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Is Ballymore the future of QLD Rugby?

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TOCC

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Is Ballymore the future of QLD Rugby

Ballymore, history and tradition reverberate around this ground like few others, walking around the ground it seems like only yesterday that John Eales led the once mighty Reds onto the field, or the Wallabies took on the British Lions in a test so fierce that it earnt the tag the 'battle of ballymore'. Great battles of triumph and despair by both QLD and the Wallabies have been fought on the hallowed ground, yet today the cherished ground faces a new battle, to flourish or fade.

Stands which once held thousands rarely see attendance these days, whilst the Queensland Rugby Union(QRU) will argue the fields are utilised with thousands of patrons visiting the ground annually for tournaments and finals, the realisation is that the majority of these visitors are players and not patrons.

Ballymore has been the heart and soul of Queensland Rugby for the past 50years, the QRU moved to Ballymore in 1966 after receiving the land as a grant from the state government. McLean stand was opened in 1968 followed by the Eastern stand in 1980 giving us the Ballymore Stadium we know today

In 2006 under a $25million grant promised by the Howard Govt Ballymore was to upgraded into a multi-purpose sporting facility and play host to the Australian Rugby Academy. Wine bottles were popped and the pats on the back could be heard echoing down the QRU hallways, quickly the pats turned to whispers of horrors as the newly elected Kevin Rudd and his aptly named razor gang took to reducing govt expenditure, the rugby academy was one of the first projects to be cut.

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Corporate facilites for who?

Regrouping and looking forward, the QRU decided to press with the development application in the hope that the Govt would see the light and change there mind. Queensland Premier, Peter Beattie came to the party and supported a QLD Govt grant of $4.2million to build a 25m pool and minor improvements around the ground, yet this ray of hope has again turned to despair as the QLD Crime and Misconduct Commission(CMC) conduct a ongoing investigation into whether the funds were not utilised for there intended purpose and instead partly siphoned out to the UQ Rugby Academy.

A off-season cleanout of the QRU hierarchy has again fuelled rumours that the Ballymore redevelopment plan is again to be reassessed. With the dawning realisation that the QLD Govt will be reluctant to support any more funding for a project which has the cloud of a CMC investigation still hanging. The federal govt remains the last option, but the chances of a back flip from the Kevin Rudd Govt are slim. If a government grant fail to arrive the project would require to be funded by a loan, and whilst this isn’t such a bad thing the unique project outcome is a niche market within Australia and not a proven income winner, something which lingers heavily when funding a project with debt.

A-league side the Brisbane Roar moved to Ballymore at the start of 2009, the female Brisbane Roar side also play there W-League home games at Ballymore, but a financial crisis has had the Roar looking at there options as well, there contract to remain at home in Ballymore expires at the end of 2010 and the QRU will be eager to retain the Roar as they assist to fund the maintenance costs of the facilities.

In the next few months the QRU should receive approval from the Brisbane City Council for there proposed development application, at which point they will be confronted with the critical question of whether they pursue the project. It has the potential to revitalise Ballymore and secure a additional income stream for the QRU, however it also has the potential to be a financial burden which sends the QRU bankrupt.

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what it could be

Whilst there is a historical attachment between rugby union and ballymore, one has to wonder whether alternatives have been considered. One such idea might be to search for a new home, to find a blank canvas and start new, sell the Ballymore land to a private developer or back to the govt and use the money to fund a new facility. Ballymore could be valued at $30million generously, planning legislation is the one thing holding back the value of the land but the govt may be eager to assist in this area, by providing funding for a new multi-purpose sporting facility and turning Ballymore into a community park with parts sold off to a private developer.

One option is to head out to the land abundant Brisbane Airport who are always eager to diversify there income stream, build a new multi-purpose sporting facility, a project which includes a boutique 15'000 seat stadium, 2 training fields, a gym, pool, accommodation, administration buildings and sport science precinct. Brisbane Roar become co-tenants, the Wallabies, Maroons and Socceroos can rent the facilities when in town and visiting AFL/NRL clubs can rent the facilities when in Brisbane.

