Horwill's captaincy

[Paradox]

What do posters think of his strategy of going for tries (and his overall demeanor)? I quite like the try strategy and I wish the Brumbies were a little less conservative in terms of turning down 3 pointers. However, I'm sure there a number of posters who think Horwill should be taking penalty kicks.

 

[tigerland12]

I love Horwill as a captain, he's as passionate as it gets. He leads by example and is great from a PR perspective.

BUT, sometimes he does let the emotions get the better of him in his on-field decisions. Last night is a key example.

Fair enough going for the line when the maul was dominant. But for the penalties infront, they should have been taken.

Genia also has a brain explosion when he tapped and threw it to Slipper (clearly not the fastest man on the paddock) on the sideline with no support.

 

[wamberal]

The captain executes the coach's strategy. What do you think all those chaps carrying water are doing? Whispering sweet nothings?

They are telling the bloody captain what to do. Horwill did not decide to go for the tries, it was a team decision, in line with the coach's wishes.

 

[tigerland12]

The captain executes the coach's strategy. What do you think all those chaps carrying water are doing? Whispering sweet nothings?

They are telling the bloody captain what to do. Horwill did not decide to go for the tries, it was a team decision, in line with the coach's wishes.

Mate, are you saying that there was a trainer who ran 50m in under 3 seconds to tell Horwill to take a quick tap? Do we have the FLASH as one of our water boys?

I understand it is a game plan, but some of those penalties were taken way too quickly for any external input to be given into the decision.

 

[Sully]

I agree. The Brumbies are very good of getting out of their own half. The Reds stopped them doing that. Penalty goals help them do that.

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[Richo]

I thought his decision not to take the 3 from right in front with 15 to go cost them the win. With that much time left and clear ascendancy, you take the points and keep the pressure on. On the TV it sounded like the crowd started to boo, assuming they'd take the points, and the roared when they kicked for touch. It took them 10 minutes to score a try.

That's the kind of nonsense that could lose a test series.

Still, I reckon he's the best option to captain Australia. Inspiring, unquestioned selection, leads from the front, etc. I'm sure he won't make that mistake again.

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

When it takes you almost 10 mins in the OPP 22 to put points on the board something is wrong. It just seems inefficient to me.

 

[jay-c]

i dont think hes the man to lead the wallabies
games like last night where a cool head was required to take the points on offer and horwill constantly went with the rush of blood decision> and hes got a history of doing that
i was very critical of his leadership during the world cup- on so many occasions he looked lost and the team looked rudderless. great player for the reds and his spot is without question> but i dont think hes got the smarts when it matters to captain the wallabies
genia for me

 

[Athilnaur]

If you are playing a test match intensity game pretty much the last thing I want to see the Wallabies Captain saying is 'once more unto the breach my boys'. We have lost some pretty infamous games due to a number of captains in recent years seeming to think 'they aren't that good, they will crack'. Granted sometimes it is on, especially if your surname is Genia.

 

[Richo]

i dont think hes the man to lead the wallabies
games like last night where a cool head was required to take the points on offer and horwill constantly went with the rush of blood decision> and hes got a history of doing that
i was very critical of his leadership during the world cup- on so many occasions he looked lost and the team looked rudderless. great player for the reds and his spot is without question> but i dont think hes got the smarts when it matters to captain the wallabies
genia for me

Just looking at last night's game, would Genia have done any different? He took at least one ill-advised quick tap. I think the Reds had a game plan and stuck to it a bit too fanatically.

 

[cyclopath]

I think it's fair to question the way it played out, just as Phil Waugh rightfully copped stick a couple of years ago with repeated scrums, obviously hoping for a pushover or penalty try. I think in tight games, you take the points. The Reds had momentum, and I am sure they'd have been able to get back down there again. That said, retrospection is a wonderful thing.
I'm happy with Horwill as Wallaby captain - he's pretty inspirational, and mostly pretty solid in that capacity.
I agree that they probably got carried away with a game plan last night.

