Brumbies 2011

[observer]

Yeah but there is a huge difference between 7s and the 15 man game. Let's wait and see how he goes for the Runners before putting him forward for the Brumbies top team.

I'm told the game between the Aussie 7's and Brumbies &'s was a draw - 5 trys each with Crook snaring 2. I think the sevens could be a good avenue for the young fella to gain experience at international level before anything else. No doubt Michael "Snoz" O'Connor was suitably impressed. Both teams now move on to Darwin to contest the World's Hottest Sevens on 22 January. See http://www.hottest7s.com/

 

[Cutter]

Topo/Bruce,

Thanks for the picture/info sounds like an interesting player.

Sadly, I don't feel the wider Australian rugger public has a heap of love for hard nosed locks.

I'm waiting to be swept off my feet. I don't think we've had a world class hard nosed lock for many years.

 

[qwerty51]

Dan Vickerman...?

 

[Brumbies Guy]

James Horwill goes ok too, and Sharpey

 

[Ash]

Sharpe is a hard nosed lock? Since when?

 

[TOCC]

since it became a sin to criticise him apparently

 

[Lee Grant]

It's good to see some others on this band wagon. I use the terminology TH lock but show me a lock that packs on the LH side of the scrum and I'll be looking at the lock that is not the hard nosed one. The exception is when you have the happy and uncommon circumstance of having two in the same second row.

Coaches usually get their strong hard bastard to pack down on the TH side to support the THP with strength and power, but often they don't have one. Playing on the TH side of the scrum does not make you a hard nosed lock; after all: Sharpie played on that side for the Force for many games in the 2010 S14, but if a young bloke comes along and immediately is chucked into packing behind the THP in the scrum, you should be excited - or a least interested. It means that the coach rates him in the strength and toughness area.

Thus the emergence of Kane Douglas last year at the Tahs was of interest as was the use of Manly of Greg Peterson in 1st Grade in 2010, fresh out of school, because both scrummaged on the TH side the whole year. We have to watch these players to see if their hard nosed qualities develop to match the position they are used in.

Oz rugby will be well served if they do.

 

[matty_k]

The other bonus with Kane Douglas (and I'm assuming Greg) is that he still has some room in developing his strength.

 

[Lee Grant]

My word, there is room - and lets not forget that often we don't see the hardness factor until they are in their middle 20's. If someone shows promise in the hard nosed lock department we should be willing to wait; especially in the case of Douglas, folks from Yamba.

 

[Newb]

can you be hardnosed and have a step?

hoping for more good things from this bloke

[video=youtube;XLoPeX7bIzI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLoPeX7bIzI&feature=player_embedded[/video][/URL]

 

[Gnostic]

The Problem Lee (et al) with the Locking situation is that for too many years in Oz we have been selecting Locks for their mobility and general play and not their core business in the set pieces as we have done with Props. Thus we have seen a succession of backrowers used as Locks. Is it any wonder the set pieces have suffered especially the scrum but often the lineout as well have suffered.

I think we got spoiled by the skill and dynamism of Eales.

 

[Brumby Jack]

Best wishes to Ben Alexander's brother, Tom, for a quick recovery after suffering a serious injury after jamming his finger between some weights on Monday.
His biggest concern at the moment is that he won't be able to take part in a Call of Duty battle against his brother's on Playstation 3.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/local/sport/rugby-union/alexander-lops-top-off-finger/2046075.aspx

 

[Cutter]

My definition of world class is World XV material.

Sharpe isn't hard nosed. He's consistent, works hard, good in the air and is playing tighter than in the past, but he's no Brad Thorn or Bakkies Botha. Horwill has not established himself as world class. He's of international standard and we hope he improves from there.

There was always talk of Vickerman being World XV material, but when it came to the crunch games, he went missing far too often for my liking. Marseille 2007 was crying out for someone to step up and boss the collisions in a physical, confrontational, direct manner and Vickerman was on the side of the ruck with his handbag ready to slap someone. I'd take Thorn or Botha over Vickerman all day, every day.

 

[BrumbiesPolynesian]

My definition of world class is World XV material.

Sharpe isn't hard nosed. He's consistent, works hard, good in the air and is playing tighter than in the past, but he's no Brad Thorn or Bakkies Botha. Horwill has not established himself as world class. He's of international standard and we hope he improves from there.

There was always talk of Vickerman being World XV material, but when it came to the crunch games, he went missing far too often for my liking. Marseille 2007 was crying out for someone to step up and boss the collisions in a physical, confrontational, direct manner and Vickerman was on the side of the ruck with his handbag ready to slap someone. I'd take Thorn or Botha over Vickerman all day, every day.

