Bledisloe #2 - AUS v NZL, Eden Park, Auckland, August 15th

[drewprint]

My team for Saturday:-

1.Sio
2.Moore
3.Kepu
4.Horwill
5.Mumm
6.Fardy
7.Hooper
8.Pocock
9.Phippps
10.To'omua
11.AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
12.Giteau
13.Kuridrani
14.Speight
15.Folau

16.TPN
17.Slipper
18.Holmes
19.Skelton
20.McCalman
21.White
22.Cooper
23.Mitchell

This would be my team too. Ideally I'd have Lilo in for Cooper on the bench too, but he'll be over in the World XV.

 

[Groucho]

I assume you mean Naholo? Broke his leg v Argentina & won't play again this year.

Bloody hell, that's a shame. I mean that seriously. A great emerging talent that we need in the RWC. Good for New Zealand's opposition.

 

[p.Tah]

Continual beatings by the ABs has me fearing the inevitable. They'll come out fired up and smack us.
I hope I'm wrong and I live in hope. Good luck boys.

 

[Ash]

Hahah!

Has someone changed the forum code to prevent Slim irritating the shit out of everyone with his ellipses?

It was done years and years ago for that reason.

 

[Slim 293]

It sure was.........

 

[BDA]

Really cant see us winning this game. From Saturday's game I think its clear that the team has come a long way under Cheika and they appear to have closed the gap on NZ since last year. Still I don't think we've progressed far enough to beat New Zealand at Eden Park, where they'll have a massive home ground advantage.

Hell if the Wallabies did win on Saturday you'd have to say they are categorical favourites to take a World Cup victory. pre world cup victories over Argentina, South Africa and 2 against New Zealand, including Eden Park - youre talking about England 2003 type results.

I think we can really test them on the weekend, but I expect we'll come up short. A close loss certainly wouldn't be the end of the world. to be honest ill be okay as long as the guys makes us proud.

hopefully we do meet again for a third time this year on neutral ground.

 

[Brumby Runner]

It's difficult to select Speight for this game considering it's all on the line and he has no recent rugby behind him and hasn't excelled in his two tests last year.

I think AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Mitchell will probably keep their spots and on that basis, it could be hard to select Speight for the RWC squad ahead of Tomane. Mitchell's kicking will only become more useful against the likes of England at the RWC.

Speight's injuries last year and suspension this year couldn't have come at worse times.

Are you sure that Horne's suspension and injuries haven't been ata similarly bad time for him? How many tests has Rob played this year and how many Joe? Seems to have been pretty similar to me, but I could be wrong.

Edit : I have perhaps again misread your post. Certainly, Rob has played at least one test more than Henry Speight, though I do think his time out recently has been just as awkward as Henry's.

 

[qwerty51]

Hell if the Wallabies did win on Saturday you'd have to say they are categorical favourites to take a World Cup victory. pre world cup victories over Argentina, South Africa and 2 against New Zealand, including Eden Park - youre talking about England 2003 type results.

If we beat them in consecutive Tests in 2 weeks, both full strength squads, at Eden Park, to win the Bledisloe that's bigger than a RWC victory for me - harder too.

I just desperately want a competitive performance.

 

[Bairdy]

Even though it is tantalizing to make changes to the lineup, Cheiks need to stick with the same team (barring any injury enforced changes). Provide an opportunity for the guys who didn't play so well (who have been highlighted ad nauseum) to rectify their mistakes in the pressure-cooker of an AB Eden Park test.

I'm sure the coaches are emphasizing that drastic improvements are required: in the lineout, in the scrum, in our defence (especially in the wider channels), in our goal-kicking et al. The ABs will lift their physicality and tjhe pace at which they play at as they did last year, so the Wallabies will need to be prepared to at least match it.

With that being said, ABs by 30.

 

[Groucho]

Even though it is tantalizing to make changes to the lineup, Cheiks need to stick with the same team (barring any injury enforced changes). Provide an opportunity for the guys who didn't play so well (who have been highlighted ad nauseum) to rectify their mistakes in the pressure-cooker of an AB Eden Park test.

I'm sure the coaches are emphasizing that drastic improvements are required: in the lineout, in the scrum, in our defence (especially in the wider channels), in our goal-kicking et al. The ABs will lift their physicality and tjhe pace at which they play at as they did last year, so the Wallabies will need to be prepared to at least match it.

With that being said, ABs by 30.

Way to go, mister positive. There's never a shortage of fans bravely predicting a Wallaby drubbing against the ABs. On this occasion, you may be disappointed. Slight (rather than drastic) improvements are required. Wobs by 5.

 

[Joe Blow]

Any criticism of Kuridrani is way off in my opinion. He was solid, fronted in defense and also hit a lot of rucks in the mid field giving us ascendancy before the big boys arrived.
His problem was that he was coming from so deep that he was a marked man as soon as he got the ball. This freed up some space for Folau to go for a few trots.
You would have to think that Steve Larkham is pushing the To'omua at 10 option. It just shortens the time the NZs have to get their alignment correct and asks a lot more questions of them as well as shoring up our defense.

I also disagree with the idea of trotting out the same side. NZ will be preparing for that now. Cheika is building a squad of 30-35 players where there are several keys positions that can be covered by at least 2 people that bring something different to the table. I am thinking he will change it up a bit this week to keep the Kiwis on their toes.

I would include To'omua at 10 and Speight in place of Mitchell on the wing.
Mitchell and Foley would be on the bench with Beale dropping out.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Woodcock.

