Broadcast options for Australian Rugby

[PhilClinton]

I wonder what Reds fans did with the previous NRC?

I know for me I supported both QLD teams equally except, when they played each other I favoured Country by a small amount.

If they can be seen as both being Reds teams and others support both like me then there will be a home game each week. The Reds could sell season tickets that cover both teams at once and promote the teams as the first step to being a Red.

The difference here is those teams were quite transparent as being sub-teams from the same organisation. For example there were players who played a few games for City, but ended up playing for Country later in the year because of injury crisis etc.

Im not sure you can have that type of shared organisation ownership and resource structure in the primary competition.

There are risks involved, for example look what happened in the MLR when the Gilgronis and Giltinis owner spat the dummy over one of his teams, he pulled the other out as well. Not saying anything like that will happen, but I think you need clearer lines of separation to run a proper comp.

 

[Adam84]

First of all, bring back Reds supporters to Suncorp. The attandances have been so low in the last seasons due to the poor performances. If you can't support one team properly, u can't think in a second to splid the few resources.

Waratahs is the best example that a good team with courage and passion can attract the old school supportes on board again. So first step, make Reds great again

pretty sure Reds have had larger crowds then Tahs for all but one or two games in the past 2 years, including 41k people to a Super Rugby AU grand final 14 months ago

 

[Marce]

pretty sure Reds have had larger crowds then Tahs for all but one or two games in the past 2 years, including 41k people to a Super Rugby AU grand final 14 months ago

Yes, Waratahs attedances have been so poor in recent seasons. I've been in some games in Parramatta with 4k supporters at best. But this season the attedance improved 300% and Reds attendances were poor

 

[LeCheese]

Yes, Waratahs attedances have been so poor in recent seasons. I've been in some games in Parramatta with 4k supporters at best. But this season the attedance improved 300% and Reds attendances were poor

Would love to see the data you're referencing - a 300% improvement would essentially mean Leichhardt was above capacity all season...

 

[Brumby Runner]

I wonder what Reds fans did with the previous NRC?

I know for me I supported both QLD teams equally except, when they played each other I favoured Country by a small amount.

If they can be seen as both being Reds teams and others support both like me then there will be a home game each week. The Reds could sell season tickets that cover both teams at once and promote the teams as the first step to being a Red.

As somebody above said, Red Koalas and Red Heelers.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Would love to see the data you're referencing - a 300% improvement would essentially mean Leichhardt was above capacity all season...

Leichardt lists its capacity at 20,000

I think Mr Marce is implying the Tahs were getting around 12,000 avg to their games. This would seem about right with the later in the season games being packed.

I get the push for 2nd teams in the main cities (Brisbane & Sydney) but I just do not see them being followed or atteneded at least in Sydney. Even the GWS Giants with the AFL throwing money in that pit can't get a crowd. It is the most fickle supporting city I've ever seen. I've said it before but I'm a fan of the Country teams. Previous identity that is easily followed. These areas produce a lot of players that are in the current Super Rugby system and will keep paying dividends by providing direct exposure in areas that crave events. The Super Rugby trials get good crowds and they are watching players they may have never heard of before.

Rae Rae

 

[Marce]

Would love to see the data you're referencing - a 300% improvement would essentially mean Leichhardt was above capacity all season...

I don't have the official statistics I don't want to calculate it but from 4k in Parramatta to 20k in Leichhardt Oval is a BIG step forward. Maybe 300% is exagerated but could be 100%. Are u agree with that percent?

 

[Wilson]

I don't have the official statistics I don't want to calculate it but from 4k in Parramatta to 20k in Leichhardt Oval is a BIG step forward. Maybe 300% is exagerated but could be 100%. Are u agree with that percent?

The tahs never got close to 20,000. Their largest crowd at Leichhardt was 14,651.

 

[Adam84]

For a 2nd Queensland team i dont think Logan is an option at all, no facilities and lack of corporate support, they dont have any QPR teams and no real schools even playing Rubgy in the region. At least Ipswich has Ipswich Grammar and St Edmunds, and loosely you could group Downlands and Toowoomba Grammar into the catchment as well.

I think an Ipswich based team which also played a game or two a year in Toowoomba would be the best option, although not really a great one given the lack of facilities. Labor committed $20million to upgrade Ipswich Reserve, the home ground of the Ipswich Jets, but will still be well short of a professional sporting field.

If rugby were advantageous, they could press Springfield Corp and Ipswich City Council for funding like Brisbane Lions did, their new facility at Springfield is pretty spectacular.