I would have to agree...Wallabies have lacked that hard nosed edge in the middle of the pack..Horwill maybe the answer but like Vickerman, he can go missing also, but he is still young but if he wants to cement a spot in the Starting XV...he will have to bring this edge to his game, Deans loves a 2nd Rower with a Hard Edge...@ Crusaders before Brad Thorn he has a bloke called Norm Maxwell who was as hard as they come...

At this point in time, i too would pick Thorn and Botha over any Wallaby 2nd Rowers for being hard nosed..Botha steps over the mark a lot but when he is in the collision area, not many can match his physical pressence.

 

[BrumbiesPolynesian]

On another note, how about this for a starting pack for the Brumbies 1st Game

Alexander, Moore, Maafu
Chisholm, Hand
Hoiles, Salvi
Vaea
Valentine
To'omua, Giteau
Ashley Cooper
Speight, McCabe
Lealiifano

I have gone for Vaea just for raw ability and the Palu type Factor, could get a good 50-60mins out of him then revert to Hoiles to 8 and bring Chapman off the bench.
BAcks pretty much pick themselves but i have gone for Speight ahead of other wingers due to his performances in ITM cup in NZ, he is a finisher, which the Brumbies have lacked for a while and outside Ashley-Cooper they could prove to be a real handful for opposition

 

[Bruce Ross]

show me a lock that packs on the LH side of the scrum and I'll be looking at the lock that is not the hard nosed one. The exception is when you have the happy and uncommon circumstance of having two in the same second row.

Coaches usually get their strong hard bastard to pack down on the TH side to support the THP with strength and power, but often they don't have one. Playing on the TH side of the scrum does not make you a hard nosed lock; after all: Sharpie played on that side for the Force for many games in the 2010 S14, but if a young bloke comes along and immediately is chucked into packing behind the THP in the scrum, you should be excited - or a least interested. It means that the coach rates him in the strength and toughness area.

I do enjoy my very limited opportunities to take issue with you, LG.

What exactly is the correlation between "strength and power" and being a "hard nosed lock"? I suspect that coaches often choose the more experienced lock "to pack down on the TH side to support the THP". It is true that players have a tendency to become much more uncompromising as they get older. Vickerman is a prime example and even Eales was starting to show a degree of irascibility towards the end of his career; but I don't think their strength and power would have increased over the years. In fact my observation is that accumulated wear and tear usually means that senior forwards at the professional level do very limited heavy lower body strength training.

There is not much opportunity for a lock to make use of his hard man quality in the modern scrum. Things, of course, were somewhat different in our playing days.

What tight heads need and appreciate is having a lock behind them who can deliver serious grunt and is determined never to give ground. For this reason the logical selection policy is to have the stronger lock on the right hand side. Whether that player crochets in the change shed before the game is irrelevant to the task of scrummaging.

 

[Newter]

Crochet?

 

[Newter]

My definition of world class is World XV material.

Sharpe isn't hard nosed. He's consistent, works hard, good in the air and is playing tighter than in the past, but he's no Brad Thorn or Bakkies Botha. Horwill has not established himself as world class. He's of international standard and we hope he improves from there.

There was always talk of Vickerman being World XV material, but when it came to the crunch games, he went missing far too often for my liking. Marseille 2007 was crying out for someone to step up and boss the collisions in a physical, confrontational, direct manner and Vickerman was on the side of the ruck with his handbag ready to slap someone. I'd take Thorn or Botha over Vickerman all day, every day.

I think I'd pick Vickerman alongside one of those two or their like. You need a Vickerman in the team. He was a lineout master, huge on the attacking lineout and safe as houses on defensive ones. He was so good at this for the Waratahs in 2005, the Crusaders had to take constant quick throw-ins to avoid him.

 

[TOCC]

Digressing a bit, but our line outs are pretty decent at Wallaby level and Vickerman doesn't offer much around the park that we don't get from any of the other locks, so was he signing really necessary considering he may not even be conditioned enough to play in the RWC....

 

[Eyes and Ears]

On another note, how about this for a starting pack for the Brumbies 1st Game

Alexander, Moore, Maafu
Chisholm, Hand
Hoiles, Salvi
Vaea
Valentine
To'omua, Giteau
Ashley Cooper
Speight, McCabe
Lealiifano

I have gone for Vaea just for raw ability and the Palu type Factor, could get a good 50-60mins out of him then revert to Hoiles to 8 and bring Chapman off the bench.
BAcks pretty much pick themselves but i have gone for Speight ahead of other wingers due to his performances in ITM cup in NZ, he is a finisher, which the Brumbies have lacked for a while and outside Ashley-Cooper they could prove to be a real handful for opposition

Looks like a long season with a mid-table finish for the Brumbies again. Not much quality beyond Moore and AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper).