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Did Joubert feel the pressure?

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B

Blob

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Joubert isn't biased, that is rubbish

Both sides were at it, Joubert allows a dock yard brawl at the breakdown, the ABs were better at working to his interpretation. As long as there is a bit of pushing, Joubert lets a lot go.

Just like Aus worked out Lawrence for the qtr final game after being owned in the pool game.

More or less agree. Two very tough, very good forward packs belting the crap out of each other. Joubert controlled it as well as possible without turning it into farce.

As for the scrums, I think people need to understand the implications of shoulders lower than hips, which was the French loosie's position when he got penalised.

The French ran plenty of interference too. Harinordonkey was particularly effective.

Bonnaire put a good knee into Read's head too at one point.

Ah well. I enjoyed the game myself. Tough. Uncompromising. Tense. Probably not the kind of rugby a lot of Australian rugby supporters are used to or like. Which may tell a story in itself...
 

Athilnaur

Arch Winning (36)
Yeah - just have to console ourselves with the fact that they're now unquestionably the most successful rugby team in the history of the game. Small consolation, I know.

I agree. Not sure the French would be so obliging after coming within a gnats scrotum whisker of pretty much matching the Kiwi world cup record though.
 
J

Jay

Guest
I agree. Not sure the French would be so obliging after coming within a gnats scrotum whisker of pretty much matching the Kiwi world cup record though.

The French were fucking awesome. I dunno what that team is on with the way they can be shit then great within a couple of weeks. If they played all the time like they were playing NZ in a knockout match they'd be neck and neck with NZ & SA for all time greatness.
 

No4918

John Hipwell (52)
I think it funny that most Aussies are getting their panties all twisted when we had nearly the exact same thing go in our favour in the QF. Were we concerned about the reffing then or just whinging saffas doing what we are now?

France played an excellent game and made themselves lots of new fans last night. As a neutral it was a great game to watch, better than anyone could have hoped for the final. The french might even have won rugby a few new fans. But most of us widely considered them the worst side to make a final and i still believe they did not deserve to be there.

The best side of the tournament and last few years won, they may not have deserved it last night. But its just the WC, we all know the true world champion will be crowned after the 4Ns next year, and the years after.
 

mark_s

Chilla Wilson (44)
I was expecting Joubert to be strict again at the breakdown after the scruitiny on both McCaw and Pocock in the semi. However, Woodcock won a turnover early in the game, he had he knees on the ground and he elbows on the french player and even the kiwi comms on C9 found it hard to believe he was supporting his own weight. So other than the usual brawl at the ruck, the things that stood out for me was the let go high tackles and the crooked line out throws esepcially as the assistants should be helping call those. The scrum penalties were also hard to understand in the second half.
 

Richo

John Thornett (49)
Lots of AB hate here, as usual. It comes with the success I suppose.

Rubbish. Try enjoying your win rather than engaging in paranoid trolling. It'd be a very small minority that begrudge the ABs their win - as numerous posters have pointed out on this and other threads, they've been the best team for your years, including this tournament, and thoroughly deserve to be World Champs. Pointing out inconsistencies in the officiating is hardly hate for the All Blacks -- although I guess if it makes you feel good to read it that way...
 

FANATIC

Fred Wood (13)
First of all congratulations New Zealand. Amazing team that was consistent throughout the tournament. I can't begrudge them winning.

From a neutral's point of view, it was a good game and that had a lot to do with the referee not blowing his whistle. However, I couldn't help feel that Joubert seemed to be scared of awarding any penalties. Whilst it is hard to pinpoint any clear cut mistakes, I wonder whether under different circumstances the French dominance in the scrum would have be rewarded and the ABs murky work at the breakdown pinged.

It was a rather good performance from Joubert. Yet their must have been huge pressure not to be the cause of the ABs choking again. I didn't envy him at all.

Thoughts? I hope this thread doesn't detract from the ABs win.

this thread shouldn't detract from the win and we should still be able to talk about the game.

