Australian Schoolboys and National Championships 2011

[Knuckles]

Every kid playing in Gold today was one of us, regardless of their parentage or genetic origin, - end of story.

Last time I looked they were all Australians.

Awesome performance and a portent to when the "grown ups" play each other next week.

For me the big differenc ein the kiwis was the 10 just did not take it to the line. The 15 who ran so well in support on Tuesday night just held back or ran outside the 13 instead. The 10 was very quiet compared to his performance on Tuesday.

Best on the field in my opinion was Wessels. He annoyed the you know what out of the kiwi 9 all game. The Kiwi 8 was also slow in delivery off the back of the scrum and that allowed Wessels and also the Aussie 12, Stewart to get up and shut down attack.
Cornerstone of the Aussie game was how they lifted their defence in 2nd half and really started smacking the Kiwis backwards.
I doubt Browning will play for Australia in Test match...but I tell you what. He'd be the first player I'd pick in my side.....
Turning point of the match = 15 minutes to go down the scoreboard side of the field, the kiwi 13 had a two man overlap, held the ball and Baldwin turned it over. A couple of pick of goes later and the Aussie 10 who came on for Debrczeni scored after finding a hole on his own pick and go. Form that moment on, the kiw d just didnt mark up and the Aussie D began to dominate the contact.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

[
As a side note, I noticed that all 6 boys in the front row for AUS are of PI heritage which in itself is not a bad thing but are caucasion boys of this body type not up to it or are they playing other sports (where does the next Stan Pilecki come from?)

[/QUOTE]

Poland?

 

[kiwi playing in Oz]

[
As a side note, I noticed that all 6 boys in the front row for AUS are of PI heritage which in itself is not a bad thing but are caucasion boys of this body type not up to it or are they playing other sports (where does the next Stan Pilecki come from?)

[/QUOTE]

"if they toured would they be able to get an Aus passport"

OMG are you ignorant or just uneducated? Congrats to the winning team which it appears the six PI boys played a big role. These boys may have been born in Oz and call themselves Australian with PI descent so get over it mate. Caucasion kids aren't in the front six of the team obviously because they weren't good enough! Your thoughts are actually embarrassing mate!

 

[Lee Grant]

Oz Schools 26 – NZ Schools 19

I never expected that score line. I said above that if Oz won this game it would be a magnificent turnaround – and it was. The Schools coaches are to be congratulated for what they have done since the England U/18 game; also the lads for being coachable and making a good game plan work.

Oz had the possession and territory in the first 5 minutes without any points and then NZ started doing their thing. They kicked a couple of penalties and, bugger, when Oz had a good period of play the visitors got an intercept try. Before you knew it, the score was 13-3 to the Kiwis and I thought: here we go again.

Oz Schools weren't helping themselves: the ball was kicked away too much, several lineouts were lost, tackles weren't dominant, goal kicking was abominable, and offside discipline was poor. But gradually Oz started to look the better team and just before oranges they stormed into the NZ 22 and scored a good try to skipper Browning. Inevitably the easy conversion missed but at 13-8 down Oz was looking a chance at the break.

Oz was the better team after oranges and were good value for an 18 points to 6 difference in the 2nd half. NZ didn't play as well as against Oz A even taking into account the level of opposition. Only 8 of their starters from Tuesday night ran on yesterday and they didn't work as well together. You could see it most in the backs. They hogged the ball instead of passing it and passed it when the shouldn't have, or too early or too late, or to nobody who could catch it.

The big difference in the two teams was the Oz pack. They just threw themselves at Kiwi ball carriers all day and then got up off the floor in time to do it again, and again. When it was their turn with the ball they gave better than they got. 3 well earned tries to one intercept try was a good measure of how the forwards played.

The score flattered the Kiwis in the end. Take away the Kiwis intercept try and add on say, 10 points for easy goal kicks missed and it would have been a real bum smacking – on paper.

I said above that based on the 3 games of Oz and Oz A Schools I had seen this year that 2011 wasn't a great vintage for Oz School rugby players. A few more games like that would change my opinion. I still don't think they would have been good enough yesterday to beat England Schools because all the Pom players are connected to a Premiership Academy and they were at another level of rugby training, and strength and conditioning, than either ANZAC team.

All the same: it would have been good to see them play that one again.
.

 

[Lee Grant]

Anyone got a teamlist?