Whilst its easy to float such a idea i understand there are incredibly difficult logistics behind it, as well as the negative reaction from fans and stakeholders who hold a ideological nostalgic attachment to Ballymore. It might just be that we need to accept that Ballymore isn’t the best option anymore, geographically it’s in an isolated area amongst a suburban neighbourhood, Public Transport nodes are restricted and makes it difficult to reach, the stadium is growing older and the maintenance costs are only going to increase. Whilst I would love to see Ballymore become the proposed multi purpose facility the QRU want it to be, it’s just questionable as to whether the QRU has the power to make it happen.

Yet 2010 however sees a fresh change blow through Ballymore, on the 10th Feb 2010 Ballymore will play host to a historical match with the likes of Lockyer, Folau, Campese and Hodges as the Canberra Raiders take on the Brisbane Broncos. 17 days later the QLD Reds play host to the Auckland Blues in the first Super14 match hosted at Ballymore since 2005, the Ballymore Cup brings dozens of schools from around the state to play each other.

Jim Carmichael the new Chief Executive comes from a AFL background with no strings attached, he has already expressed that Ballymore sits on a knife edge, and the new 2010 QRU wont shirk the responsibility of searching for new income streams for Ballymore whilst assessing the master plan at hand.

One things for certain, with 2008 and 2009 the annus horribilis of QLD Rugby, 2010 could well be the annus mirabilis, both on field and off field there hasn’t been such a important year in QLD Rugby's history, prevent a player exodus and secure the future of Ballymore.

TOCC
 
C

chief

Guest
The Northern Busway is a 15 minute walk away from Ballymore, it really isn't too far. I think the location is fantastic, but I think the governments both State and Federal's approach to Rugby Union as a whole seriously needs to be reassessed. Understandably they are placing faith in Soccer, with winning a World Cup bid. But Rugby is one of the biggest International Team sports that is professional. In fact the Rugby World Cup is the 3rd biggest sporting event in the world, you would think that more attention would be payed to it. Developing future players for the Wallabies. The current Governments are out there giving dollars to League and cents to Union, and it dissapoints a lot of us Union followers, that Rugby is the original game, yet they seem to want to bring the League Grand Final to Brisbane rah rah rah, pay more attention to the original code, willing to fund League centres, yet deciding against funding of the Union rugby centres.

QLD Rugby probably has the best player development system just not the best retention system in Australia. Creating the likes of players like Quade Cooper, David Pocock, Richard Kingi to name a few. a National Rugby Academy in Brisbane at Ballymore would attract a lot of League players to the game particularly at the GPS and AIC Private schools.

Ballymore's 30 Million dollar upgrade could allow Pacific Island rugby to be played over here. Games like Fiji verses Tonga, which they could stay on sight, play a game with a crowd of at least 10,000 paying patrons. The majority of the Fijian and Tongan community would attend. Even having an Papua New Guinea Rugby game there with a team like Samoa belting the crap out of them would attract a decent crowd, with both communities happily making the trek to the game.

Ballymore could certainly be upgraded to a World Class Sporting Venue. There is a park for Hockey near by which is huge, and is barely used. Hell you could chuck an Athletics Field there, and make it a bloody Sporting Academy, with accommodation for Athletes. It doesn't necessarily have to be solely owned by the QRU either. An upgrade can only do wonders for QLD Sport, and in particular Rugby.

It really takes severe stupidity not to embrace Ballymore as a sporting precinct.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Your right chief the new busway will help in reaching the ground, however its still not ideal, ideal is been positioned next door to either a busway station or train station.

and I dont think there is any denying that funding the upgrade would have benefits, however the same could be said for upgrading any sporting facility.
 