From the get go I told friends that the French would win the scrummage and the laws at the breakdown would be pushed constantly by the ABs.
Joubert obviously did not want to dictate the score by constantly awarding penalty shots so a fair lot of cheating was allowed which is different to dangerous play which I only recall one obvious high tackle being 'forgiven'.
BUT he did not INSTRUCT and should have been either awarding penalties or yelling 'roll away' and a few other things.
He simply did not seem to want to get too involved... but must have been talked to at half time as he came out of the blocks picking McCaw penalty strait up.
He did let the game flow and it was a good game to watch.
 

Toddy

Chris McKivat (8)
Of course Joubert felt the pressure. What ref in a world cup final wouldn't.

Still thought he had a good game. As good if not better than previous refs in finals footy.
 
W

WhoDaresWin

Guest
I will say it again. But something needs to be done about politics keeping Wayne Barnes from refereeing the RWC Playoffs. Before the RWC Wayne Barnes was without doubt the best referee in the world. He would have been perfect to referee this game, however the NZ media would have a fit had Barnes been refereeing this game. Barnes is the most consistent referee in world rugby. You know what your getting with him. With Joubert he went missing.

Is this the same Barnes that missed that clear offside and forward-pass that led to the Shane Williams try in the Bronze play-off??

If Australia had lost that game, I'm preety sure you'd be here critisizing Barnes....so stop your Barnes thrashwanking and give credit to Joubert for a wonderful game.
 

Ash

Michael Lynagh (62)
Joubert was definitely consistent, unfortunately that consistency was failing to ref the breakdown properly last night. Agree with those who said that was his worst game of the tournament. Seriously, one of my most hated blights is tacklers falling on the wrong side on purpose and not rolling away. It was done all throughout the game, more and more as it went on. There was even a few hysterical moments where players blatantly transgressed in front of Joubert but he failed to blow his whistle. I know the Aussie comms are whiners, and they piss me off, but geez I agreed with them a lot in that game whenever they complained about the rucks.

Plus, I have friends who aren't rugby people who watched the game and they hated it because it was so slow due to the mess that was the rucks. Several turned it off mid way through. I know some people here will criticise and say "so what?", but the WC is the event every 4 years to get non-rugby people into the fold. Neutrals watching it and just seeing a mess at the breakdown isn't what is needed for the game, just as the previous WC final with the kicking farce was not what was needed.

That being said, I enjoyed the game and it was close, and I still think that Joubert is close to the best ref going around. Just wish the blatant cheating at the rucks could be fixed.
 

Bon

Ward Prentice (10)
Most of us would prefer to see open flowing rugby,but this was finals footie,trench warfare,win at all costs with minimum risks. Rugby probably came third.
 

Eyes and Ears

Bob Davidson (42)
Joubert isn't biased, that is rubbish

Both sides were at it, Joubert allows a dock yard brawl at the breakdown, the ABs were better at working to his interpretation. As long as there is a bit of pushing, Joubert lets a lot go.

Just like Aus worked out Lawrence for the qtr final game after being owned in the pool game.

I think the Train actually agrees with you but missed the word "not" before "biased".
 

PaarlBok

Rod McCall (65)
Myself thought Craig had an excellent final. Good article about him and his praparations for the big ones. Cant find a english version and had to use google translation.

http://www.rapport.co.za/Rubrieke/HanlieRetief/Hanlie-gesels-met-Craig-Joubert-20111022

Hanlie chat with Craig Joubert
2011-10-22 13:50
You run your phone from the tunnel, Eden Park's indescribable atmosphere, with 170 million people's eyes on you, and everything - your life, your career, your goals - pulled together in this one moment.

What's going on in your head?

"The adrenaline pumping, but you show it. You move it away, "said Craig Joubert when I had last week in New Zealand.

It's like Craig's, saying the former tets ref Tappe Henning later. "As I know Craig, he that incredible pressure of a World Cup final parking elsewhere and just focus on the two teams ahead of him. Cool, calm and impartial. "

You can hear the pride in his voice lugs. He is Craig's mentor for years.

"Our two story is really wonderful. His father, the late Des was a senior referee when I was a junior, and he always looked after me when I breathe in Durban, from 1989, with SAP rugby week in Pietermaritzburg. Craig was the ball boy, and his father took me under his wing.

"And as it works now but when I finished as blower, when Craig's at the beginning of his career, and took him under my wing. And can you believe my son is now sixteen, and now Craig to help him again. "

Three generations of mentoring, they share.

