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Dingo Deans

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proton

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Im a Kiwi living in Ozzie.
I still support the ABs but since the NZRFU chose to deny the ABs to the best coach NZ has I have been a staunch supporter of Australia and heres why:

Robbie Deans has that X factor as a caoch. He has always been analytical regardless whether Ozzie has beaten NZ 2 in 13 times or not. And he has always had the ability to focus on the bigger picture stuff.

When he was with the Crusaders much of their success could be attributed to the way he coached.

Some question why he has been given the reigns when possibly there are better coaches out there but Robbie has a knack of getting the best out of a team by instilling confidence in them. Remember all the losses the big ones Australia has had over the past years since he has had the reigns. Those are the ones that would have hurt you the most but for the past four seasons I have been watching how he has molded this team brought in younger exciting players and kept the guys that can put it on the feild for their country.
Some would have been upset by inclusions and exclusions but what is obvious there is players must have a team ethos. Some of those excluded possibly could have been for that reason but you can see what a team can do when they play as a team.

Man Aussie has an exciting back line and the forwards have stiffened up themselve to compliment each small unit. Sure they may lose at the world cup but hey they may win too...then all the knockers of Dingo as NZ call him now will look back and say we shouldn't have stuck with Henry Robbie had the keys all the time. Henry has nothing to offer that we havent seen. Individuals in the ABs have been the only reason why they perform consistently now they are shell shocked and will need to play each game because the opposition come 1/4s and semis know they can beat them.

Why did 30000 Australians booked flights to go to NZ after the Tri Nations final they were obviously happy with the result. Imagine what that support will do for the team. And also to have that psychological edge that the opposition have the best coach out of NZ.

Australia will always be NZs nemesis now because with Dingo those ABs who have had him as their coach know he can always get something special out of a team. He can take the team to another level. Something NZ hasnt been able to do since he left.

Now is the time to get behind your team, right or wrong they are at the start line now. Get off Dingos back he's got enough pressure at home worrying about the earthquakes, his family there in Chch and whilst you may not understand his logic the trophies are getting put in the cabinet now. Dingo is like you all and has a bone to pick with NZ for not allowing him to become the ABs coach and really its their loss believe you me.

Good luck for the final.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
If we win, I'm happy to let Robbie Deans become an official Australian, just like David Kirk.
 

Duncher

Herbert Moran (7)
Interesting... Though I think you're selling Ted short. He may not get anything out of the team that we haven't seen already, but nor does Usain Bolt bring anything new to the 100m track. Fact is Ted's got an exceptional record for a good reason, he's a great coach!
 
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antipodean

Guest
Im a Kiwi living in Ozzie.
I still support the ABs but since the NZRFU chose to deny the ABs to the best coach NZ has I have been a staunch supporter of Australia and heres why:

Robbie Deans has that X factor as a caoch. He has always been analytical regardless whether Ozzie has beaten NZ 2 in 13 times or not. And he has always had the ability to focus on the bigger picture stuff.

When he was with the Crusaders much of their success could be attributed to the way he coached.
a) It's the NZRU
b) Any coach at the international level is analytical, a "big thinker" of the game.
c) The much vaunted Crusader's hat-trick was the result of Wayne Smith.
d) I'm fairly certain that there's a strong correlation between personnel at your disposal and results, which tends to skew the ability to determine who is truly a great coach. London to a brick any number of coaches would have Super Rugby titles if they had the Crusaders squad, especially Merhtens, Carter, McCaw, etc.

Why did 30000 Australians booked flights to go to NZ after the Tri Nations final
Really? Are you sure?
 

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
a) It's the NZRU
b) Any coach at the international level is analytical, a "big thinker" of the game.
c) The much vaunted Crusader's hat-trick was the result of Wayne Smith.
d) I'm fairly certain that there's a strong correlation between personnel at your disposal and results, which tends to skew the ability to determine who is truly a great coach. London to a brick any number of coaches would have Super Rugby titles if they had the Crusaders squad, especially Merhtens, Carter, McCaw, etc.