RugbyFuture

Lord Logo
im a new south welshman so i dunno, but maybe divest from ballymore try and gain a bit more cash and then park themselves next to the gabba? it would replicate the successful smoore park precinct in sydney and the melbourne olympic park in victoria
 
C

chief

Guest
Sorry man, not doable, Gabba has limited space as it is. Near the Bowen Hills Railway tracks could be an option for redevelopment
 

RugbyFuture

Lord Logo
chief said:
Sorry man, not doable, Gabba has limited space as it is. Near the Bowen Hills Railway tracks could be an option for redevelopment

im talkin like full on knocking blocks out though, like maybe to the north by the looks of google maps
 

Sully

Tim Horan (67)
Staff member
There would be an uproar! that's inner city residential land. It would be tied up in the courts for years.
 

Lindommer

Simon Poidevin (60)
Staff member
I haven't been to Ballymore for a while, 2002 in fact, but what's happened to that open space across the creek? Finsbury, isn't/wasn't it?, the old GPS ground.
 

rsea

Darby Loudon (17)
Why not develop Ballymore? Everyone complains its hard to get to/park at but the Gabba and Suncorp aren't exactly parking friendly either. Ballymore is less than 2k from the entrance Busway at the Royal so it wouldn't be hard to get fans in and out of the ground. Other than this objection there seems to be no clear reason why you wouldn't develop the site and the DA is now approved, putting it at least 2 years of development ahead of any alternative site.
 
C

chief

Guest
I just have to add as well, the Ballymore playing surface is of a fantastic breed. So good to play on, it certainly is of a world class nature.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Noddy said:
TOCC ! Chuck that post on the Blog mate!
im not actually sure how to

rsea said:
Why not develop Ballymore? Everyone complains its hard to get to/park at but the Gabba and Suncorp aren't exactly parking friendly either. Ballymore is less than 2k from the entrance Busway at the Royal so it wouldn't be hard to get fans in and out of the ground. Other than this objection there seems to be no clear reason why you wouldn't develop the site and the DA is now approved, putting it at least 2 years of development ahead of any alternative site.
Its not about parking rsea, a major factor which gets looked at these days is the proximity to a public transport node, Suncorp has 2 train stations and a underground bus depot, the gabba has a busway station on the SE Busway network. Whilst your correct that the Royal Busway Station is under 2km away from Ballymore its not close enough for people to walk they will still have to run busses, running a hundred busses through suburban back streets isnt real high on the govt agenda.

Also the DA hasnt been approved, the DA has in fact had hundreds of people lodge complaints in regards to it. Many of the local community believe that it shouldnt be developed as the land was granted to the QRU under the precedence it would be for sport, there is no confirmation that it will be even be approved.

I think what you are missing in regards to what i said in the article was in regards to funding, if the QRU develop Ballymore they will be burdened with $50million in debt. If they sell Ballymore back to the govt/developers and buy new land through a deal with the govt they could develop the new project and be debt free as well as having the best facilities in the country.

Wouldnt it be worth waiting a extra 2 years just to be debt free rsea?
 
C

chief

Guest
Ballymore will probably be the QLD Roar's home ground next year. Let's not get rid of it, we should keep it. More money will come from the Roar using it, hopefully they can bring a few more Schoolboy International Rugby games there too, Mid week International games, say when Ireland are touring they could play the Reds there. It is best to keep it where it is with the heritage it has, but redevelop it into something bigger and better.

Australia want the FIFA World Cup in 2018 or 2022, which means Suncorp is unavailable. Reds and Broncos could perhaps play there games there during those 8 weeks. Ballymore and the Gabba are the only stadiums which can be used during that period. Keep it and redevelop it.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
chief said:
Ballymore will probably be the QLD Roar's home ground next year. Let's not get rid of it, we should keep it. More money will come from the Roar using it, hopefully they can bring a few more Schoolboy International Rugby games there too, Mid week International games, say when Ireland are touring they could play the Reds there. It is best to keep it where it is with the heritage it has, but redevelop it into something bigger and better.