 

[PiXeL_Ninja]

Geez Mowan vs Horwill was entertaining. Do you think mowan in the squad will affect team dynamics, which is why he may be left out? Or can they put their bad blood aside and unite vs a common Lion enemy?

 

[jay-c]

Just looking at last night's game, would Genia have done any different? He took at least one ill-advised quick tap. I think the Reds had a game plan and stuck to it a bit too fanatically.

my issue is not with the game plan- it was horwills inability to make a cool calm and collected decision that strayed from the plan when it was required> horwill is a great captain for the reds, but too often over the years he makes a decision that the suncorp crowd will cheer to in my opinion> when it works i love him for it and i love the mentality of a captain to do that> but i just dont think it will win us the tight tests> and he was exposed big time when the chips were down in the world cup.

 

[jay-c]

i do think genia thinks about his decisions a bit more>
i could be wrong on that> but its just the way it seems to me> i think he is more likely of the two to take the 3 points when on offer> sometimes this means they miss out on 7> which is why horwills good> but then games like last night happen

 

[boyo]

Do you play for the crowd or play for the team?

 

[Train Without a Station]

i dont think hes the man to lead the wallabies
games like last night where a cool head was required to take the points on offer and horwill constantly went with the rush of blood decision

The points were on offer because of sustained pressure. Did you think the Reds were going to take the 3 and just waltz down to the 22 and do it again? The Brumbies infringed because they were under pressure from the Reds continually attacking. This was a strategy to wear them down and yield more points. Didn't quite pay off, however taking the 3 on offer could have easily ended in a 19-15 loss once the pressure was off the Ponies.

We had a better chance of attacking, attacking, attacking for 10 minutes, wearing the Brumbies down, getting the try, then getting another kickable penalty. As opposed to taking the penalty, letting the pressure off, getting back in their 22 and scoring.

And also, when the pressure is on, that's exactly when you need somebody to stick to the game plan, not deviate and fuck shit up.

 

[Scott Allen]

Link and Horwill both made the comment last night that the keep attacking strategy rather than look for 3 points was part of the game plan.

Mowen made the point that the Reds going for quick taps and lineouts/scrums gave the Brumbies no time to have a breather from the pressure and led to them conceding more penalties.

Those decisions by Horwill were what earned the Reds so many penalties. The referee not issuing the extra yellow cards as he should have if he was competent is what now leads to people saying "he should have taken the 3 points" rather than "gutsy decisions but they paid off handsomely".

 

[Train Without a Station]

Scott, I think it's unfair to blame Jackson though. The Brumbies infringed, but also defended well. After they were warned that they would get another card, when they infringed again after the first one, we bombed the line out and the Brumbies got a little breather.

I think the Brumbies ability to hold up the ball carrier over the line saved them, as well as Nic White's ability to get in front of the camera angle for the video ref.

 

[ACT Crusader]

Scott, I think it's unfair to blame Jackson though. The Brumbies infringed, but also defended well. After they were warned that they would get another card, when they infringed again after the first one, we bombed the line out and the Brumbies got a little breather.

I think the Brumbies ability to hold up the ball carrier over the line saved them, as well as Nic White's ability to get in front of the camera angle for the video ref.

TWS, I don't think Scott is going to let this one up for a while if his posts since the final whistle are anything to go by.....

What I find interesting is that many fans and posts on here have commented on it being a test atmosphere and intensity, if it were a test and it was that sort of scoreline and contest, IMO you take whatever points are on offer. Cooper was striking the ball well also.

I don't think Horwill should be overly criticised though.

 

[wamberal]

For crying out aloud. Teams have scenarios for just about everything, down to individual moves.


Why on earth would they not have a strategy for something as big as whether or not to take penalty goals, as opposed to going for the try?


Answer: Of course they do, and the captain is not the maker of the decision, he just passes it on to the ref. The execution of the strategy might change during the course of the game, but if you really think that the captain kind of dreams up hugely important decisions on the spot, then you have been watching Fox Sports for too long.