 

[LeCheese]

I don't have the official statistics I don't want to calculate it but from 4k in Parramatta to 20k in Leichhardt Oval is a BIG step forward. Maybe 300% is exagerated but could be 100%. Are u agree with that percent?

Different venues with different locations, accessibility, and attributes - the Tahs did a decent job at luring some fans back, all I'm saying is that it isn't the only factor at play. Even then, the official figure for the Blues game (which I believe was the most attended) was 14k, so we're not looking at capacity, and they were only getting about half that early in the season. From my recollection of the Reds games, the lowest attendance was ~11k on a Friday night when it was pissing down.

But yeah, there's no question that to get crowds back we need strong competition and good footy across the board - which would ultimately be the goal of a revised comp format.

On another note, it would be handy if crowd figures were published somewhere consistently.

 

[hoggy]

It's complicated cause the number one nation ATM have 4 professional teams. If you destroy Super Rugby and start from 0, is gonna be a loooong way to be a power nation again. Not many countries in the world has an own professional competition. There are: England, France, New Zealand, South Africa and that's all. Then you have Tier 1 nations without a professional domestic competition like Ireland, Wales, Scotland, Australia and Argentina.

It's a worldwide problem, and maybe for a satured sport market like the Australian, this is the way to go.

The thing is that saturated market has shown a clear prefernce for supporting genuine domestic leagues, the lack of preofessioanl rugby sporting leagues are primarily a thowback from the amateur days.

It is a complicated issue, but the game here should have pushed for a domestic league 20 years ago, it is now paying a hefty price for not doing so.
The reality is those domestic leagues are only going to get stronger and more powerful over time, ignoring that just ultimately means the Wallabies will eventually become a cheap mans Harlem Globetrotters for hire.

The biggest market that will ever be available to rugby in Australia is its own domestic market.

 

[Wilson]

On another note, it would be handy if crowd figures were published somewhere consistently.

Austadiums does a good job collating them, but it does rely on the team/venue actually publishing the numbers.

 

[Marce]

The tahs never got close to 20,000. Their largest crowd at Leichhardt was 14,651.

That's right. From 4k to 15k is a BIG step forward yet. Isn't it?

 

[LeCheese]

Austadiums does a good job collating them, but it does rely on the team/venue actually publishing the numbers.

Yeah that's where I was grabbing the info from, and unfortunately only a handful of games across the season for each stadium have been reported

 

[Marce]

From my recollection of the Reds games, the lowest attendance was ~11k on a Friday night when it was pissing down.

Yes but Reds is the most popular Super Rugby franchise in Australia. Brisbane is a less competitive market than Sydney. You have to compete hand by hand to Broncos for getting supporters. Waratahs have to compete against 9 NRL clubs

 

[Wilson]

That's right. From 4k to 15k is a BIG step forward yet. Isn't it?

Sure, but that's comparing the lowest crowd of the previous season with the highest crowd of this season and it's only a step up to where the Reds are at, not anything above and beyond them.

As a comparison to 2021 the tahs highest crowd was around 7.5k. All the ~4k crowds they had were under covid restricted capacity.

 

[dru]

As somebody above said, Red Koalas and Red Heelers.

Along with ACT Vikings and ACT Foals

 

[Marce]

Sure, but that's comparing the lowest crowd of the previous season with the highest crowd of this season and it's only a step up to where the Reds are at, not anything above and beyond them.

As a comparison to 2021 the tahs highest crowd was around 7.5k. All the ~4k crowds they had were under covid restricted capacity.

But 7,5k was the hightest attedance in those seasons. If you compare the highest attendances from 7,5k to 15k is 100% of improvement

 

[LeCheese]

Yes but Reds is the most popular Super Rugby franchise in Australia. Brisbane is a less competitive market than Sydney. You have to compete hand by hand to Broncos for getting supporters. Waratahs have to compete against 9 NRL clubs

Sydney has ~2.5x population of Brisbane - with Brisbane (and surrounds) soon to have 3 NRL teams (Broncos, Titans, Dolphins), along with a number who have allegiances to the Cowboys and interstate teams. It's a far more competitive environment than you're suggesting.

 

[Adam84]

But 7,5k was the hightest attedance in those seasons. If you compare the highest attendances from 7,5k to 15k is 100% of improvement

No one is denying they improved. And it’s great they did. Your original claim was Reds crowds were low the last couple of season and that they should take a note out of the Waratahs book.