Australia want the FIFA World Cup in 2018 or 2022, which means Suncorp is unavailable. Reds and Broncos could perhaps play there games there during those 8 weeks. Ballymore and the Gabba are the only stadiums which can be used during that period. Keep it and redevelop it.

I hope they bring the Roar games to Ballymore as well, but before that happens a few $million needs to be spend upgrading the facilities, particulary the corporate facilities to the required standard. Corporate facilities bring in a large chunk of the revenue, this is why Suncorp Stadium is so good, for the Reds or Roar to move to Ballymore they would be reducing there rental costs but they would also be losing out on quite a substantial amount of money from lack of corporate facilities.

At then end of the day, both teams need to weigh up whether they cheaper rental costs offset the loss in corporate support.
 
C

chief

Guest
TOCC said:
chief said:
Ballymore will probably be the QLD Roar's home ground next year. Let's not get rid of it, we should keep it. More money will come from the Roar using it, hopefully they can bring a few more Schoolboy International Rugby games there too, Mid week International games, say when Ireland are touring they could play the Reds there. It is best to keep it where it is with the heritage it has, but redevelop it into something bigger and better.

Australia want the FIFA World Cup in 2018 or 2022, which means Suncorp is unavailable. Reds and Broncos could perhaps play there games there during those 8 weeks. Ballymore and the Gabba are the only stadiums which can be used during that period. Keep it and redevelop it.

I hope they bring the Roar games to Ballymore as well, but before that happens a few $million needs to be spend upgrading the facilities, particulary the corporate facilities to the required standard. Corporate facilities bring in a large chunk of the revenue, this is why Suncorp Stadium is so good, for the Reds or Roar to move to Ballymore they would be reducing there rental costs but they would also be losing out on quite a substantial amount of money from lack of corporate facilities.

At then end of the day, both teams need to weigh up whether they cheaper rental costs offset the loss in corporate support.

Very good point, for the Reds game there this year, they will have to bring in 2 big screens temporarily. As well as another few food venues near the main entrance.

Found this article on the Brisbane times - http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/rugby-union/reds/rugby-or-rock-stars-20100118-mgly.html
Queensland rugby's new chief has vowed to bring an end to the identity crisis that hangs over Ballymore and revealed anything from Super 14 games to rock concerts could be held at the iconic Brisbane stadium in the future.

The 24,000-capacity former Test venue at Herston remains the home of Queensland rugby, but is also a virtual white elephant, playing host to only the rare top-level match.

It has also missed out on upgrades - like a pool, sports academy and medical centre - that had been envisioned for it as part of a radical revamp, now on the scrapheap.

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Is there life in the white elephant yet?
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The Queensland Reds, who held their season launch at Ballymore yesterday, will play one Super 14 game there this season on February 27 against the Auckland Blues.

But that match has only been scheduled because of an agreement between Football Federation Australia and Suncorp Stadium not to use the Reds' usual home ground for 10 days prior to Australia's Asian Cup football qualifier against Indonesia on March 3.

A permanent move back to Ballymore remains little more than a pipe dream for nostalgic Reds supporters, because of the difficulty of getting to and from the ground on match days, the state of the stadium itself and below-par corporate facilities

However, QRU chief executive officer Jim Carmichael, swiped last year from the AFL as part of an administrative restructure at rugby headquarters, believes Ballymore's future on the elite sporting venue map must be quickly addressed.

"I believe that it's very important in the case of Ballymore, now that we're developing community assets here, to also look at what the Ballymore stadium means to us," he told brisbanetimes.com.au

"When I look at it I see an asset over there that has another life that needs to be considered as well. And that may or may not be the re-development of the stadium.

"We need to be starting to talk to a number of people of expertise around the place immediately."

Using a new-look Ballymore for other purposes like concerts was "not out of the realms of possibility as well", Carmichael said.