Because you're a friend of mine - here it is. I have also written some comments against some of the players.

1 Pattowa Paraka (Q1) – his side of the scrum was OK the whole game and he was like another backrower sometimes.
2 Maile Ngauamo (Q1)
3 Alan Ala'alatoa (N1) – had trouble against NZ 1. Walsh, who is a top scrummager.

4 Curtis Browning (Q1) – When I first saw this lad when he was 15 I knew he would go a long way and now I'm even more convinced 2 years later. At the schoolboy level he is like a Schalk Burger playing in the 2nd row, yet yesterday he had the skill to take two restarts above his head like Eales. Great leg drive in the tackle and has a backrower's alertness on defence. Watch out for him as a senior, playing 8.

5 Michael Wells (N1) - Played well around the edges as a backstop and linker, but this influential skills no.8 is wasted in the 2nd row.

6 Will Miller (CS)
7 Mark Baldwin (CS)
8 Sean McMahon (Q1)

The backrow was a wonderful unit with a high and effective work rate on attack and defence and played with intelligence. Energiser Bunny Miller dropped a couple of pills but that was about the only negative because he was a real on-baller as they say in another code and had a nose for the tackle. Probably he will be too small to go far as a senior player but we should be seeing more of the bigger Baldwin who also played well. McMahon was everywhere and backed up for a smart try. Will be too small to play 8 as a senior.

9 Waldo Wessels (N1) - passed well and had a wonderful game and was my MOTM though I hear that Miller got it. He bothered the NZ scrummie the whole game around the scrum and even nabbed the no.8 a couple of times. A complete pain in the arse for the Kiwis and I love that trait in Oz players at any level.

10 Jack Debreczeni (N1) - Had an ordinary game including kicking too much pill away and missing easy goal kicks – but he made up for it with one moment of vision. With nothing on he threw a long pass out to Mosese who had room for a bit of a run and just when you thought he would be bundled out he dropped the ball inside for Stewart to pick up and score.

11 Isaiah Mosese (WA) – Had never seen this Rebels EPS player before. He didn't get the ball much but he has superb footwork at speed and contributed to Oz School's 2nd try.

12 Jim Stewart (N1)
13 Alan Faalavau (Vic)

The midfield combined better than the individuals did last year and they kept knocking Kiwi backs over like the forwards did closer in. The 95 kg Stewart has potential as a professional player - is back at school next year.

14 Alex Northam (N1)

15 Cameron Clark (NSW) - Unlike dad these days, he's a lightweight lad with matchstick legs. Got a big cheer from his local Knox crowd when he got the ball for the first Oz run of the day and every time thereafter. Dodged a few folks and unlike a lot of schools fullbacks showed he knows how to pass the ball accurately, except when he had the mortification to throw the intercept pass.

Replacements
Everybody got a run and the replacements did a great job as a unit. I have listed the positions they played when they came on but some switched around.

16 (1) Feleti Kaituu (Q1)
17 (2) Fa’atausili Lafaitele (Q2)
18 (3) Feao Fotuaika (Q1)
19 (?) Tom Staniforth (ACT)
20 (6) Manasa Rokusuka (N1) – Usually a lock he showed versatility at 6 and was hard to stop in a couple of runs.
21 (9) Scott Malolua (Q1)
22 (13) Andrew Robinson (ACT)
23 (10) Jake McIntyre (CS) - looked better than the player he replaced. Like Rorke and Robinson, he will be back at school next year; so watch this space.

[CS indicates the player was in the Combined States team in the Oz Schools tournament, N1 = NSW Ones (etc), others what state or territory.Clark did not play in the tournament because he was injured.

Edit: 19. Staniforth replaced Rorke who was named in the original team.]

 

[Lee Grant]

How did Tom Staniforth go?

He played for Oz A Schools on Tues. night, not yesterday for the main team. He went OK on Tuesday and was part of an improved lineout, but it was hard to shine in a team that struggled with most aspects of rugby, especially in the tough stuff.

 

[pirate]

some keep there options open so they can play u 20s for pi nations

 

[qwerty51]

Cheers LG, never disappoint.

 

[Empire]

He played for Oz A Schools on Tues. night, not yesterday for the main team. He went OK on Tuesday and was part of an improved lineout, but it was hard to shine in a team that struggled with most aspects of rugby, especially in the tough stuff.

