IRB U/20 Tournament and Oz Squad

[Lee Grant]

Doesn't matter where they come from when they have the gold jersey on trank.

 

[spectator]

Just looking at the positions so I can work out who missed out (positions won't be exact.):

1. Scott Sio, JP Pradaud

2. Siliva Siliva, Hugh Roach

3. Paul Alo-Emile, Tim Metcher

4/5. Blake Enever, Luke Jones, Greg Peterson

6. 7. 8. Colby Fainga'a, Jarrad Butler, Liam Gill, Michael Hooper, Eddie Quirk

9. Eddie Bredenhann, Matt Lucas

10. James Ambrosini, Ben Volavola

12. Apo Latunipulu, Joel Faulkner

13. Tom Kingston, Tevita Kuridrani

11/14/15 Simon Morahan, Rohan Saifoloi, Dom Shipperley, Kimami Sitauti,

Who missed out:

From last years team: Damon Anderson (operation)

Others include:

Stephano Hunt, Jack Kimmence, Sam Talakai, Ted Postal, Ethan Ford, Miles McCaffrey, Jason Seage, Mitch Felsman, Jason Havea, Nic Stirzacker, Jake Woodhouse plus Boyd Killingworth (injured)

Looks like Rohan Saifoloi will be used as a fullback as Ash indicated, though he did play flyhalf for the Junior Tahs against Fiji and the Oz Baas - and for the Oz U/20 wannabies v. the Hawkes Bay Academy.



I forgot Tim Metcher. He played for the Runners against the Junior Tahs and opposed Tetra Faulkner when Jono Owen went off early in the game, and didn't do too badly.

I hadn't appreciated that Blake Enever was that young. I'm certain he is the Sunny Coast player from the Brisbane comp. If that is the case then well done to him! Have to keep a closer eye on him.

That looks to be a very handy forward squad, and any number of backrow combinations will work as they are all quality players. I like the fact that this team could start with a forward pack of players who were all in Argentina last year. Inside backs and fullback look to be the unknown areas in the backs. Having said that, Breddenham was a very solid half in his Churchie days and a couple of years of Sydney Premier grade suggest that he is up to the mark. Young Lucas is like his brother, small in stature but plenty skill and tons of ticker. He could also be an option for 10, as he has played there in Brisbane Premier grade. Can't understand why there isn't a specialist fullback in the side? I only saw Woodhouse as a schoolboy v. the Kiwi's and he looked quite good then. Injuries maybe?

11, 13 and 14 are well covered in Shipperley, Situati and Kingston, all S15 players, and Kuridrani is a good pick having played 7's for OZ this year and 20's for Fiji last year.

Strong looking side.... I wish them all the best.

 

[Lee Grant]

Good post speckie. The omission of Woodhouse, a specialist fullback, is a bit of a mystery since he has played well for the Junior Tahs and, reportedly, in a Manly game last weekend. He is in the Tahs pro academy too which means that he is up to speed with training, though he was out for a while after that good game for the Juniors v Fiji.


Maybe he is not as good as I think he is or just missed out on a tight call. Mind you, if he got in the team there is no guarantee that Nuci would have played him at fullback. You may remember that he played Toua on the wing last year and Morahan senior at fullback.


One thing that Nuci has is versatility in the backline to cover for injuries - except at fullback. As you mention: Lucas can play 10, something I didn't know. If he is as good there as his brother was he will be OK. Saifoloi also plays there. Faulkner played in the trial at 13 but I don't know what his current best position for his club is; so 12 could be a problem if Apo is injured. As you mention: 13 and wing are well covered.


From your remarks it looks like Lucas hasn't put on much weight since I saw him last in 2009 but if he has the ticker of his brother it won't mean beans. Saifoloi is little also and looks like he is 12 years old but I've never noticed him backing off.


The forwards look good on paper, but they did last year too yet they were blitzed by the wolves in black in the final. I've listed Metcher as a THP, where I have seen him play, but I hope that the hair bear can play on the other side too to start with the 1 jersey, because he is a goer. Hooker Roach is a goer too but is smaller and younger than Siliva, which may argue against starting him in crunch matches.