"There's so many similarities. I was eighteen when my father died, Craig was seventeen his father died. Craig and I know: you blow in one way only a game, wherever you are, you blow so your father can be proud of you, wherever He is ... "

At 33, Craig Joubert the youngest ever referee a World Cup final. He handled the whistle however, eighteen years of his Maritzburg College days. He through the hard school came, long in the shadow of the blast Jonathan Kaplans, the Mark Lawrences long been number four on the SA-ranking, long waited for this breakthrough.

Speaking a few minutes with him, and you understand why writers like Peter Bills Briton gets going on Joubert. He's a fresh breeze in the sometimes-stuffy corridors of international referees, Bills said, he leads a new era of accessible, media-friendly refereeing.

In a World full of controversial rulings, the Bryce Lawrence debacle the low welcomed sports writers worldwide "humble", "impartial", "immaculate" Joubert.

The corporate banker before his contract with SA Rugby at Standard Bank has worked to disturb him, however little to praise, to get back soon.

"I live for rugby," he said, instead of four words all his cards on the table. "There's nothing better for me than to be a good game off the field and walk to this: I could contribute to this. It's a privilege. A million people would just like to be where I am, in the heat of battle.

"I have thoroughly enjoyed banking. But now I earn my bread with my hobby. "

Maybe there is still something of a banker who, with Craig Joubert out onto the field - the man in the background, but still firmly in control.

He also took no nonsense.

When Bulls captain Victor Matfield in a Super 14 match a list of demands Joubert, he silenced with: "It's my call, Victor. Cheers. "For Fourie du Preez, once:" Do your frustrations out on me not. "

His wife Charmaine and their two year old son Max get together in New Zealand, and Craig said they've helped to make him relax in the buildup to the big final.

"I get a little tense, but never fear, so the butterflies was previously gave me a good sign. Fortunately I sleep very well. Your preparation is long finished, so the last thing a guy wants to do is to match all day thinking. "

The first kick-off at nine o'clock that evening, is a long Sunday for him. "I hope for a nice, normal Family Day. Here's parks near the hotel where Max can run around and swing. We also read stories to him, oh, it's just fun. "

He plans to use some sleep, something light for breakfast and a late lunch at about four o'clock - "maybe pasta or a sandwich, and energy bars in between, does not really matter." More importantly, says Craig, is all day by adequate water and Powerade drink.

"It's important to stay focused on the game, but you must not think about all day, because it's your head at kickoff worthless."

Little Max was up into the semi-final last weekend, he says. "He loved the train ride there and along the field always excited to show his mother that his father running around and that cool whistle blow!"

After lunch, Craig will ensure that the dark gray suit which he will attend Eden Park, pressed and packed ref clothes. "I have six apartments - orange jerseys this time, contrasting with the All Blacks and France.
Orange is not my favorite color, "you hear again the banker talk.

By five o'clock the physiotherapist will let him do stretching exercises and massage muscles. "Then the time becomes less and build up the atmosphere. That's the exciting part of the day. "

Half Seven leave their Eden Park, where Craig and his checklist begins: the inspection of the players' clothes and boots, the conversation with the fatties where he include the rate at which his scrumming calss get finalize - that Crouch, touch, pause Engage.

"As the players warm up and I then ran around a bit and loosen joints. Twenty minutes before kick off I'm back in the locker room where the microphones for communication with the ass refs and TV umpire fitted and tested.

"Then came the call, and you're almost over ready, all week waiting for this moment."
Actually all his life.

His school dream of a World Cup Final in a Springbok jersey. He played fullback and flyhalf, even had provincial colors Naas Botha was his "first real hero, I wanted so much to play like him."

But eventually he realized that shattering of so many school children faced: that he is good but not good enough. That Craig Joubert will never wear a Bok jersey.

It's father Des who was a light in the young Craig let it go on if you cant play internationally, you always can ref internationally.

"All I wanted to do was as close as possible to be rugby. As a referee I am, and will also put my career much more than keep a player's. "

For Craig, it was a "special moment" when he was appointed as referee in the final match between New Zealand and France.