Spent almost every single scrum angling in massively, trying to con Barnes into pinging Kepu, but for once (and I suspect this is Ledesma's experience coming to the fore) our tighthead planted his feet and used the shoulder that Horwill had firmly planted on his arse, to rotate his upper body outwards and drive straight through the AB scrum, rather than getting shoved sideways and then pulled to the ground by Woodcock, which usually always ended up being a penalty against us...........

Yeah that's how it looked to my former-outside-back eyes, too, but most of the criticism from back home seems to be directed at Franks. May have something to do with 90% of the NZ rugby media residing in & being cheerleaders for D'Auckland

 

[jollyswagman]

If we beat them in consecutive Tests in 2 weeks, both full strength squads, at Eden Park, to win the Bledisloe that's bigger than a RWC victory for me - harder too.

I just desperately want a competitive performance.

Couldn't agree more........especially considering there is always a chance that either side may end up as RWC champions without meeting one another throughout the tournament.

 

[jollyswagman]

Even though it is tantalizing to make changes to the lineup, Cheiks need to stick with the same team (barring any injury enforced changes). Provide an opportunity for the guys who didn't play so well (who have been highlighted ad nauseum) to rectify their mistakes in the pressure-cooker of an AB Eden Park test.

This would go against everything that Cheika has done to create the uber-competitive environment within the squad. Finally we have a squad with great depth across the park and have enjoyed three good wins with varying combinations. I see no reason why he couldn't tinker with a couple of positions and expect an improvement.

I would prefer him to make some changes rather than not as I think it is way too early to be indicating that he has a starting side nailed down. We will see a couple of changes this week, run a B-Team in Chicago before heading to the UK without letting the opposition know what we are holding in our hand. If he runs the same side this weekend then it sends a pretty clear message to all up north that this is our best team so analyze away. Cheika is far too cunning of an operator to do this in my opinion.

 

[Dan54]

Perhaps I need to bow to all you fellas, as you seem to be pretty expert on scrums etc, but I always look a little at second row when props get angled out. Not sure if it has changed much since I played ,but we second rowers were always called locks (in NZ anyway) and one of reasons was one of our jobs was to lock the scrum, to help prevent props being turned out. The odd time I played in front row I was always told to put as much pressure as I could on inside shoulder of opposite prop, to try and turn him, then his lock has to help hold him straight. Not saying this is problem, as I said I bow to superior knowledge to mine, but I just wonder if it is clear cut as we all think.

 

[jollyswagman]

Perhaps I need to bow to all you fellas, as you seem to be pretty expert on scrums etc, but I always look a little at second row when props get angled out. Not sure if it has changed much since I played ,but we second rowers were always called locks (in NZ anyway) and one of reasons was one of our jobs was to lock the scrum, to help prevent props being turned out. The odd time I played in front row I was always told to put as much pressure as I could on inside shoulder of opposite prop, to try and turn him, then his lock has to help hold him straight. Not saying this is problem, as I said I bow to superior knowledge to mine, but I just wonder if it is clear cut as we all think.

I get what you are saying Dan but all of that would be dependent on whether the prop in question was intentionally angling in or not. It may be worth looking at 6 & 7 at the same time to see who they are binding on to. McCaw is the master of sliding up the side of his prop before angling in and under the opposition tighthead. He will start by binding onto the shoulder of the lock but as soon as the pressure comes through he will shift his bind onto the loosie, slide up to the loosie's shoulder and both will drive in on the hooker.That all said, the locks are going to be able to support the props through the hips but not through the shoulders.

Is McCaw doing this to assist the prop in angling in or simply to try and shield the props angles from the ref?


(Image from last match)

 

[pjm]

Having an arm through the legs of your prop isn't going to keep him straight by itself. It's just a power game where if they hit a specific area and you don't have the power to hold against it they're just going to go straight through.

I went and looked at that scrum jolly and I don't think McCaw did it intentionally. Sio got under the AB THP and drove him up which caused an upward angle in his body and then McCaw just slipped straight up. That's also the reason why the locks are so high in that picture as well.

 

[Pfitzy]

McCaw slides up all the fucking time so he can interfere with the opposition flanker and slow his run at the ball carrier. He should be penalised - right there in that shot - for not being properly bound to his second rower.

 

[Joe Blow]

I get what you are saying Dan but all of that would be dependent on whether the prop in question was intentionally angling in or not. It may be worth looking at 6 & 7 at the same time to see who they are binding on to. McCaw is the master of sliding up the side of his prop before angling in and under the opposition tighthead. He will start by binding onto the shoulder of the lock but as soon as the pressure comes through he will shift his bind onto the loosie, slide up to the loosie's shoulder and both will drive in on the hooker.That all said, the locks are going to be able to support the props through the hips but not through the shoulders.

Is McCaw doing this to assist the prop in angling in or simply to try and shield the props angles from the ref?


(Image from last match)

View attachment 6759

Looks like McAWE has slid up to the front row to give them a hand.
It's not as though he is on the blind side from the ref either.

Did he get pinged?

 

[No4918]

Savea also looked like a passenger. Call me a one-eyed Cantab but I'd restore Dagg to 15 for the get-us-the-fuck-outa-here clearance option he provides, move "paper cut" back to 14 & bring Piutau in at 11.

From an Aus perspective i do hope they make this change. Dagg is not the player he was and M-S got a double, his second took heaps of work and i personally had no problem with it being awarded. Also would be banking on Savea bot having 2 quiet games. The problems for the AB were the 10-12. Get those right and stick with the wing combo from game 1.

Hang on, got off track - please bring Dagg in, and other Crusaders you feel will help while you are at it.