Really? Are you sure?
Geez, it makes Graham Henry look so much better that he's managed to eke so many wins out of the meagre player group he has at his disposal; I doubt anyone else could have done that. Or was it Wayne Smith? ;)
 

matty_k

Peter Johnson (47)
Why did 30000 Australians booked flights to go to NZ after the Tri Nations final

I'm pretty sure that was NZRU or NZ RWC committee or NZ Tourism upping their projection (17000 to 30000) on the number of Australians going to the Cup after the win.
 
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antipodean

Guest
Pieter De Villiers??????
I knew someone would mention him. :lmao:

Geez, it makes Graham Henry look so much better that he's managed to eke so many wins out of the meagre player group he has at his disposal; I doubt anyone else could have done that. Or was it Wayne Smith? ;)
The Great Redeemer has a coaching history that makes for interesting analysis. Coaching winning NPC and SUper 12 teams getting Wales to play well (for a while), coming an intercept pass from a winning Lions tour. Fixing the Blues defense to win another title and obviously his astonishing run of success since taking over from Mitchell. Apart from the Welsh, has he been largely lucky to have great players at his disposal?

Of course I'm not suggesting for a minute Deans is a bad coach, he's just not the wunderkind people made him out to be. The plan some people associate with Deans to bring in youth to the Wallabies is a figment of fervent imaginations. He simply had to replace retired, injured or clearly out of form players. Having that forced on you isn't a grand plan.
 

Bullrush

Geoff Shaw (53)
Geez, it makes Graham Henry look so much better that he's managed to eke so many wins out of the meagre player group he has at his disposal; I doubt anyone else could have done that. Or was it Wayne Smith? ;)

Henry has had international players to work with just like the SA, Aus, Eng, Fra coaches he's competed against have. At the Crusaders, Deans had a lot of international players to work with especially when compared with a lot of the other coaches he was competing with. So there's a big difference there.....unless you're trying to say that AB players are usually better than their international counterparts.

And now that Henry has had the ABs for about 8yrs (it's been about 10yrs since Wayne Smith was head coach), I think it's fair to say it's pretty much his team now.

But instead of us guessing about Deans, why not ask some of the great ABs who actually played for him at international level- guys like Tana Umaga and maybe Christian Cullen....they probably know better than any of us.
 

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
Sure, Bullrush, we could ask the obviously disgruntled "employees" what they thought of the boss, but we know that answer.
I was being facetious in response to the previous post. It is interesting how often Deans' coaching record at the Crusaders is downplayed, mainly by Kiwis, to reinforce the point he was not much chop, rather very lucky. Apparently it was Wayne Smith who did all the good work! Similarly, John Mitchell lost 2 out of 23 Tests (or was it 3?) and is regularly rubbished as a coach because he was distant from the players / media etc..., and he had such good players anyway.
Antipodean notes that Henry has done so well since taking over from Mitchell - they seemed to be travelling OK beforehand!!
Henry gets compared favourably to Deans with a 13-3 record in head to head, or whatever it is, which completely ignores the point about which 2 teams they are coaching. Swap the coaches, and it would not have been 13-3 the other way! I would hazard a guess it would be pretty similar to what it is now.
There are so many factors in why a team succeeds or fails, and I for one don't believe it is all down to the coach. Of course they take the blame when it goes wrong, that's part of their brief.
 

Toddy

Chris McKivat (8)
Totally agree cyclopath. Robbie has some real hate from a lot of AB supporters. He went from great crusaders coach to lucky crusaders coach in a matter of days. Like most things I reckon he actually sits somewhere in between. Not as bad as some make out and not as good as some make out.

Has he brought about the OZ revival or is it a case of it being "their time". OZ go through some great purple patches and and it had been a while since their last one.

I also think the reds coach would have done as good a job as Robbie. I even think he may have got results a little quicker as I bet there was a bit of a cultural change for Robbie when he first got the job.

