12 than a 10.
 

Sir Arthur Higgins

Dick Tooth (41)
People keep saying French rugby is shit but Giteau and co just won the Heineken Cup (again). Are you really saying you think European rugby is shit?

Train at a station, your argument is completely hollow concerning Elsom (and generally). He crocked himself over there. He was simply outstanding at the highest level (see Heineken Cup final for a start). Someone like Edmonds was a solid operator - never in the Giteau/Elsom league here or over there. I suspect you are just anti-Giteau.
I think euro rugby is worse than super rugby and I am from the north.
There is a reason why Aus SA and NZ are consistently better than all teams in the north. The players are better. In SA and Aus this would on average be 2 XV from each country that would either bear or go the distance against the first XV from each NH team.
Add in top class islanders and I just think the standard is better. Granted France is improving but I think the depth in top club teams is shallow.
Full strength and firing crusaders would bear Toulon handily based on the Heineken and top 14 finals. Ditto Tahs, sharks and I would say hurricanes as well.
 

qwerty51

Stirling Mortlock (74)
Reports were filtering through GAGR that Dean Mumm was killing it in the UK.
He was at best a pop gun lock when he left Oz after countless opportunities to impress at Super and Test level.

Mainly because his style of plays suits Exeter perfectly.
 

KevinO

Geoff Shaw (53)
Name the others that have performed as well. I'll give Elsom as one (was in career best form when he left Oz). Please don't mention Maafu or Salvi etc as they just not in the same league.

Paul Warwick was outstanding at Connacht and than Munster, also got MOTM against the Wallabies when Munster beat them a few years ago.
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
I see that Matt Giteau has been named as Top 14 Player of the year for 2013/14.

Why they make this award when the 2014/15 competition is well underway is weird, but he won it.

My vote would have gone to Steffon Armitage (also from Toulon) who was European Player of the Year - for Heineken Cup performances - with Gits second.

No doubt posters will put crap on Giteau and the Top 14, but he did play well.

It will be interesting to see how he operates as the main flyhalf in big games this season because in the past he was the regular inside centre outside Wilko, who is now retired.
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Harv

Herbert Moran (7)
He was consistently terrific last year and he's made a difference every time he's played this season at 10 (they lost a few when he was sidelined). The most impressive thing about his game these days is his ability to select the right option in attack (kick, pass or take it to the line) and he's absolutely committed to taking it straight to the line and contact when the occasion merits rather than crabbing or looking for a miracle ball, qualities the Wallabies are sadly lacking. Whether he's at 10 or 12 he's got the capacity to lead the team around the paddock. Admittedly he's got a beast of a pack in front of him, but there is no doubt he's improved with age. It won't happen but a Giteau 10 and Beale 12 combination would work for me as long as Kurtley doesn't wear that T-shirt.
 
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