There won't be too many 2nd rows as good as our lads. The back row is a bit out of balance with 3 specialist fetchers, yet needing Quirk to start. Haven't seen Butler since school.

The two things I fear are a lack of pack mongrel and sub-standard goal kicking.

 

[tranquility]

Simon Morahan is a specialist fullback isn't he?

 

[spectator]

Simon Morahan is a specialist fullback isn't he?

You are probably right Tranq, although most of the mail I am reading these days suggest that he may well be better suited to 13. Not a bad thing for OZ rugby IMO.

From my perspective, the best backrow would be all Qld.... 6. Quirk, 7. Gill and 8. Butler, but there is no denying the credentials of Fainga'a and Hooper. I just haven't seen enough of the latter two, but Butler is definitely one for the future, and very suited to 8. Saw him in club last week and he has a lot going for him. Acquitted himself very well in adult company. Given that Fainga'a has had more S15 experience, then maybe him at 6. and Quirk at 8. Quirk played there at club last week and was outstanding. I suspet 6. will be his best senior footy position.

I don't think we need to be concerned about Gill's capabilities at 7. at this level. He more than handled himself well for Qld A vs the giant Fijians and Tongans, so the physical stuff should not be an issue.

 

[Lee Grant]

You could be right tranks but Chris Sautia's dad told me that Simon had to play fullback for Qld Schools in 2009 because his son and Sitauti were the wingers. That may have been bunk info and indeed those were the positions they played for Oz Schools later in the year.

But it stuck in my mind and I always thought he was a winger. What position does he play in senior rugby in 2010?

If it's fullback it explains the apparent mystery of the omission of Woodhouse and makes the team more balanced in my eyes.

 

[Jets]

He was always a fullback at school and played fullback then centre before ending up playing 10. When he played Premier he was used at 13 and I think that this suits him well. What surprised me was how fast he was when he played Premier as he didn't seem to show his speed at colts level. He has all of the qualities to go well at fullback and quite a bit of experience there as well.

 

[tranquility]

Three years in the TSS first XV is nothing to be coughed at. Especially considering the caliber of those particular sides.

 

[lily]

This to me sometimes reads like an extension of a school thread where people still nominate players from their own backyard. Surely Colby and Hoop's will start as well as either Quirk or Gill. As for the 2nd row I hope the Manly pairing of Jones and Peterson play better for the 20's than they do for Manly.

 

[twenty seven]

Found it Lee. Intersesting reading.

"I said that I wouldn't comment on the team before I saw the official squad but I can't help myself. I can't find the thread with my original selections a few months ago but I will comment on the list of hello 123 (Welcome aboard by the way.)"


Original QuoteAssuming that the selectors will be interested in all 2010 squad members still eligible and anybody with a Super or pro academy – Tier One contract, or whatever a team calls it, this would be my guess of a 22 at the minute (though they will take 26 to the tournament):

1. - Scott Sio – Tahs Amateur
2. - Siliva Siliva – Force Super Contract
3. - PAE – Force Super Contract
4. - Greg Peterson – Tahs Pro Academy
5. - Luke Jones – Rebels Super Contract
6. - Colby Fainga'a – Brumbies Super Contract
7. - Liam Gill – Reds Super Contract
8. - Ed Quirk– Reds Super Contract

9. - Nic Stirzacker – Brumbies Amateur
10. - Kyle Godwin – Force Pro Academy
11. - Kimami Sitauti - Reds Super Contract
12. - Apo Latinupulu – Tahs Amateur
13. - Tom Kingston – Tahs Super Contract
14. - Dom Shipperley - Reds Super Contract
15. - Simon Morahan – Reds Pro Academy

Bench
16. - Hugh Roach – Brumbies Amateur
17. - Jack Kimmence – Qld A reserve
18. - Michael Stolberg – Reds Amateur
19. - Michael Hooper – Brumbies Super Contract
20. - Ed Bredenhann – Tahs Amateur
21. - Rohan Saifoloi – Tahs Amateur
22. - Jake Woodhouse - Tahs Pro Academy