I was disappointed that Deans was signed on for two more years. I would've liked to see where he could have taken the AB's.
 

jay-c

Ron Walden (29)
the robbie knockers give me the shits hard
hes backed the younger players and its no surprise we have many eith the best or in the top 2 or 3 for their position in the world
any other coach would have still taen mortlock, waugh baxter and dunning etc into this world cup
hes been the coach while we have seen a huge revival in aus rugby the last few year> theres no way the rds would have won without robbies influence on many of their start players
when he wins the world cup he will be getting my vote for australian of the year
 
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Jay

Guest
It is interesting how often Deans' coaching record at the Crusaders is downplayed, mainly by Kiwis, to reinforce the point he was not much chop, rather very lucky. Apparently it was Wayne Smith who did all the good work! .

Well, not completely obviously, but Deans did inherit a team that had won back to back S12 titles so he have a bit to work with. Obviously those guys weren't still round 10 years later and he did some brilliant development work to build the team that won titles in the mid/late 2000's.

It tends to get exaggerated both ways, I've noticed. Deans gets credit for developing guys like Marshall & Mehrtens who were All Blacks before he coached them for instance, and on the other side of the coin you get people dismissing his teams because anyone could win a title with Dan Carter, McCaw etc which ignores the fact that he was a big part of making them the players they are.

One thing I think that lead to quite a bit of the Robbie hate/schadenfreude was all the hysterical fucking Cantabs who said they were gonna support the Wallabies when Deans was passed over for Henry. I have to say that really rubbed me up the wrong way, and I can see how some might transfer this to hoping he failed with the Wallabies. I have to say the only time I've really wanted him to fail was after listening to Matt Gunn (an NZ based Aussie on Radio Sport) for a week after that Wallaby win in 2008. That was more about shutting up the radio cnut, though.

Don't get me wrong, I want the AB's to kill the Wallabies every time, but I don't wish any ill on Deans. I wouldn't have minded him as AB coach in 08 and would like to see him get a crack at some point.
 
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proton

Guest
a) It's the NZRU
b) Any coach at the international level is analytical, a "big thinker" of the game.
c) The much vaunted Crusader's hat-trick was the result of Wayne Smith.
d) I'm fairly certain that there's a strong correlation between personnel at your disposal and results, which tends to skew the ability to determine who is truly a great coach. London to a brick any number of coaches would have Super Rugby titles if they had the Crusaders squad, especially Merhtens, Carter, McCaw, etc.


Really? Are you sure?

Apologies I wonder if it ever used to be the NZRFU? I sat in the first Coaching Course the NZRU ran. It had an impressive line up of coaches Wayne Smith included. It was the instigation of which led to Canterbury developing and putting them 2 years ahead of the rest of the country, that has led to a depth of talent they didnt just keep to themselves but opened up to the Sth Island as well. And the acccolades followed.

Maybe Henry was still at Kelston then with Muliaina and Mealamu because it was a time when Alex was coach and Robbie was still playing with Bruce his brother and the Earls. They clipped us in the club finals.

This was where Cantabury developed their strength at Grass Roots. Now we are paying top dollars to keep players in water adds and waiting for some snow ball to keep them in the game because they look nice in adds. Call me a disgruntalled fan but anyone who doesnt know who his best wingers are (quote) doesnt do it for me.

Mind you we have had a few coaches in NZ who havent delivered when the crunch comes.... and they included all those guns you have mentioned. Fitzsimmons said if NZ cant win at home with the team they have they need to take up croquet ha. The Aussies are playing at a faster pace when and if they need to and NZ needs to adjust. No doubt the ABs will learn from the last game Aussie did from Eden Park.

If I wasnt so wrapped up with the Broncos and watching Lokyer finish in style I would put my boots on but Henry has enough injuries to worry about plus he said its not important the tri nations I beg to differ.

It may have been a typo with the 30000 but if it was they would be able to afford to go at such short notice.
 
T

tblackadder

Guest
agree with the comments above

many robbie knockers are retards.....

if you look at the other super rugby teams.....how many of them are strong one year then average the next (blues/chiefs/waratahs/stormers... even brumbies sometimes...). To keep the team at the top or near the top against changing oppositions and with player changes over the years is a great achievement

also under his coaching there are instances of players underachieving at other provinces then excelling when they moved to the crusaders
 
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