I was under the impression that he was brought into the top team for the game:

http://brumbies.com.au/News/Article/tabid/1213/ArticleID/4685/Default.aspx

 

[Done that]

An interesting comment from an Aus. official earlier in the week , was that this was one of the weakest teams for a number of years.
Draw your own conclusions.

 

[skip]

is that an official working with the team or one not involved in the coaching

 

[spectator]

What an outstanding result! Everything I've been reading on this forum, by way of comment and results, suggested that the NZ boys were going to smack OZ schools. Magnificent effort, the boys and coaches are to be commended.

 

[Lee Grant]

I was under the impression that [Staniforth] was brought into the top team for the game:

http://brumbies.com.au/News/Article/tabid/1213/ArticleID/4685/Default.aspx

My apologies if I am wrong Empire, as I may be.

It's possible that one of the reserves named in the program was injured and wasn't available to play and Tom was called in. He certainly didn't start, as I know all the starting players by sight.

By doing a forensic examination of the reserves he could only have been in the 19 jersey because all the others were a different body shape except 20. Rokosuka, who looks a lot different to Tom. 19 was listed as Harry Rorke, and the player came on just a few minutes before the end of the game. I didn't even get a chance to see where he played. That could have been Tom.

Anybody notice who 19. was, or could at least say it wasn't Rorke?

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

Harry Rorke was ruled out of the team on the Thursday before due to an injury sustained at the camp. Tom Staniforth was bought in, and as the announcer at teh game stated, he is the nephew or cousin of Scott Staniforth

 

[Lee Grant]

Harry Rorke was ruled out of the team on the Thursday before due to an injury sustained at the camp. Tom Staniforth was bought in, and as the announcer at teh game stated, he is the nephew or cousin of Scott Staniforth

Thanks Iluv - I missed the announcement.
Sorry Empire, I was wrong.

 

[Lee Grant]

An interesting comment from an Aus. official earlier in the week , was that this was one of the weakest teams for a number of years.
Draw your own conclusions.

I thought it was a poor vintage also going by the 3 games of Oz A and Oz Schools up to the game on Saturday.

In hindsight, judging by the Oz Schools v NZ Schools as an annual standard:

- My whingeing that the England U/18 team was physically and rugby wise ahead of Oz Schools because they had advantages that our lads (and even our U/19 lads) did not have, was spot on. Therefore our schoolboys did not have a chance from the start - and they should not have a chance the next time either.

- The Oz A team was below par this year apart from an encouraging 2nd half against the England dirt trackers. They had more trouble against the Kiwi dirt trackers than against the slower game of the England version.

- The Kiwi starting team seemed inferior to the mid-week team even taking into account the sterling performance of the main Oz side.

- The main Oz Schools side should be judged by their performance against NZ Schools, not against the Poms.

The best of our lads will get up the the Poms level of strength and conditioning as professional players; so we should not be slashing our wrists on that account.

What we need to do though is to get raise our level of coaching of junior players. Some of the lads I have seen in the two Oz Schools teams this year are behind the level of the Poms and Kiwis in technique for their positions and also in general rugby nous. Even the losing NZ side on Saturday was capable of drawing upon ingrained habits of what to do next, especially in the forwards.

That will have to change somehow otherwise we will see what we saw in the RWC QF yesterday: having to overcome technical deficiencies with pride and passion on defence.

Often times that is not enough.
.

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

In my opinion players that will kick on in senior (u20's) rugby are

Curtis Browning, Michael Wells, Waldo Wessels, Jim Stewart (even though he still has another year of school to come) and from the injured players Tom Cusack, Rhys Dombkins and Brogan Roods

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

I agree with your sentiments lee and until we have a more professional setup with coaching our juniors (16-18) and involve them with senior clubs the better they will be. The training that the ARU does is good but you need these players playing together on a more regular basis to help their overall development

Lets not forget that the English u18's that toured here not only have connections to professional sides in England but they play for those clubs in a high grade competition and most were playing their 8th or 9th international this year

 

[light]

Iluvmy, you forgot Chris F'Sautia in the injured players. Heard earlier in the year that Tasi was going to NRL to play with the Roosters, will be interesting to see if he comes back later, was very good what I saw of him

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Roods has to change his name...I keep reaching for the medical dictionary when I hear or see it