Brumbies v Waratahs, round 12, Friday 1 May

[Viking]

I expect Coleman will be tackling Skelton, Pots, Nau or Folau whenever possible and being tackled by Horne or AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)

It is really rare for the 12 to run at the opposing 12 these days, and Beale plays as the 10 quite often as Foley and he interchange

I hope your wrong but that's certainly likely and a pretty decent strategy. I'd expect the same from the Brumbies targeting Beale and Foley in the line who'd probably be worse defenders then Coleman. So I guess I wouldn't call it an advantage for the Tahs as you have the same weakness in that area.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think the key for the Tahs is to shut down Vaea and Kuridrani like we did in Sydney earlier in the season. Those two players are crucial to the Brumbies and when they're quiet they struggle.

Pocock will be a menace but I don't think there's a whole lot we can do to eliminate that. We have to be accurate at the breakdown and clear out powerfully. We've got to avoid giving him opportunities to force penalties at the breakdown in our own half.

Counteracting the rolling maul is also going to be crucial. It's so hard to defend against that I think we have to really limit the number of 5 metre lineouts the Brumbies get.

 

[Viking]

I think the key for the Tahs is to shut down Vaea and Kuridrani like we did in Sydney earlier in the season. Those two players are crucial to the Brumbies and when they're quiet they struggle.

Pocock will be a menace but I don't think there's a whole lot we can do to eliminate that. We have to be accurate at the breakdown and clear out powerfully. We've got to avoid giving him opportunities to force penalties at the breakdown in our own half.

Counteracting the rolling maul is also going to be crucial. It's so hard to defend against that I think we have to really limit the number of 5 metre lineouts the Brumbies get.

I feel Vaea was still a bit fresh early in the session. He was successful off the bench but struggled when he started. His fitness should be better by now so I expect more from him this game. I think the key for the Brumbies will be matching the physicality of Skelton, Pots, Palu, TPN, Kepu - Vaea will need to play a key role in this and Moore/ Pocock will certainly always be up for it.

Good luck shutting down Kuridrani

 

[Hugh Jarse]

In the old days, the piggies had to work the ball to the back of the maul, rolling or otherwise, by hand. No one "drifted" to the back of the maul with Gilbert tucked under their arm. The primary job of everyone in the maul was to bind tight, and push forward and straight. Gilbert was smuggled backwards by players ripping.

The current lazy mauls have one player (with Gilbert) not pushing at all, and loose binds from those joining the maul as they either join illegally in front of the ball carrier, or they have to bind very loosely to leave a channel for the ball carrier to drift backwards through.

If teams set their mauls old school style, with a ripper securing the pill, and the rest of the players joining with their heads inside the bum cheeks of the last two blokes in the maul, you have a very focused drive that can easily get the necessary momentum to break through any defence. Once you have momentum, then Gilbert can be smuggled to the back of the maul.

Coaches need to make the fat boys earn their money.

 

[fatprop]

I hope your wrong but that's certainly likely and a pretty decent strategy. I'd expect the same from the Brumbies targeting Beale and Foley in the line who'd probably be worse defenders then Coleman. So I guess I wouldn't call it an advantage for the Tahs as you have the same weakness in that area.

They tried to isolate Beale at scrum time into a one on one with the opposing winger on the blindside last time, it is worth a try if they can get the scrum right

Not concerned at all with Foley's defense, he is a solid defender who will put his body on the line, just not a dominant defender

 

[fatprop]

I feel Vaea was still a bit fresh early in the session. He was successful off the bench but struggled when he started. His fitness should be better by now so I expect more from him this game. I think the key for the Brumbies will be matching the physicality of Skelton, Pots, Palu, TPN, Kepu - Vaea will need to play a key role in this and Moore/ Pocock will certainly always be up for it.

Good luck shutting down Kuridrani

Vaea will be easier than Kuridrani, they did a great job of stopping Timani last week by sending Pots out as a shooter every time he got the ball, whether he made the tackle or not it stopped the momentum

I am actually more concerned about Speight on an inside channel

 

[Pedrolicus]

In the old days, the piggies had to work the ball to the back of the maul, rolling or otherwise, by hand. No one "drifted" to the back of the maul with Gilbert tucked under their arm. The primary job of everyone in the maul was to bind tight, and push forward and straight. Gilbert was smuggled backwards by players ripping.

The current lazy mauls have one player (with Gilbert) not pushing at all, and loose binds from those joining the maul as they either join illegally in front of the ball carrier, or they have to bind very loosely to leave a channel for the ball carrier to drift backwards through.

If teams set their mauls old school style, with a ripper securing the pill, and the rest of the players joining with their heads inside the bum cheeks of the last two blokes in the maul, you have a very focused drive that can easily get the necessary momentum to break through any defence. Once you have momentum, then Gilbert can be smuggled to the back of the maul.

Coaches need to make the fat boys earn their money.

Do you think this is because of the speed the ball is expected to be extricated from the maul if it's not moving forward? Also the lack of time given to get the ball out of a collapsed maul? I think the forwards are paranoid about losing possession if they don't "use it" fast enough.