Notes
• 1. Sio - Played THP yesterday but JW scrum was not great when he played there once.
• 2. Siliva – Had a top game for Force A v. Brumbies A at the beginning of Feb.
• 3. PAE – Ditto and also looked tough in a cameo at Nowra.
• 6/7 – I can't see Oz using a lineout 6 with 3 elite 7s available.
• 8. - Quirk would usually be the 6, but see above. Haven't seen Butler since school.
• 9. - Stirzacker is better than Bredenhann IMO, No surprise if Nuci thinks differently.
• 10. - Godwin was tops for Force A against the Runners in Feb.
• 12. - Apo – a smokey but nobody else jumps out – (not S.Hunt). Can Faulkner play 12?
• 13. - Kingston - though Apo and he have not been a stellar combo for the JWs.
• 15. - S.Morahan. Could be Woodhouse who starred for the JWs v. Fiji.
• 16. - Roach – Latu was very good; close call. Roach already playing tough above his years.
• 17. - Kimmence – Part of effective front row yesterday
• 18. - Stolberg – I like the looks of this big unit.
• 19 - Hooper – Put on the bench only because the Brumbies aren't using him.
• 21. - Saifoloi – can play several positions and would be reserve goal kicker.
• 22. - Woodhouse – can play 15, 13 and wing. Had a star game for JW v Fiji at 15, but maybe I over-rate him because it's the only start the JWs gave him.

 

[tigerland12]

Surely Colby and Hoop's will start as well as either Quirk or Gill. As for the 2nd row I hope the Manly pairing of Jones and Peterson play better for the 20's than they do for Manly.

I'm assuming you say this because of Super 14 game time. Quirk is a better player then Hooper, and I doubt any coach will want to play 3 opensides in their backrow. As Ive said before, Quirk, Gill, Fainga'a

 

[Lee Grant]

Thanks 27 - I couldn't find it. It must have just been after the U20 trial at Narrabeen because it's the only time this year I saw Kimmence play.

It wasn't too far off the mark, not that it was rocket science. I forgot I had Morahan at 15. but come to think of it now, he played in that trial at 15 but with not much distinction, not that anyone else did except in scrummaging, and I didn't know what was happening with Woodhouse.

I had Hooper missing out on the starting team because the Brumbies kept using Salvi at the beginning of the season and Hooper hadn't started a game for them yet and Colby was getting more time. I had Godwin in based on how he played for Force A v. the Runners: he was terrific that day at Milner. Didn't think of Lucas: he wasn't in the trial.

Yarda, yarda.


lily

Disturbing to hear your remarks about Jones and Peterson. Haven't seen Jones this year. Peterson's dad told me that Greg had some mild hamstring problems early in the season and he looked a bit tentative for the JWs and not much better for Manly v. the Rats, but I thought he would be OK by now.

 

[Cat_A]

This to me sometimes reads like an extension of a school thread where people still nominate players from their own backyard. Surely Colby and Hoop's will start as well as either Quirk or Gill.

I'm not sure people are merely nominating players from their own backyard. RatherI think people may only be commenting on those they have good knowledge of. Often that knowledge comes from seeing these people play first-hand, usually in their local area?

 

[Lee Grant]

That's fair comment.

I've been rabbiting on about lads in the Force, Brumbies and Tahs stable. The whole Force stable was back east and everybody had two games, the Runners were in Sydney, and the Junior Tahs had heaps of games.

Didn't seen the Qld lads except in a trial match where some U20s not involved in Super matches played a Kiwi team and got thrashed. So you couldn't judge them, and not everybody in an Academy showed up to the camp anyway.

Didn't see anybody involved with the Rebels either like Jones or Hingano.

So you mention the others you have seen.

 

[Cat_A]

Kuridrani is a massive unit a winger who stands at 196cm and 100+kg and is still growing. He's been playing premier grade for the past few years, but didn't come through any recognised development systems that I'm aware of. He has huge potential and will respond well to top-level coaching.