The QRU have development applications still before Brisbane City Council concerning an ambitious $100 million upgrade to build a state-of-the-art sports academy and medical centre, refurbish the McLean Stand, construct a third training field as well as a pool.

However, the Rudd Government's decision to back away from a prior promise of $25 million from the Howard Government quashed those plans, which have also been strongly opposed by residents.

Carmichael, a shrewd business mind who has no emotional ties to Ballymore due to his AFL background, says the QRU is now in a period of reassessment about the future of rugby's spiritual home.

"My view is if we don't get this right it will be an absolute tragedy," he said.

"We are reconsidering the master plan...we will look hard at what all the different combinations can be."

He believes a refurbished Ballymore could comfortably co-exist with the city's premier rectangular ground - the 52,000-seat Suncorp Stadium - as a host of elite sport including teams like the Reds and football's Brisbane Roar, whose crowds at Milton have barely reached five figures this season.

"There is an opportunity to have a boutique stadium with a larger venue," said Carmichael.

"It's a different mix of business and it needs long-term planning with government to make sure neither asset is weakened. My view is they need to live together.

"The problem we've had in the past is we've not necessarily known the right way to engage government on these things and in the future that's a very important part of what my role is."

The state of Ballymore on the government radar is not encouraging, though, with the high-profile Crime and Misconduct Commission saga that has scrutinised a $4.2 million State Government grant to the QRU doing the organisation "no favours at all", according to a government source.

The insider told brisbanetimes.com.au that the ground itself was "beyond saving" as a venue for Super 14 matches or even the Roar, whose offices are based there.

"What [those teams] will save in rent they'll miss out on in other areas," the source said.

"It was generally regarded as a great little suburban, boutique venue probably 15 or 20 years ago.

"But it's outgrown its usefulness. I think [that] would be the general perception."

Ballymore's present corporate facilities are not up to scratch and would require significant improvement, the insider argued.

"Over in the eastern stand I think they've got a row of boxes and suites at the back but in the McLean Stand on the western side it's just nothing - it's all the rickety open air stuff.

"When corporates have got used to the facilities at Suncorp Stadium and at the Gabba a step back to facilities of that nature would be an embarrassment to take guests along to."
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Really need to get some of the Ballymore land rezoned to residential, and develop ala the new tennis centre at tennyson. Even if they can only get 3 stories max on 30% of the existing land area, it would take a big sting out of the sporting side upgrade and redevelopment costs, and houses/units around that area would be much sort after.

I would be surprised if the couldn't convince the BCC to change zoning to res B considering its location and proximity to the RBH and city.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
I haven't been to Ballymore for a while, 2002 in fact, but what's happened to that open space across the creek? Finsbury, isn't/wasn't it?, the old GPS ground.

The parks on the north side of the creek are all still there. However most if not all of that land is under 1 in 100 flood level. Actually a lot is probably under 1 in 5 flood level.
 

Pfitzy

Nathan Sharpe (72)
chief said:
The Northern Busway is a 15 minute walk away from Ballymore, it really isn't too far.

Take two kids under 10. Or someone over 50. Or someone on crutches. A 15 minute walk is too far.
 

Jets

Paul McLean (56)
Staff member
I think part of the issue for the government is that they own Suncorp and the Gabba. Why would they want to help out someone to take business away from their assets? Also the local residents are a bit of a pain in the ass. They like to live near a sporting venue where they can use the park land as long as no events take place there. It reminds me of the developments in the Valley when all these people moved there to be close to everything and then started to complain about all the noise. If you move close to a sporting venue expect expect events to take place there.
I like the idea of concerts at Ballymore. They have the space to hold music festivals on the outer fields if they wanted. Also they could look at hosting other things like weekly markets.
Finally I think that the Roar have to move their games away from Suncorp. 5,000 people in a 52,000 seat stadium looks a bit dismal.
 
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