 

[Gnostic]

Vaea will be easier than Kuridrani, they did a great job of stopping Timani last week by sending Pots out as a shooter every time he got the ball, whether he made the tackle or not it stopped the momentum

I am actually more concerned about Speight on an inside channel

Especially given Horne had an uncharacteristically poor game in defence. I don't think I have ever seen him miss so many tackles and get caught out of position.

 

[Gnostic]

In the old days, the piggies had to work the ball to the back of the maul, rolling or otherwise, by hand. No one "drifted" to the back of the maul with Gilbert tucked under their arm. The primary job of everyone in the maul was to bind tight, and push forward and straight. Gilbert was smuggled backwards by players ripping.

The current lazy mauls have one player (with Gilbert) not pushing at all, and loose binds from those joining the maul as they either join illegally in front of the ball carrier, or they have to bind very loosely to leave a channel for the ball carrier to drift backwards through.

If teams set their mauls old school style, with a ripper securing the pill, and the rest of the players joining with their heads inside the bum cheeks of the last two blokes in the maul, you have a very focused drive that can easily get the necessary momentum to break through any defence. Once you have momentum, then Gilbert can be smuggled to the back of the maul.

Coaches need to make the fat boys earn their money.

and refs (and World Rugby/IRB) need to police the maul to the rules. The current maul is akin to feeding the 2nd row in the scrum, it is not a contest and last week the Brumbies three tries were a certainty from the moment Pocock got the ball at the back and the other players rushed into bind in front of him. How can any team compete with that legally?

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Do you think this is because of the speed the ball is expected to be extricated from the maul if it's not moving forward? Also the lack of time given to get the ball out of a collapsed maul? I think the forwards are paranoid about losing possession if they don't "use it" fast enough.

But if they get it moving forward quickly, then Sir tends to delay the "use it" call. With the ripper solely concerned with getting hold of Gilbert, then drifting backwards, there is one less shoulder to the grindstone at the precise time that maximum shoulders are needed at the grindstone to get the maul moving forward. Bit of a catch-22 really.

Bottom line is that there should be something done to stop the illegal mauling, during setup, when the princesses bind in front of the ball carrier, and the ball carrier at the back not being bound.

Bring back a fair contest for the ball. Make the fat boys work.

When was the last time you saw the ball put on the deck and held at the feet of the last man, while the forwards drove forward?
A proper ruck.

 

[Viking]

They tried to isolate Beale at scrum time into a one on one with the opposing winger on the blindside last time, it is worth a try if they can get the scrum right

Not concerned at all with Foley's defense, he is a solid defender who will put his body on the line, just not a dominant defender

I would put Coleman in the same level of defence as Foley. Although Coleman would be easier to target in the 12 channel.

 

[Pedrolicus]

So any more predictions?

I'm going for the brumbies in a landslide. My reasoning? They're very hard to beat at home and after the toweling they got at Sydney they will be ready to redeem themselves, especially Kuridrani who was dreadfully exposed, having his worst game in memory. Mogg didn't play in the last fixture and he has a knack for outplaying Folau, or at least scoring a try at his expense. I also feel like no one else would make the same prediction, thereby giving me sole oracle status in the unlikely event of this happening.

Brumbies by 19

 

[pissedoffihavetoregister]

i think the tahs by 2 huge bee's wangers. Coleman was poor last week and they will target him at IC (he is pretty small ). Poey will balance things up vs last time we played em.
I think the tahs can do them in the scrums. Nags were ok last week but crappy the week before.

Depends how many rolling maul tries they get.....

 

[Tomikin]

It's about to go down!!!

 

[Tomikin]

Just on the maul, it was raised in another thread that the law says that someone doesn't need to be Bond if they are surrounded by the maul which Pocock is as he slides back and binds to the back of the maul.. We should have a thread on it

 

[Hugh Jarse]

The illegalities are related to how the maul is set up in the first instance, the fact that many join the maul ahead of the last feet in the maul and the lack of a bind being maintained by the ball carrier at the back of the maul.

The ball carrier sliding backwards is doing nothing to help to get the maul going forward. They are bludging if they are not contributing any weight or go forward to the maul.

The Ponies are not Robinson Crusoe with their illegal mauling strategy.

 

[Grant NZ]

Just on the maul, it was raised in another thread that the law says that someone doesn't need to be Bond if they are surrounded by the maul which Pocock is as he slides back and binds to the back of the maul.. We should have a thread on it

Not when he slides back past Stephen Moore. On the first & second, there's this interplay between those two where Moore binds on Pocock, then they switch places, but it doesn't really work unless Pocock unbinds. There's one bit in (I think) the second maul where he's not bound at all, and barely even touching Moore. On the first there's a split second where they're bound to each other but neither is bound to anyone in front.

It's not a huge deal, but it's a weird thing to do cause it's not like it'd be that hard to just transfer the ball to Moore. But I guess there's a small chance of the ball being lost during the transfer.

 

[Bullrush]

Just sitting at the Directors Dinner before the game starting to get excited for the game-which is pretty cool as a Blues fan. GO THE BRUMBIES

 

[qwerty51]

Just sitting at the Directors Dinner before the game starting to get excited for the game-which is pretty cool as a Blues fan. GO THE BRUMBIES

Come on, we share the same colours.

 

[boyo]

Maybe he's dirty with the Blues W/L ratio