 

[brumsfan]

I don't know why a few people keep rating Gill over Hooper, No doubt Gill has made the most off his opportunities but don't forget Hooper missed schoolboys because of injury, was picked as the starting 7 in last years under 20's trial in Argentina before being rulled out injured, Gill was on the bench. Hooper was also picked in the 7's commonwealth games training squad but was not released by the brumbies. He went on to start in 3 games last year scoring on debut. I'm sure both players will become champions, but at this stage Gill has not played more that 15 mins in a game of super rugby, and was given first shot at the position for the reds. Hooper on the other hand this year in his first start was rated by the smh team as the 7 of the round awarded 8 points, in his second game was listed as the 7 in fox sports emerging wallabies, and scored in his 3 start.
I think we will just need to see who's better when they come together head to head in evenly matched teams.

 

[sudrugby]

French Polynesia ;p

France has islands next to Jamaica and we can't even find runners that can make the finals in the Olympics.
It also has islands in the Pacific and can't even help the kids over there to represent France... bad sports organization!

 

[spectator]

I don't know why a few people keep rating Gill over Hooper, No doubt Gill has made the most off his opportunities but don't forget Hooper missed schoolboys because of injury, was picked as the starting 7 in last years under 20's trial in Argentina before being rulled out injured, Gill was on the bench. Hooper was also picked in the 7's commonwealth games training squad but was not released by the brumbies. He went on to start in 3 games last year scoring on debut. I'm sure both players will become champions, but at this stage Gill has not played more that 15 mins in a game of super rugby, and was given first shot at the position for the reds. Hooper on the other hand this year in his first start was rated by the smh team as the 7 of the round awarded 8 points, in his second game was listed as the 7 in fox sports emerging wallabies, and scored in his 3 start.
I think we will just need to see who's better when they come together head to head in evenly matched teams.

You may well be right. As Cat A has said, we usually only make meaningful comment on those we have seen a lot of. I haven't seen too much of Hooper but I've seen a lot of Gill and I have to say that he is the best player in his position that I have ever seen at his age. Big call I know, when you consider the likes of Pocock and Waugh, but that's how highly I rate him.

Tigerlands is probably on the money with his call of Fainga'a, Gill and Quirk, but you could throw both Hooper and Butler in and lose nothing.

Lee - if Petersen and Jones don't fire up, Enever will be up to it. He goes very well. Also that mongrel that you talk about is precisely why Quirk needs to be in the run on side. He has plenty of it.

 

[Lee Grant]

Yeah you are right speckie - Quirk has to start in the money games - I said that in the old thread already though it was hardly rocket science.

I haven't seen Butler since school, as I said, but I rated him because he was very young to be in the Oz Schools Ones side. IIRR he missed out on rep footie the following year because of injury. I wasn't sure how big he was going to be but it looks like he is porking up nicely and you say he is playing well.

It will be interesting to see who Nuci settles on as the backrow in the big matches but I am not fussed about what their names are so long as they are the three who can most play with grunt and mongrel. They are all talented and are hard working; so I am not worried about their skill level or effort, and they can all get around the park at a fair clip.

I saw Enever and Stolberg in the U/20 trial but like everybody else that day in a gold jersey they didn't get a chance to impress because the level of the opposition was too good.

 

[tranquility]

I don't know why a few people keep rating Gill over Hooper, No doubt Gill has made the most off his opportunities but don't forget Hooper missed schoolboys because of injury, was picked as the starting 7 in last years under 20's trial in Argentina before being rulled out injured, Gill was on the bench. Hooper was also picked in the 7's commonwealth games training squad but was not released by the brumbies. He went on to start in 3 games last year scoring on debut. I'm sure both players will become champions, but at this stage Gill has not played more that 15 mins in a game of super rugby, and was given first shot at the position for the reds. Hooper on the other hand this year in his first start was rated by the smh team as the 7 of the round awarded 8 points, in his second game was listed as the 7 in fox sports emerging wallabies, and scored in his 3 start.
I think we will just need to see who's better when they come together head to head in evenly matched teams.

Gill > Hooper.