"Like any other South African I hope I will be the Boks in the final playing, but it was not intended. Now I'm the only South African in the final, "he said, and then add back to him much earlier in his Springbok jersey and scarf in the bleachers would sit with the team that run out ...

He wants him, diplomatically, not comment on the controversy surrounding the refereeing in the World Cup.

He would not say who's the toughest Dietary culprits he had in the scrums had to deal with. Just "we Balie Swart referees helped to know exactly what's going on in the front row, an extremely difficult area for a referee. I am very grateful for that. "

His decisions may haunt him if he evening after a game go to bed, Craig admits.

"We go through a self-evaluation process to a game, and it helps us from our mistakes to learn. And that's where you make it. You move on, because next week is for. It does not help you stay on your breed mistakes. "

On the field he block everything out. During tough decisions disturb him at all to the audience's reaction, said Craig.

"At this level you must have the courage to make the right decision, no matter what anyone says."

His worst moment blower was an error in a 2008 Tri Nations match between the Wallabies and All Blacks where he was not a penalty try for the All Blacks awarded when the All Blacks winger Sitiveni Sivivatu without the ball is tackled, not .

"I tackle those not seen. When they show it again and again on the big screen. It made me angry upset. But you can just blow what you see. And you must also accept, but you're human and make mistakes. "

This blunder is just one of those few who blower in his career happened, said a senior rugby writer.
"Like the All Blacks coach Graham Henry said Joubert, the last three or four years one of the top referees in the world, and the players love being with him playing."

Monday, after a closure function of the World, to Craig and his family to an island close to Auckland for a quiet time away from everything just to breath again.

And then the calm guy back in the middle, whistle around the neck, yellow and red cards in the pocket, on rugby fields across the world. Long periods away from home matches almost every weekend.

But for Craig Joubert is not simply work. It's his life. His passion. His world is indeed a ovaalbal.
 
B

Burke's Boot

Guest
Like Scotty said. Any other player that grubs around on the floor like Richie does in home tests would be penalised off the park. Free board, food and drink for Joubert for the rest of his life in NZ and at any home.
 

PaarlBok

Rod McCall (65)
Like Scotty said. Any other player that grubs around on the floor like Richie does in home tests would be penalised off the park. Free board, food and drink for Joubert for the rest of his life in NZ and at any home.

Pretty much the same thing B Lawrense can expect in Aus. Interesting to see the same lot defending B lawrense a few weeks back , now attack Joubert. Double standards?
 

Sully

Tim Horan (67)
Staff member
Refs do their jobs as well as they can on the day. Anyone who thinks the are perfect or biased is either dreaming or had better come up with some proof. Anyone who thinks they can do better should find a Refs course and put their money where their mouth is.
 

Scotty

David Codey (61)
Like Scotty said. Any other player that grubs around on the floor like Richie does in home tests would be penalised off the park. Free board, food and drink for Joubert for the rest of his life in NZ and at any home.

I don't think I said that. You are going to get me in trouble!
 

Gnostic

Mark Ella (57)
I will not buy into the Joubert criticism. He was without doubt the best ref. at the tournament and even if Barnes had been better there is no way in hell he would have been given a RWC Final with NZ playing let alone against France.

Now after another tournament blighted by refereeing inconsistencies and outright incompetence action must be taken for the betterment and protection of Rugby.

IMO any action has to come from the top and that requires the man who has compromised his integrity to the point no Non-NZ (and many NZ) fans have no respect or trust for him, Paddy Obrien, must resign. The facts are inconvertible in that during his tenure as Referees Manager the performance of top referees has declined. Too many games are determined by the incompetence of the man in the middle and on most occasions the referees in question have a long history of managing games in similar fashion.

Obrien must resign because whatever systems he has put in place to develop and mentor referees is a failure and this failure has tainted the careers of more than a few promising Referees. For example does anybody really believe Bryce Lawrence's career will recover from his disastrous handling of the SA V Aus 1/4? Certainly he oversaw the end of Stu Dickenson's career for whistling justified penalties.

The Old Farts at the IRB must get of their rotund self importances and appoint a skilled trainer/manager who can develop and mentor the current referees and oversee the next crop so that the ongoing justified attacks on refereeing of Tests stops.
 
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